Hundreds of women assaulted in German NYE celebrations

[Pickman's model]

ye. Because he only managed to offer 2 options. No trinaries here just 2 choices.

jesus, mary and joseph

 

[J Ed]

Has anyone got a credible link that details the volunteer policewoman attack? I've seen it referenced, but can't find the source.

My strong impression from the initial accounts (e.g. the initial BBC story) was that the cops simply didn't react to what was going on as anything more than some petty crime, and only later told stories suggesting that they wanted to act but couldn't when

Chaos and Violence: How New Year's Eve in Cologne Has Changed Germany - SPIEGEL ONLINE

Wohlfahrt first heard reports of sexual assaults over his police radio. He also heard that a female colleague had become a victim of violence. She had been together with two other officers dressed in civilian clothes in order to track down pickpockets and petty thieves when she was surrounded and indecently touched while others tried to steal her bag. From a police report, Wohlfahrt later learned that, because of the "complexity of the situation as a whole," the "deployment of uniformed officers" to protect the policewoman "had not been possible."

 

[bimble]

jesus, mary and joseph

Cane and Able, beans or cheese; Either you like refugees or you like women. You choose. It's a totally free choice, just choose one or the other.

 

[Pickman's model]

Cane and Able, beans or cheese; Either you like refugees or you like women. You choose. It's a totally free choice, unless you wanna be called a racist.

go on then.

 

[treelover]

Not sure about 'muslim' but lets just say the 300 + victims in their testimony said that it wasn't a gang of blond Germans who attacked them.
But yes, the conspiracy of well-meaning silence seems to be a very big part of the problem.

"The attackers were among around 1,000 people, mostly men, gathered at Cologne’s central station who broke into smaller groups to grope and rob women. Police have said they are now looking into more than 500 crimes, AFP reported."

500 complaints now.

 

[bimble]

go on then.

beans! Actually, I want both. Lots of both please, and butter.

 

[treelover]

I find nothing to disagree with here. Point is. I find the outrage from the right hilariously hypocritical as they are normally the most "sceptical" and unsupportive of feminist issues. They really don't care about the women here.

And the general left and establishment are so afraid of being called out as racist that they happily push women under the bus.

Women lose no matter what side of the political spectrum you are coming from.

Again.

I'm fucking fuming about it. ALL of them can go fuck themselves far as I'm concerned.

balanced post, Mrs Fabric

 

[stethoscope]

balanced post, Mrs Fabric

Oh piss off.

 

[Casually Red]

I get the impression from the sequence of events that the cops didn't really see a big problem, just a bit of petty crime in their minds, until social media made it clear that a lot of women had been sexually assaulted and robbed and they started feeling the media heat.

Then as cops do (cf Rochdale) very likely started making shit up about being scared of being called racists (as if) to excuse their lack of action.

That's certainly not what their leaked police report written immediately afterwards said . It said the exact opposite . The report makes clear the events were "indescribable " and unprecedented in the writers 30 years of service . Quite emotional language is used in places . That report was officially buried . Not just by the police chief but by the politicians who received it .
So plainly the cops knew from the outset how serious it was, one of their own plain clothes officers was molested and they couldn't get to her .

What strikes me as more likely is given who the mayor is, and how intransigent she is , and how stupid she is, is that they feared if they went in heavy the liberals would be up in arms about poor migrants being slaughtered by the police on new years eve . And they'd be crucified by the liberals .
Nothing surer there'd have been a thread on here wailing about German cops beating up refugees .

 

[treelover]

Oh piss off.

Why should I, i am saying its a balanced post, wish there were more like them

 

[FabricLiveBaby!]

Cane and Able, beans or cheese; Either you like refugees or you like women. You choose. It's a totally free choice, unless you wanna be called a racist.

Do you know what's hilarious: I was tweeting about this today and and some anti-theist dude came into my mentions complaining about me not having a go at Islam enough because I'm a feminist and should wake the fuck up about how evil Islam is. Then when I told him that Islam is not a monolith and that the attackers came from a very specific part of the world with it's own specific set of issues and political problems that has contributed to this kind of problem as well as the fact that assault in Europe hasn't exactly been taken seriously he called me a racist and feminazi.

Go figure.

 

[sovereignb]

Sentenced to 2 years or over. It happens all the time now - especially if they are from a country where the situation has improved since refugee status was granted. Syria and Burma are the only two problem countries at the moment - although there are many other countries where you cannot really claim asylum from, but you cannot be forcibly removed to - Iran, Zimbabwe, Palestine. People with a Deportation Order against them from those countries are in a sort of limbo - they cannot work, claim benefits, use the NHS for free (theoretically) or even drive in this country - the idea to make it so hard for them they fuck off back to their country.

Quite possible i guess. The Home Office are trying really hard to deport back to Cameroon a young man i was working with up until Dec. He has been since he was 4 years old. Yet a guy from Morrocco who has been here for 3 years and has NEVER put in an asylum claim was released from prison twice (for robbery and drugs charges) back into our care. Completely baffling and frustrating, as well as the BIB above. Even more baffling is that we never seemed to get any minors from Syria or Burma, countries we are more than aware there are current problems.

Soz to derail and all folk

 

[bimble]

Oh piss off.

Yeah, piss off with your niceness and reasonableness.*

*I don't really mean that, please stay and do more

 

[Bernie Gunther]

That's certainly not what their leaked police report written immediately afterwards said . It said the exact opposite . The report makes clear the events were "indescribable " and unprecedented in the writers 30 years of service . Quite emotional language is used in places . That report was officially buried . Not just by the police chief but by the politicians who received it .
So plainly the cops knew from the outset how serious it was, one of their own plain clothes officers was molested and they couldn't get to her .

What strikes me as more likely is given who the mayor is, and how intransigent she is , and how stupid she is, is that they feared if they went in heavy the liberals would be up in arms about poor migrants being slaughtered by the police on new years eve . And they'd be crucified by the liberals .
Nothing surer there'd have been a thread on here wailing about German cops beating up refugees .

Well yes, but you may recall hearing how Ian Tomlinson was killed by a hail of bottles thrown by anarchists.

It's interesting to hear the police account, but ...

... one would have to be very trusting of cops to uncritically accept it without significant corroboration.

 

[stethoscope]

Yeah, piss off with your niceness and reasonableness.

It's all one day the left is on the up… next day its in dire straits… the SWP are saying this… lots of comments on this article now… blah blah blah.

 

[DotCommunist]

Your post amounts to " nothing to see here, there's no crisis, move along "

this is exactly it. You are with the right but not of the right when bringing down the broad brush, or you are complicit in the crimes because you cowardly refuse to address them. Or if you do, you suggest that the 'dere culture' shit isn't helpful and that makes you complicit. Always peddled by the same old shites in any situation.

 

[Pickman's model]

Why should I, i am saying its a balanced post, wish there were more like them

how boring urban would be

 

[treelover]

Well yes, but you may recall hearing how Ian Tomlinson was killed by a hail of bottles thrown by anarchists.

It's interesting to hear the police account, but ...

... one would have to be very trusting of cops to uncritically accept it without significant corroboration.

The media is now reporting that the story of a suspect ripping up his asylum papers and saying he will get a new one, may not be true as they are plastic cards not papers, police reports may be doctored and thats atrocious, but i am still baffled why liberals, radicals and much of the left are so keen to deconstruct the nature of the events in Germany and beyond. Maybe this guy didn't do that, but what is certain is that a certain democraphic on one night, possibly co-ordinated, sexually abused and robbed hundreds of women, I just don't understand this equivocation.

 

[treelover]

It's all one day the left is on the up… next day its in dire straits… the SWP are saying this… lots of comments on this article now… blah blah blah.

Don't like it, put me on ignore, its a free country/board, well sort of, etc.

and why shouldn't I post on this important story, bog off.

 

[sovereignb]

This is what makes me feel so despairing, what you've just said. The complete inability to talk about it without being "a racist". I don't understand how we got to this, and I studied anthropology at Goldsmiths FFS, although admittedly before "intersectionality" was everything.

Why should you feel despair? Anyone labelling discussions about the matter to be "rascist" clearly doesnt know what rascism is.

 

[Casually Red]

Well yes, but you may recall hearing how Ian Tomlinson was killed by a hail of bottles thrown by anarchists.

It's interesting to hear the police account, but ...

... one would have to be very trusting of cops to uncritically accept it.

That police account and the victims accounts tally pretty much . I see no discrepancy .

I think your still in a bit of denial about this .

To make this very simple ask yourself what the reaction of the mayor of cologne would have been had they forcibly arrested all those migrants . Or simply used heavy handed tactics against them .Ask yourself what Frau merkels reaction would have been to her political position being badly undermined, either by arrests or shrieks of mass police brutality against so many migrants . And mass arrests . Ask yourself what the lefts reaction would have been to the sight of hundreds of migrants being battoned and pepper sprayed and hauled off in handcuffs. We know full well the reaction.

My view is police inaction..even at the expense of one of their own being sexually assaulted..is directly linked to their fear of embarrassing the German establishment and angering German liberals and leftists. Which is the exact same reason why the German media buried this as well . Politics and politicians . Women were thrown under the bus for political expediency. By the cops, media and the political forces who created this scenario in the first place

 

[ViolentPanda]

surely more likely there were three men coordinating the gangs of pickpockets/thieves... the abuse (though horrific) is probably secondary to the aim of stealing for them

I'm not sure we can make that assumption. The abuse may, for example, have been the primary mechanism for intimidating the women to make it easier to steal from them.

I doubt this was any form of 'terror attack' or a coordinated mass groping of women - if there was any coordination then it was surely for the purpose of stealing from vulnerably drunk people and the sexual assaults happened during the process of relieveing people of their posessions

Again, you're making assumptions.

 

[FabricLiveBaby!]

The media is now reporting that the story of a suspect ripping up his asylum papers and saying he will get a new one, may not be true as they are plastic cards not papers, police reports may be doctored and thats atrocious, but i am still baffled why liberals, radicals and much of the left are so keen to deconstruct the nature of the events in Germany and beyond. Maybe this guy didn't do that, but what is certain is that a certain democraphic on one night, possibly co-ordinated, sexually abused and robbed hundreds of women, I just don't understand this equivocation.

Why are all possible solutions to this problem so fucking awful? Every pragmatic solution to this issue is just horrible. Every possible outcome is just horrendous. Fuck people.

(yup, still fucking angry)

 

[Bernie Gunther]

The police accounts and the victim accounts don't actually tally all that well.

They both agree that the assaults were happening, the victims whose accounts I've read mostly didn't think the cops were doing much to help.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I keep wondering about this. Lots of cities in Europe were expecting some kind of attack over the Christmas period. ISIS clearly have quite a few followers in these major cities. What a great way to turn Western countries against the people fleeing the region and force them back into the arms of the Caliphate. It is starting to look like these events were organized, not just coincidental.

Social disruption is a well-established tactic, and has been for hundreds of years. There's no reason that daesh wouldn't use it, and as you note, it serves two powerful purposes for them.

 

[Pickman's model]

Well yes, but you may recall hearing how Ian Tomlinson was killed by a hail of bottles thrown by anarchists.

It's interesting to hear the police account, but ...

... one would have to be very trusting of cops to uncritically accept it without significant corroboration.

don't recall that ever said about it tho cops said police treatment of him hindeted by bottles being thrown at cops treating him. do you have a source?

 

[frogwoman]

I can't see a good outcome to this at all. I think its similar to what bernie gunther said, people only seeing one cause and shouting at people who see a slightly different cause to these events.

 

[redsquirrel]

I just don't understand this equivocation.

Still refusing to name the posters on this thread that are doing moral somersaults?

For all that I found your silly hobby horses (nailed by stethoscope above) infuriating I thought that your heart was in the right place. But on this thread you've behaved like an absolute twat. Making weaselly insinuations against posters but refusing to back them up.

 

[bimble]

It's all one day the left is on the up… next day its in dire straits… the SWP are saying this… lots of comments on this article now… blah blah blah.

What are you saying, that we should all log off this website and make ourselves something to eat ?

 

[ViolentPanda]

This is what makes me feel so despairing, what you've just said. The complete inability to talk about it without being "a racist". I don't understand how we got to this, and I studied anthropology at Goldsmiths FFS, although admittedly before "intersectionality" was everything.

There isn't an "inability" to talk about it without being a racist.
What there is, is the hegemony of a commentariat who will self-interestedly label such debate as "racist" for their reasons.
Those reasons are, as always, centred around the perpetuation of a middle class, middle-brow, liberalistic gloss to actual events, regardless of "real-world" causes and effects.