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Immigration .. part of neo liberalism/Thatcherism??

exosculate said:
In the forlorn hope of saving you
:D :D you must be joking. You cannot be serious. You think you're apolitical insults will draw me closer to the true revolutionaries?:D :D you are more deluded than I thought.

despite your sectarianism, the door is always open, to work together upon that which we agree. Fraternally yours, ResistanceMP3;)
 
ResistanceMP3 said:
:D :D you must be joking. You cannot be serious. You think you're apolitical insults will draw me closer to the true revolutionaries?:D :D you are more deluded than I thought.

despite your sectarianism, the door is always open, to work together upon that which we agree. Fraternally yours, ResistanceMP3;)


As mad as a hatstand.
 
exosculate said:
As mad as a hatstand.
a hatstand cannot suffer from mental illness, so I would say your analogy is roughly correct. :)


edited to add: I have just gone back through your last dozen contributions, which one of them would you suggest is less apolitical than a hatstand? It seems to me they were Seven parts abuse, three parts cheer leading Mr Baldwin and Dur. :D
 
ResistanceMP3 said:
a hatstand cannot suffer from mental illness, so I would say your analogy is roughly correct. :)


edited to add: I have just gone back through your last dozen contributions, which one of them would you suggest is less apolitical than a hatstand? It seems to me they were Seven parts abuse, three parts cheer leading Mr Baldwin and Dur. :D

Are you crazed obsessive stalker too.
 
durruti02 said:
Ok Cockney Rebel did a runner from me on the MCB thread so lets carry on here

it is obvious to all but that left that the immigration of the last few years is an intregal part of neo liberalism/Thatcherism .. i.e. that the project to destroy the unions and cut wages thru privatisation etc etc could not have been acheived without this new wave of immigration ... show me how this is not true ..

and p.s. i work regularly with agency workers ( we have had agencies from rumania/congo/ghana/spain/lithuania and probably more where i work lately) who have replaced once full time jobs .. the union is weak .. i treat them as fellow workers .. but i can still see the function of immigration ..


Yes, immigration serves a number of purposes to capitalism.

(1) Migrants will accept lower pay therby pressuring wages downwards.

(2) Migrants less likely to be in/join a trade union.

(3) Illegal migrants can be paid below minimum wage and exploited.

(4) Illegal migrants cannot join a trade union.

(5) Racial tensions stoke division in the working class and resulting increase in support for right wing/far right parties.

(6) Agency employment is less secure and carries less benefits than full time work and proper jobs.

All this makes a mockery of the wealthy middle class SWP entering white working class areas screeching "racists" and "lumpen-scum", whilst waving placards declaring that "Asylum seekers are welcome here".
 
John Grean said:
All this makes a mockery of the wealthy middle class SWP entering white working class areas screeching "racists" and "lumpen-scum", whilst waving placards declaring that "Asylum seekers are welcome here".


Thats nail on head - they have an absolute disconnection with reality.
 
I think if they carry on doing that, they will get more than they bargained for!

Originally Posted by John Grean
All this makes a mockery of the wealthy middle class SWP entering white working class areas screeching "racists" and "lumpen-scum", whilst waving placards declaring that "Asylum seekers are welcome here".
 
Sighthill in the aftermath of the murder of Firsat Dag

The SSP had to sit on them quite severely to stop them destroying all the good work that we had done there in both the indigenous population and aslyum seeker community.
 
q_w_e_r_t_y said:
Sighthill in the aftermath of the murder of Firsat Dag

The SSP had to sit on them quite severely to stop them destroying all the good work that we had done there in both the indigenous population and aslyum seeker community.
people were screeching "racists" and "lumpen-scum", whilst waving placards declaring that "Asylum seekers are welcome here"?
http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/article.php?article_id=4248

Correction: last week's report on the attack on Iranian refugee Masood Gomroki in Sighthill, Glasgow, stated that it was "likely" that the assault on Masood would lead to a sharpening of racial tensions in the community. It should have read that, as a consequence of the good work done between asylum seekers and refugees in Sighthill over the last 16 months, an increase in tensions was unlikely. http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/article.php?article_id=4225
 
tbaldwin said:
One thing about this thread durrutti,It has shown how little confidence the Orthodox Left really have on the issue. Once upon a time they would have called people like us Racists but they seem to have given that up as a bad idea.

Absolutely. The aforementioned Gate Gourmet incident, amongst others, may have made a lot of people think on that issue. It certainly did for me. I used to be for open borders and the 'free' movement of Labour but a lot has happened in the recent past, that actually made me think about the issue seriously and realise my naviety.

For the all talk of what Marx said on migration earlier, is there not also a part of the Communist manifesto that talks about workers dealing with the ruling class in their own country first?. Doesn't that indirectly say something about economic migration?. It's been a hard one to accept, given my parents were economic migrants and I've been lucky enough to probably have a better standard of living because of it but I can't say I agree with it anymore.
 
The same goes for me, i used to love the idea of the 'global citizen' and all it entailed for the end of the nation state ultimatately it maybe feasible and may occur, but it is much much more complex then just easy left slogans.


It certainly did for me. I used to be for open borders and the 'free' movement of Labour but a lot has happened in the recent past, that actually made me think about the issue seriously and realise my naviety.
 
John Grean said:
Yes, immigration serves a number of purposes to capitalism.

(1) Migrants will accept lower pay therby pressuring wages downwards.

(2) Migrants less likely to be in/join a trade union.

(3) Illegal migrants can be paid below minimum wage and exploited.

(4) Illegal migrants cannot join a trade union.

(5) Racial tensions stoke division in the working class and resulting increase in support for right wing/far right parties.

(6) Agency employment is less secure and carries less benefits than full time work and proper jobs.QUOTE]

i only just noticed this of course obvioulsy JG was a racist and was just trolling :rolleyes: (and clearlly i am too :rolleyes: ) but can anyone disagree with this and how it benefits capitalism
 
It should have read that, as a consequence of the good work done between asylum seekers and refugees in Sighthill over the last 16 months, an increase in tensions was unlikely. http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/article.php?article_id=4225

And that good work was despite the SWP. The SWP had just recently (at the time..) joined the then SSP. They tried the usual tactic of ignoring the wishes of the rest of the SSP in their propaganda approach - luckily they were bought back in line by the rest of the SSP.

I could talk about locally -Southwark - loads of then SA placards (read SWP students imposing thier version of the SA over the local members) turn up on a demonstration against the NF marching with 'asylum seekers welcome here banners'. Weirdly not even the NF had raised asylum seekers!! - talk about having the sensitivity of single celled plant life. I'm sure the asylum seekers left behind when the SWP placard wavers had gone home felt much more comfortable
 
Lots of Durrutti's 'chickens' are coming home to roost, as it were...

aren't they just. His daft claims are falling apart at a quicker rates of knots than normal.

(or did you not really know what 'chickens coming home to roost' actually means?)
 
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