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Libya - civil unrest & now NATO involvement

My money is on Bengazi forming columns to march on tripoli.

Its rather a long way away, and there are likely fears about being attacked from the air, or of leaving Benghazi not strongly defended enough.

There are still plenty of gaps in our knowledge, but it sounds like the armed contingent on both sides has been pretty small really by almost any standard. This may yet turn out to be inaccurate, but as various reports that have been coming in for days about various groups matching on Tripoli seem to have amounted to nothing that we know of, and the media are now coming to the conclusion that the worst fears about scale of attacks from the air have proven false, Im inclined to think that some of my criticisms about the picture twitter was painting were reasonable.

The good news of recent days has been that the people appear to have managed to hold off regime attempts to retake certain locations in the west. That and the multiple defections, along with signs that the will of the people in Tripoli to protest has not been utterly crushed by the violence. There are some unconfirmed reports that some of the military defections may have come undone though, although Im not sure how much this means considering the relative lack of pro-regime military muscle that has actually been on show. Saif was making thinly veiled threats today along the lines that they had been holding their forces back so far, and the only way to know if there is even a shred of truth to this claim is to wait and see if the regime pulls something out of its hat on the ground. I find it quite hard to believe that if they actually had more military capability, they would not have already used it to try to take back the western locations that have fallen. Maybe they only have enough capability to keep Tripoli just within their grip, and to launch very limited attacks on a couple of western locations.

There is a video that has appeared recently that is supposedly showing a statement from Libyan navy switching sides. But as I cant speak arabic I cant confirm what they are saying.

Todays propaganda show seems like a very strange thing, completely out of sync with events. It may be that this was Saifs preferred strategy all along, but his ideas didnt win the argument within the regime during the first phase, with someone else favouring a massive show of force. After that strategy failed he has been given the chance to try it his way, but its too late to win back international support so his efforts seem doomed to fail. Either that or they are simply playing for time, time to escape or to try to get some new capability for violence somehow. One of the defectors that has turned up in Egypt was rumoured to have been trying to whip up support from certain tribes, or find more mercenaries from abroad, but he failed and so sought asylum in Egypt instead.
 
And when I speak of the twitter picture, its broadly got the overall picture right, but the volume has often been wrong, adjust it down a bit and the info has been good all things considered. The Benghazi battle over the barracks seems to have been pretty accurate, once the premature reports of it falling are taken out of the equation. I even saw today pictures of the bulldozer that was used to attack the perimeter wall, which was mentioned long ago on twitter. And in another news story a car packed with tnt being driven into the main gate was mentioned, which would tally with another of the reports from this battle. I havent had time to tripple-check but it does sound like the number of deaths in Benghazi was in the range of several hundred rather than the several thousand that was feared at one point? I havent found out what actually happened to the airport runways in the region though, these were reported to have been bulldozed by protesters numerous times during the battles in the east, while other stories suggested they were bombed by the regime to stop others using them. Are they destroyed or still intact I wonder.
 
He is one of the reporters invited by the Regime. Any reports he's giving on uprising footage is not what he witnessed himself.
 
Lots them did accept it few years back -anyone got the Monitor Group list? Was it mentioned already?

I hadnt heard of it till you mentioned it. Is it this stuff?

http://libya-nclo.com/DocinEnglish/tabid/598/language/en-US/Default.aspx

I've not tried to read it all yet, but Document 3 has a variety of names in it. How hilariously excessive these sales-pitches are, gotta love this bit "On the basis of total circulation reach of these 250 media outlets (particularly the broadcast audiences of the BBC across multiple geographies) it is estimated that as many as 6 billion unique individuals would have had access to the coverage of the event."
 
I hadnt heard of it till you mentioned it. Is it this stuff?

http://libya-nclo.com/DocinEnglish/tabid/598/language/en-US/Default.aspx

I've not tried to read it all yet, but Document 3 has a variety of names in it. How hilariously excessive these sales-pitches are, gotta love this bit "On the basis of total circulation reach of these 250 media outlets (particularly the broadcast audiences of the BBC across multiple geographies) it is estimated that as many as 6 billion unique individuals would have had access to the coverage of the event."


20 billion people watched the world cup -what's wrong with that?
 
So basically it was a bunch of prominent neo-conservatives and third way gimp Anthony Giddens.

And influential people, influential money movers, influential networkers, influential media people, influential academics.

They all were paid to do this basically

During the course of the project a second important goal was introduced by the client. This goal is to introduce Muammar Qadhafi as a thinker and intellectual, independent of his more widely-known and very public persona as the Leader of the Revolution in Libya.
 
During the course of the project a second important goal was introduced by the client. This goal is to introduce Muammar Qadhafi as a thinker and intellectual, independent of his more widely-known and very public persona as the Leader of the Revolution in Libya.

I fear any progress they made in that department may have been undone recently.
 
Think they only namedropped Soros, and Frost went once but didnt get his interview with Gaddafi. And lots of the influential people/academics were of the neo-cons variety.

But yes, its the usual shit we have come to expect in this era, the usual suspects. Thought leaders lol.

My eyebrows became especially animated when reading the section on Nicholas Negroponte

Nicholas Negroponte briefed his brother and other senior officials in the White House upon his return from Libya.

Negroponte made a number of visits to Libya following his first visit when he met with Qadhafi in Sebha (16-18 August 2006). Negroponte drew attention to Libya in the international press with an article in Fortune3 that covered Libya’s participation in the OLPC project. Following Negroponte’s meeting with Qadhafi, Libya was added to the list of pilot countries for the OLPC project, replacing Egypt. On October 31st, 2007 Intel and Microsoft announced that Libya’s Ministry of Education had agreed to buy 150,000 laptops for children in Libya.
 
You see the giddens tennis one :D

Yeah, 'we've not actually managed to get Soros to visit Libya, but he does play tennis with Giddens, and they discussed Libya a number of times, honest, even if it was just in regard to the similarities between the temperaments of John McEnrow and Gaddafi'
 
Seeing that fuck David Frums name, Im almost surprised Michael Gove isnt listed there too. I'll never forget that channel 4 program during the buildup to the Iraq war where those two were making the case for war. Hopefully I recorded it onto dvd because it seems to have gone down the memory hole.
 
A lot of cleaning up and a lot of press being suddenly granted access... a lot of supposedly left wing Libyan websites being compromised by state agents -

"don't believe half of what you see, and none of what you hear" - Lou Reed
 
@ elbows and butchers:

I found this article the other day re lobbying:

Among Libya's lobbyists

..... One of the more unlikely figures to have advised a firm which has worked to burnish Libya's image and grow its economy is not registered with the Justice Department. Prominent neoconservative Richard Perle, the former Reagan-era Defense Department official and George W. Bush-era chairman of the Defense Policy Board, traveled to Libya twice in 2006 to meet with Qadhafi, and afterward briefed Vice President Dick Cheney on his visits, according to documents released by a Libyan opposition group in 2009....
 
I found the cunts email address and wrote him an email about that: http://www.globalvisionmagazine.com/team.html

Media in Libya: A Booming Enterprise

As the rest of the African continent struggles to define civil freedom, specifically that of the press, Libyan media leads the way as a source of knowledge and entertainment for the continent. M-Albosifi, chairman of the Management Committee of the General Press Authority, recently described in detail the freedoms and opportunities in print media in Libya.
 
invited by the Gadaffis for a 3 day jolly, CNN and Sky turned it down... would have got them a 40 day visa though

I see that BBC have now made themselves useful idiots for the dying regime. They are inserting Saif al-Islam Muammar Al-Gaddafi quotes into their radio news bulletins unchallenged even though he is talking complete shit.
 
I have mostly given up on the BBC re. Libya and I'm just using Twitter, AJE Live Blog and Guardian Live Blog (the latter two sourcing from twitter extensively). In Egypt most of the halfway decent mainstream reporters tweeted stuff before they even filed footage or stories and most important stories seemed to be following up on and confirming previous tweets. The downside is the volume & repetition, finding out who the reliable tweeters are (mostly by trail-and-error), an (understandable) vagueness about exact locations/times/sources/names. Happily in Egypt and Libya I am not that concerned about getting a "one-sided" version (ie everything from anti-Gadafi sources) but in more complex conflicts with multiple rival groups this could make things far more problematic. Also after the last few weeks I expect all sorts of regimes around the world are already making plans of how to shut down, sabotage, flood, discredit or other use and abuse twitter and you-tube for their own purposes, so maybe we should start getting ahead of the curve re. online activists in various countries, rather than wait until things actually kick off.
 
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