Julie Burchill forced to apologise for twitter comments , and pay out a fat wedge .

[killer b]

The person who serves homebrewed wine at a dinner party is akin to the person who goes to the toilet when it's their round in the pub.

 

[two sheds]

Not had elderflower wine but I've made elderflower champagne and elderflower cordial and they were fucking lovely

 

[killer b]

I'm sure your guests agreed with you (while you were still in the room)

 

[two sheds]

Didn't give it to anyone who came round kept it to myself

Have you ever had elderflower champagne?

 

[killer b]

Didn't give it to anyone who came round kept it to myself

You did the right thing.

 

[killer b]

(I have drunk elderflower champagne, and all other manner of homebrewed boozes over the years. I've always nodded very politely about how delicious it was, before either forcing it down or pouring it into a nearby houseplant)

 

[two sheds]

seems very bourgeois sort of criticism to me - very middle class dinner party pass the napkins

Was it kosher veuve cliquot by the way?

 

[littlebabyjesus]

These are clearly different kinds of parties from any I've ever been invited to. Taking two bottles of expensive champagne is nice - certainly beats turning up with a bottle of Blossom Hill - but in itself it strikes me as a bit ostentatious. I wouldn't complain and I would certainly drink it ahead of my home-brew, but it shouldn't win you special privileges.

 

[killer b]

It's just very difficult to make homebrew which is much better than rough sweet stuff that gets you hammered. And people who brew it, IME, are often blind to this issue and think they're making something of rare distinction and subtlety. I've yet to find any exception to this rule (and indeed won't now, as I have been blessed with not having to drink anyone's homebrew at all in almost 8 years)

 

[killer b]

turning up with a bottle of Blossom Hill

this is also terrible manners.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I have a mate who makes very decent IPA. I'll drink it ahead of the stuff I've taken happily. I think you're on safer ground with beer and cider, but yeah it always has a home-brew edge to it.

 

[two sheds]

I first had elderflower champagne 45 years ago and I still remember it as being lovely - was the reason I started doing it myself.

Perhaps the rabbi was too polite to point out that the bourgeois champagne wasn't kosher, and didn't want to give it to their adoptive-jewish guest either to avoid leading her astray.

 

[Knotted]

Did not know wine/champagne might not be kosher.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

And I've learned something. I had no idea there was such a thing as non-kosher champagne.

 

[two sheds]

(neither do I but it's a good line of argument)

and

there is kosher champagne so I'd imagine there is non-kosher champagne

 

[littlebabyjesus]

According to this site, pretty much all wine is likely to be non-kosher unless it's been specifically made kosher. It's about who handles it rather than what's in it. Magical thinking, basically.

Interpretations vary to some extent, but to qualify as ‘kosher’ in most cases, only practising Jewish workers can handle the wine in the cellar, from crushing grapes to tasting and bottling.

Winemakers also need to be extra careful when sourcing yeasts, additives and fining agents, to make sure they are kosher, too.

Once a bottle of wine has been opened, it could cease to be kosher if handled by anyone not observant of the Sabbath.

It isn’t generally considered necessary to have the wine blessed by a rabbi, but some certification bodies may require a rabbi to supervise the production process.

What is kosher wine? A brief guide - Decanter

 

[spitfire]

The whole grape/kosher thing is tricky, when the rabbi visited our kitchen he asked us if we ever intended to use wine in our products. I said no. He said, that's good, it's complicated, I forget why. (eta lbj has th einfo above).

I had a quick google and couldn't see much about Veuve being kosher, usually would have the logo on the label if so. In the UK it looks like this. (Other kosher organisations are available).




If it was kosher then it would say so on Ocado. It doesn't.

https://www.ocado.com/products/veuve-clicquot-yellow-label-magnum-champagne-nv-66285011

 

[two sheds]

fine jewish friend she is

 

[Knotted]

She's in it for the religion and nationalism not the traditions. She wasn't to know, bless her.

 

[spitfire]

According to this site, pretty much all wine is likely to be non-kosher unless it's been specifically made kosher. It's about who handles it rather than what's in it. Magical thinking, basically.



What is kosher wine? A brief guide - Decanter

Yeah that's it. Weirdly when making food we didn't have to be Jewish or kosher. Must be something special about the grape in the Torah.

And Julie Burchill can fuck off. She's horrible, always has been, used to hate her columns in the NME.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

fine jewish friend she is

tbf if you don't drink non-kosher wine, you really need to tell your guests beforehand.

This dinner party was an etiquette minefield.

 

[spitfire]

tbf if you don't drink non-kosher wine, you really need to tell your guests beforehand.

This dinner party was an etiquette minefield.

She's a Rabbi! lol.

 

[Knotted]

She's a Rabbi! lol.

And Burchill was trying to convert to judaism.

 

[two sheds]

tbf if you don't drink non-kosher wine, you really need to tell your guests beforehand.

This dinner party was an etiquette minefield.

If I were to be a guest at a rabbi's I'd make sure that anything I took would be kosher. Anything less would be just boorish. Let alone not mentioning it at the time but complaining about it to a wide audience afterwards.

 

[spitfire]

And Burchill was trying to convert to judaism.

Zactly!

 

[littlebabyjesus]

If I were to be a guest at a rabbi's I'd make sure that anything I took would be kosher. Anything less would be just boorish. Let alone not mentioning it at the time but complaining about it to a wide audience afterwards.

If a rabbi invites me to dinner, they are likely to know I'm not Jewish, and ought to know that I'm unlikely to be well informed about what's kosher or not beyond the basics. Good manners in that instance would be: 'Don't bring booze - we'll sort you out.' Otherwise, I'd be taking along a nice bottle of red, cos that's what I do when I visit people's houses.

 

[two sheds]

If a rabbi invites me to dinner, they are likely to know I'm not Jewish, and ought to know that I'm unlikely to be well informed about what's kosher or not beyond the basics. Good manners in that instance would be: 'Don't bring booze - we'll sort you out.' Otherwise, I'd be taking along a nice bottle of red, cos that's what I do when I visit people's houses.

So if you weren't vegetarian and they knew you weren't a vegetarian but you went round to their place for dinner you'd take a couple of sausage rolls and then complain to the twitterati when they weren't served up?

 

[spitfire]

If a rabbi invites me to dinner, they are likely to know I'm not Jewish, and ought to know that I'm unlikely to be well informed about what's kosher or not beyond the basics. Good manners in that instance would be: 'Don't bring booze - we'll sort you out.' Otherwise, I'd be taking along a nice bottle of red, cos that's what I do when I visit people's houses.

That's fair, but as a student of Judaism Burchill should have had half a clue. I knew and I've only spent an hour in the company of a Rabbi, total.

 

[bimble]

Pleasantly surprised by the unexpected levels of weirdness reached here .

 

[hitmouse]

Does everyone know about how the MD in MD20/20 stands for Mogen David? I'd recommend youse all stock up on that to avoid causing offence next time you go over to the Rabbi's house, I remember the blue raspberry favour being particularly exquisite.