DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
algorythmically beating yer customers up
United Airlines violently drag passenger off overbooked flight
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DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
Imagine putting this logic on a taxi. I can't guarantee enough fares will turn up to cover my costs so I'll quadruple book the same route and hour. Should customers turn up and the cabs full, well, I'll just have to bang one of them spark out
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
It's alright tho, 'cause they got algorithms. Done by PhDs and everything!
gosub
~#
Lol! Never had you down as a frother!
These are some of the biggest companies on the planet who spend billions researching their industry practices. They don't blow their noses without getting analysts and PhDs involved. To suggest that they are somehow "winging" their ticketing is beyond ludicrous. Overbooking works. Get over it!
Don't be daft. This is one case in scores of thousands (bump-offs) that went badly wrong. Stop pretending it's common.
On your wider point, the airline industry isn't going anywhere. It's way too important. It'll change, probably increasing fares, but all that means is that only wealthy people will fly. Fortunately it won't happen in our lifetimes, and whilst people in the UK are able to fly across Europe and back for the price of a night down the pub, they will.
This wasn't an overbooked flight. In this instance their finely tuned algorithm thought there would be no shows and they'd have space for essential crew positioning, they didn't and shit hit the fan, or rather a shit hit a paying passenger, repeatedly.
Overbooking algorithms are how to make as much gravy as possible out a trip, if you need to factor them in to make the airline work - you are doing it wrong.
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
That might describe air travel in the 50s or maybe the 60s - at least in North America.
There were discount airlines in the Seventies, including Western Airlines, Southwest, Alaska Airlines, etc. Internationally, Icelandic was always known for cheaper flights.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Yes. It fucked up in this case, and the subsequent actions of the people involved in removing the fella were fucking nuts. But it's one incident in 600 million US domestic flights per year.
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
It's only "wasted" if one is completely unwilling to account for unexpected circumstances, and insists on wringing out the tiniest dribble of profit from each and every journey. If they'd had a policy of keeping a small amount of seats free - a mere three in this case - then a dude wouldn't have gotten his teeth knocked out.
They're fucking winging it because their oh-so-smart algorithms don't seem to be able to account for the tiny discrepancies that inevitably come with acting within the real world - as opposed to some idealised mathematical model.
gosub
~#
Its only 'wasted' space if they have given enough notice of cancelation to be refunded. Otherwise space was paid for, that it was not filled just lowered the DOC's, but still more profit.
I had an airline get narky with me over a flight I'd didn't use...once. Fucking accountants.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Except they do.
gosub
~#
Thats what happens when companies get too big
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
I think the guy who got their lights punched out would beg to differ.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Happens all the time doesn't it?
Oh wait ...
What other 1 in 600 million occurrences would you consider usual or indicative of an entire industry?
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NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
I know that it doesn't happen all the time. I just don't think that makes it alright. Also, there is also no chance whatsoever that such incidents could ever become more common as airline companies cling to outdated business models due to bureaucratic inertia and contractors chasing profits instead of service. No airline will ever go bust. Because they've got algorithms and PhDs.
That is precisely what an overbooking policy is doing.
Your suggested algorithm, "keep three seats free", would indeed have prevented this craziness, but it would be a waste of the airline's most precious resource, seat space. Flights where say 10 passengers do not turn up would then travel with 13 empty seats.
It's just not possible to perfectly predict how many passengers will or will not turn up for a flight every time. As you note, it's a gamble. In this case (simplifying to overbooking, in fact it was a 'deadheading' situation) the result was not the right one, however the problem really was pretty clear not in the algorithms, it was that by the time the customer is boarded and sat in his chair, it's too late to 'deny them boarding'.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
It's not alright but in the grand scheme of things it's largely irrelevant. It'll give you anti-corporate/airline industry types stiffies and something to post about for a while, but it's so vanishingly unlikely to happen again that it'll be business as usual in a week or two.
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1927
Funnier than he thinks he is.
I thought the latest was that it wasn't a case of mistaken Identity!
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
I suppose they run on fairy dust then, and the CEO's ride to work on unicorns.
spring-peeper
Well-Known Member
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
It's a misleading cliché that's been bandied around for years and disregards the fact that the industry provides direct and indirect livelihoods for many millions of people.
Some airlines are sometimes profitable, others sometimes aren't. This is worth a read.
Some airlines are sometimes profitable, others sometimes aren't. This is worth a read.
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8den
No I'm pretty sure that was 8ball...
As if United's week couldn't get any worse
United now Hell’s official airline after scorpion stings passenger mid-flight
United now Hell’s official airline after scorpion stings passenger mid-flight
1927
Funnier than he thinks he is.
I mean add up all the profits ever made and deduct all the losses ever made and the industry has never made money, ever!
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
When calculating net profit, the losses get deducted.
United Airlines Reports Third-Quarter 2016 Performance
United Airlines Announces Full-Year 2015 Profit
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
A standard balance sheet:
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
Standard profit and loss statement:
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
Extraordinary expenses etc., will be included on the notes to the balance sheet:
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