NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
Come on, man. Don't you know that the best way of getting a body of people to do something you want, is to threaten to damage the stuff belonging to a completely different body of people?
Just Stop Oil
- Thread starter cybershot
- Start date
Come on, man. Don't you know that the best way of getting a body of people to do something you want, is to threaten to damage the stuff belonging to a completely different body of people?
platinumsage
HaveMyPassword123
Cease your sarky comments immediately or I'll eat tomorrow's advent calendar chocolate.
MickiQ
In My Defence I was left Unsupervised
A man who means businessCease your sarky comments immediately or I'll eat tomorrow's advent calendar chocolate.
Boris Sprinkler
Dont be scared
Where is energy use for computers etc?
This tower of babel we have in our pockets. All of us with Multiple browser tabs. Every account for every useless app. Pinging back and forth packets of data. Pointlessly.
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
I always find it weird how the question of energy keeps on circling back to the habits of ordinary individuals. Neoliberal propaganda seems to be surprisingly effective at getting people to forget that tackling climate change is a systemic problem requiring systemic solutions. You can see it in the threads on this very forum about keeping warm, there are people who actually feel guilty about not wanting to be cold and miserable. Our ingrained desire to be conscientious is being weaponised against us in the class war.
Boris Sprinkler
Dont be scared
i've done 20 years in business IT. its a genuine concern. not a case of doing enough recycling.
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
The genuine concern should be around how the energy is generated in the first place. Energy costs money, so industries will always be looking to reduce said costs by increasing efficiency, regardless of climate change. But no matter how many improvements in efficiency we make, regardless how many times we get lectured by the rich and powerful for having the gall to be online or go out and have fun (while they of course swan around in their fancy cars and private planes between their multiple homes which they keep nice and warm), it will be all for naught if we don't drastically reduce our combustion of fossil fuels. Governments and corporations control the majority of the world's wealth and resources, so it is only fitting that the majority of the responsibility should rest upon their shoulders.
But unfortunately, there seems to be this equivocation between reducing carbon emissions and "reducing consumption", AKA ostensibly ecologically-motivated austerity. Sure, reducing consumption across the board will reduce carbon emissions. There's an alluring logic about the proposition. But said logic is based on the fundamentally false premise that the problem is with ordinary people using energy, rather than stubborn recalcitrance on the part of those who own the means by which it generated.
Boris Sprinkler
Dont be scared
I don’t see the rich and powerful telling us off for being on line. We are being conditioned for it.
I’m asking (in a confusing roundabout way) where is IT / data centers featuring in that chart?
I’m asking (in a confusing roundabout way) where is IT / data centers featuring in that chart?
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
I reckon it would be under "Commercial" or "Other industry", depending. But either one of those are subsidiary to the biggest chunk of that chart by a long chalk, the one labelled "Energy" and numbered at 73%. If I'm reading the chart right, then that means that nearly three-quarters of all anthropogenic carbon emissions are being produced by electricity generation. I'm assuming that all those data centres and servers powering the internet are mostly running on grid power, so if we were to deal with the question of how we generate the electricity to supply said grid, then that would render the question largely moot.
Worrying about people using the internet when 73% of total carbon emissions come from electrical generation seems a little... well, misplaced to put it mildly.
Boris Sprinkler
Dont be scared
I'm not worrying about people using the internet. I said it's omission was strange. Almost like you dont need to worry about that. 
platinumsage
HaveMyPassword123
The German equivalent are a right laugh:
Rob Ray
Weight is meaningless
Surprisingly balanced article from the FT today:
archive.ph
Can Just Stop Oil make the case for protest? | Financial Times
archived 9 Dec 2022 15:41:55 UTC
ska invita
back on the other side
I thought this bit was interesting:Surprisingly balanced article from the FT today:
Can Just Stop Oil make the case for protest? | Financial Times
archived 9 Dec 2022 15:41:55 UTC
"The House of Commons did organise a citizens’ assembly in 2020(opens a new window). A group of 108 people heard expert evidence, then deliberated on how the UK should reach net zero. They came down in favour of policies such as a ban on gas boilers and a frequent-flyer tax that increased the more often people flew. They rejected the use of fossil fuels with carbon capture and storage (the technology proposed by the government for the new Cumbrian coal mine). It showed that when citizens pause to think about climate, they are more radical than their politicians. But the assembly’s conclusions were ignored."
platinumsage
HaveMyPassword123
No shit, because they aren’t accountable for any of the negative or unintended consequences of their decisions, and don’t actually have to implement them or persuade anyone to agree with them. It’s why citizens assemblies are a shit idea.
Brainaddict
slight system overdrive
They are at least as accountable as politicians, in that they have to back into society and defend what they've done. Half the time politicians are very isolated from the consequences of their actions and socially move in circles where no-one will be rude to them about their many, many failures, because it's all one big failure club where everyone's getting rich from failing. Your attempts to defend the status quo are rather desperate.
ska invita
back on the other side
above all i thought it was interesting that a citizens panel even took place, and what its finding were - very reasonable
BristolEcho
Well-Known Member
British Museum have said they may drop BP sponsorship.
www.theguardian.com
Doubt Osbourne can be trusted mind.
Is the writing on the wall for the British Museum’s BP deal?
Chair of the museum, George Osborne, says it no longer wants to be a ‘destination for climate protest’
Doubt Osbourne can be trusted mind.
Boris Sprinkler
Dont be scared
No Ed. You do. By your own privileged entitled cognitive dissonance.
what are you on about?
Boris Sprinkler
Dont be scared
You deserve to be run over.
Boris Sprinkler
Dont be scared
So you can declare cars aren’t harmful whatsoever.
Cheers mate - still no idea what you’re on about…
Boris Sprinkler
Dont be scared
It was my response to this.
Do you know what it is?
Boris Sprinkler
Dont be scared
Is this a trick question?
No - it’s a junction in Edinburgh where drivers ignore the fact they can’t go down there. So people are blocking it to make them obey the law yet drivers seem to like to try and run them over. It’s almost like a lot of drivers are just selfish twats.
Boris Sprinkler
Dont be scared
i was misreading your post. Sorry.
teqniq
DisMembered
Not massively surprised even though they reported (from the article) a quarterly profit of almost $20 billion (£17.3 billion) in October. and their financial officer is reported to have said the tax would cost the company "over $2 billion". You'd think based on the above figure that they could afford it.
Energy giant ExxonMobil sues EU to block energy windfall tax
The US company says the levy on its profits will discourage future investment in Europe.
www.bbc.com
ska invita
back on the other side
Incredible result, especially so as the judge told the jury to find them guilty, plus the usual defence in such cases is to prevent a greater harm (climate change) and the judge deliberately blocked them from saying this.
Unanimous not guilty
insulatebritain.com
Unanimous not guilty
BREAKING: FOUR INSULATE BRITAIN SUPPORTERS VINDICATED AFTER JURY RETURNS UNANIMOUS NOT GUILTY VERDICT - Insulate Britain
Four Insulate Britain supporters were found not guilty of causing a public nuisance by a Crown Court jury today in the fourth jury trial relating to Insulate Britain’s campaign of nonviolent civil resistance last year undertaken to demand the UK government insulates Britain’s cold and leaky...
insulatebritain.com
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