Hundreds of women assaulted in German NYE celebrations

[treelover]

I'm an anti-feminist and I believe men and women should be treated as equals in law and society. (I do consider myself a 'humanist' in that sense) But modern 'feminism' isn't about that any more, it's mostly white upper middle-class brats complaining about not being given enough privileges. They don't care about women who really are oppressed (you know, like in almost any Muslim country), they rather imagine 'sexism' in toys, movies and video games. Because that's easy. To help the actually oppressed women they would have to get off of their tumblr and do something, but then they couldn't be comfy playing victims of some 'patriarchy' fairy tale. So you see, being anti-feminist and being against women being raped is absolutely not mutually exclusive. And now shush, back to your tumblr.

from CIF

 

[campanula]

Has there been any male on male violence, robbery, assault? Is this a specifically orientated at targeting women? What exactly are the crime statistics here...because I am finding it very hard indeed to consider this in any light other than a massive patriarchal imbalance...and I am not at all inclined to put up with so much as a single misjudged comment, let alone the fear of rape or robbery by marauding men of ANY fucking nationality, culture or religion. Scum. Time to carry Mace around again. I tossed my useless rape alarm over 20 years ago but am certainly not going to 'adopt a code of behaviour' to avoid being molested.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

were they tossers only because they told you off for doing it?

It did suppress my ability to also spread my legs which irritated somewhat.

 

[treelover]

The guardian picks aren't representative of the comments. Most of the contributors are saying the same things we are (well, what most of us are saying).

I meant its revealing what the moderator decided was a G/P.

 

[Casually Red]

what happened to Kitty genovese is probably the most famous example, but a complete lack of response from bystanders isn't exactly uncommon

I'd disagree there was no response and I'd even disagree with the description of by standers. They deliberately blocked police , they're accomplices and therefore participants in my view .

 

[mk12]

I meant its revealing what the moderator decided was a G/P.

I thought the same when I saw it earlier. Some comments have hundreds of recommends. When I checked earlier, one of the 'picks' had 11.

(It is the first Guardian article I've read in ages, and it quickly reminded me why I deleted the app!).

 

[treelover]

Only someone who doesn't really understand history would refer to "recurring historical patterns".

Despite the oft-repeated phrase, history doesn't repeat itself.

For some people, including some popular (and no-so-popular) historians, it is always convenient to use hindsight to pick out superficially similar examples and construct a narrative that links them together, but it is poor history to do so. Events are always of a particular time and place, and arise from a wider context. Those contexts are always different.

What we have seen in Germany is a nasty series of petty crimes and assaults or varying degrees of seriousness that have arisen from a particular set of circumstances and conditions. There may well be a number of cultural and societal factors in play, but to extrapolate those specific crimes to fit a larger and more general narrative is not particularly useful, unless one is trying to serve a specific agenda.

Last CIF repost, i promise, intellectual gymnastics used here, probably an academic, CaroleB999

 

[emanymton]

yeah , it's really frustrating because we seem to be going backwards on women's rights at a very alarming rate and yet all these self-described feminists can talk about a lot of the time (and not just on platforms such as the guardian) is blokes on the tube stretching their legs out or the fact that an actress wore the wrong thing.

This is true, blokes spreading their legs us really fucking annoying though. And I'm bloke.

 

[Pickman's model]

I'd disagree there was no response and I'd even disagree with the description of by standers. They deliberately blocked police , they're accomplices and therefore participants in my view .

i remember the 1994 cja riot in london, where a large number of people were fighting with the police by park lane and a larger number of people were cheering them on. i suspect there was a similar if disreputable thing going on in cologne etc

 

[Casually Red]

Reports that similar incidents happened in other European cities on New Years Eve (some seem to fit the pattern better than others tbh) and that in Helsinki, there is apparently evidence incidents were organised beforehand, and organisers were intercepted by police beforehand (although sexual assaults still took place on the night).

Personally I'm starting to suspect that that terror attack the cops were anticipating at Munich railway station on new years eve wasn't a terror attack at all but more of this sickening stuff . That they knew something organised was going down involving arab migrants but they jumped to the wrong conclusion.

 

[Teaboy]

Last CIF repost, i promise, intellectual gymnastics used here, probably an academic, CaroleB999

Christ, that was a lot of words to say absolutely nothing.

 

[treelover]

Personally I'm starting to suspect that that terror attack the cops were anticipating at Munich railway station on new years eve wasn't a terror attack at all but more of this sickening stuff . That they knew something organised was going down involving arab migrants but they jumped to the wrong conclusion.

thats a powerful accusation, evidence will be needed.

 

[Pickman's model]

thats a powerful accusation, evidence will be needed.

he suspects it's the case: no evidence needed for his belief.

 

[J Ed]

Personally I'm starting to suspect that that terror attack the cops were anticipating at Munich railway station on new years eve wasn't a terror attack at all but more of this sickening stuff . That they knew something organised was going down involving arab migrants but they jumped to the wrong conclusion.

Why do you think that?

 

[Pickman's model]

thats a powerful accusation, evidence will be needed.

tbh i wonder if cr's onto something.

 

[Casually Red]

So the point of all that ^^^^ is merely to push your own line and denounce anything as rational as "let's wait until the facts are in". Nice.

Rubbish . Both the victims and the cops have stated these people were migrants . I don't believe there's any shred of doubt they are and neither you nor anyone else has pointed even remotely to anything that could suggest they weren't . It's you that's not being rational , and for obvious reasons , because of the line you and others push . And the same irrationality as yours on this subject is on display all over the place and frankly making the situation worse .

 

[Casually Red]

Its not hard to see why men of military age would be the first to flee a warzone, but yeah worrying stuff.

A lot of these guys aren't the first to flee. Anyone keeping up with the Syrian war reddit will be well familiar with the photos and reports of former Syrian insurgents swanning about German cities . And many of them have legged it in much greater numbers since the Russians started bombing .

 

[Pickman's model]

Rubbish . Both the victims and the cops have stated these people were migrants . I don't believe there's any shred of doubt they are and neither you nor anyone else has pointed even remotely to anything that could suggest they weren't . It's you that's not being rational , and for obvious reasons , because of the line you and others push . And the same irrationality as yours on this subject is on display all over the place and frankly making the situation worse .

frankly don't matter now who the assailants were as so many people now think it was migrants - & so there's a motor as the story takees on a life of its own

 

[bluescreen]

'swanning about?' Really? Pictures or it didn't happen.

 

[frogwoman]

Tbh in terms of the effect it will have it's almost worse than an isis attack, which is carried out by a small group of perps who are mostly dead afterwards, whereas these rapists could disappear into the crowd and be literally anyone.

 

[Casually Red]

Why do you think that?

Because Arabs possibly up to no good, major german railway station and new years eve seems a massive bloody coincidence under the circumstances. And the fact they had only partial information, because there's been no arrests or interception of terrorists , tells me they only had a sketchy idea of something going down. And didn't have the full picture . They may have jumped to what was a more obvious conclusion at the time .

It's just a suspicion but it strikes me as a hell of a coincidence .

 

[frogwoman]

.

 

[treelover]

"Reading the Guardian here is certainly knocking the left out of me, little by little"

I have to say the same.

 

[bluescreen]

"Reading the Guardian here is certainly knocking the left out of me, little by little"

I have to say the same.

The Graun. The Groan.

 

[Casually Red]

"Reading the Guardian here is certainly knocking the left out of me, little by little"

I have to say the same.

For the sake of my sanity I have to keep reminding myself that horseshit isn't actually left wing, but mainly due to the left being so badly infiltrated by the middle class and their various neuroses , hobby horses , happy clappy delusions and angsts .

 

[trashpony]

from CIF

Why the fuck have you quoted that? What's the relevance?

 

[treelover]

If Die Linke doesn't robustly and without equivocation comdemn these events and call for robust punishments for the perpetrators, i suspect it is finished.

 

[treelover]

Why the fuck have you quoted that? What's the relevance?

In the past, i had lots of dealings with the Euroleft, many in Germany are equivocating, that shapes my views, ok.

 

[frogwoman]

M.DW.COM - News - More suspects arrested in Cologne attacks

Looks like they have rearrested the guys with the bit of paper

 

[trashpony]

In the past, i had lots of dealings with the Euroleft, many in Germany are equivocating, that shapes my views, ok.

Oh