Collective punishment

[moono]

Rachamim;

"Israel occupies 'Palestine' as the result of an act of war." I thought that Israel maintained a presence in those lands becuae the previous sovereigns relinquished any and all claims to the lands. With no viable leadership available Israel was tasked with administering the lands until such time as viable leadership emerges.

Secondly, you erroneously [yet again] use the word "occupy." To "OCCUPY," there must first be an entity to bear the "occupation." Other than the Jews, there has never been an organic and soivereign government there. To put it simply, if Israel is actually "occupying" anything, it is "occupying" its own land!

Golda Meir is just SO last year, old bean.

 

[big footed fred]

Rachamim;


Golda Meir is just SO last year, old bean.

9-Jun-70: Yassa Arafat becomes PLO leader

He is just so last century, fucking dead and did sod all for the palestinians in 30 odd years.
All these people dead and still the palestinians have got fuck all will stay that way until they work out that they have bog all chance of beating Israel while they try to do it with violent action.
When a bright little arab comes along and works it out then international support for israel will fade and the Palestinians have a real chance.

Lucky for the Israelis that they are all bent on continuing as they are.

 

[moono]

Oh, highly relevant. No-one's quoting Yasser-fucking-Arafat are they. Jork.

As we're on the topic, there wouldn't be a Palestinian resistance if not for Yasser. Maintaining the spirit of an entire nation is hardly 'doing sod-all for them in 30 years '

Now do me a favour, get off the wall and go support some Zionist atrocities.

 

[big footed fred]

Oh, highly relevant. No-one's quoting Yasser-fucking-Arafat are they. Jork.

As we're on the topic, there wouldn't be a Palestinian resistance if not for Yasser. Maintaining the spirit of an entire nation is hardly 'doing sod-all for them in 30 years '

I just did with the point that 30+ years of terrorism did sod all for the people of what is now a terrorist state.
They can bleat on all they like about zionists but the world has little time for a terrorist or those who support them.
Kill Kill Kill, I hear but I never see them get anything for it except, perhaps, the satisfaction of killing some jews.
Time for them to box clever but only if they want to win.

 

[moono]

You'll find it impossible to define 'terrorism' without condemning Zionist actions in your attempt.
Look at the law, see who is the aggressor then stfu.

 

[Fuchs66]

You'll find it impossible to define 'terrorism' without condemning Zionist actions in your attempt.
Look at the law, see who is the aggressor then stfu.

So 2 wrongs make a right?

 

[moono]

Details aside, Fuchs66, is isn't a matter of 'two wrongs'. There's one underlying wrong, Palestine is occupied by an aggressor. The lesser wrongs stem from that.

 

[Fuchs66]

Details aside, Fuchs66, is isn't a matter of 'two wrongs'. There's one underlying wrong, Palestine is occupied by an aggressor. The lesser wrongs stem from that.

and who are you to judge which is the greater and which the lesser wrong?

 

[bluestreak]

rach: vague or not, there have been a series of international violations and broken orders by israel. the lack of indictment in this case doesn't indicate a lack of broken law, more the case of a weak-willed international policeman. seeing as i know your first point to be incorrect either through political bias or ignorance i'm afraid that unless you can provide me with some sort of evidence i'm going to have to disregard the rest of your post.

 

[moono]

and who are you to judge which is the greater and which the lesser wrong?

Anybody with a reasonable sense of logic can determine that. Who are you to ask ?

 

[big footed fred]

Anybody with a reasonable sense of logic can determine that. Who are you to ask ?

A gift you don't have if you fail to see a bus bomb is just as wrong as a tank shell.
Both kill anyone in the way regardless of age, gender or any political ideas the person may hold.

Why is a tank shell bad and a bus bomb ok - perhaps one just kills israelis so that's ok then.

 

[moono]

If you say so. By my reckoning six thousand artillery shells in the past few weeks are worse than the sum total of anything Hamas ever did. You'd have to be truly dense to think otherwise.

 

[ZAMB]

Neither is Levy correct when he opines that the HAMAS legislators and Cabient memebers were taken tyo be used as baragaining chips. They are arrested because they had broken laws.

What laws would those be? The "law" against being democratically elected while opposing Israel?

 

[moono]

The Zionists have 'defiled the immunity that was granted them as elected officials of the Palestinian people'

Defilement is part of the Zionist repertoire.

 

[big footed fred]

If you say so. By my reckoning six thousand artillery shells in the past few weeks are worse than the sum total of anything Hamas ever did. You'd have to be truly dense to think otherwise.

So Israel is better at killing militants than terrorists are at killing shoppers (sorry evil zionists)

It what way does that make it right for anyone to kill at random ?

 

[big footed fred]

The Zionists have 'defiled the immunity that was granted them as elected officials of the Palestinian people'

Defilement is part of the Zionist repertoire.

Elected officials that are open in their support of murder.
Immunity negated

 

[moono]

Democracy negated, stoopid.

 

[cemertyone]

Elected officials that are open in their support of murder.
Immunity negated

Ditto...our own government are guilty by the very logic you use....

 

[big footed fred]

Ditto...our own government are guilty by the very logic you use....

Not in the same way but I would love to see Blair in court. That would make the git smirk.

 

[big footed fred]

Democracy negated, stoopid.

So you would support an Iraqi suiside bomber popping into tesco while you were shopping and blowing you ass accross town.
But I'm sure they would check first to see who they were going to kill.
You know - make sure no women, children, murdering militant supporters and so on were around.

 

[moono]

Good lord, I hope they don't gain access to Fortnum & Mason's.

 

[ViolentPanda]

So you would support an Iraqi suiside bomber popping into tesco while you were shopping and blowing you ass accross town.

Call yourself an Englishman?

It's "arse", you rickets-infested Northern coal-monkey!

 

[big footed fred]

Call yourself an Englishman?

It's "arse", you rickets-infested Northern coal-monkey!

The ass was to add an American flavor (there I go again).

No coal here now - not read the news for the last 20 years dad ?

 

[ViolentPanda]

The ass was to add an American flavor (there I go again).

No coal here now - not read the news for the last 20 years dad ?

Of course there's still coal there you sniffer of ferrets' arses, there's just no bugger mining it.

 

[rachamim18]

Moono: "there would not be a resistance is not for Arafat." Right....but there WOULD have been a state called "Palestine" encompassing 97% of the so called "West Bank," 3% of Israel Proper to make up the differential, 100% of Gaza, and 100% of E. Jerusalem. Hmmm...


BlueStreak: So, a lack of indictment does not mean a lack of law being broekn...rather it means a weak policeman? Sorry, but the proof is in the pudding. sans indictment it is merely your opinion speaking.

You claim my first point is incorrect but offer no qualification. Par for the course.

ZAMB: "What laws would they be?" the lws that state no non-sanctioned armed forces shall exist within boundries of said state. Seems pretty simple. not only is it a fundamental International Law, but a law of the PA as well.

 

[moono]

Rachamim;

Moono: "there would not be a resistance is not for Arafat." Right....but there WOULD have been a state called "Palestine" encompassing 97% of the so called "West Bank," 3% of Israel Proper to make up the differential, 100% of Gaza, and 100% of E. Jerusalem. Hmmm...

Let's lay the decrepit Camp David ghost for all time. It was a crock. It was the Matrix of Control . There was no 'viable and contiguous State' for Arafat. It was an attempt to legitimise theft by means of the only legitimising process that there is........Palestinian agreement.

It was an insult to Arafat and he treated it with contempt.

Dershowitz challenges our claim that the Israelis did not offer the Palestinians a contiguous state at Camp David in July 2000. As support, he cites a statement by former Israeli prime minister Ehud Barak and the memoirs of former US negotiator Dennis Ross. There are a number of competing accounts of what happened at Camp David, however, and many of them agree with our claim. Moreover, Barak himself acknowledges that ‘the Palestinians were promised a continuous piece of sovereign territory except for a razor-thin Israeli wedge running from Jerusalem . . . to the Jordan River.’ This wedge, which would bisect the West Bank, was essential to Israel’s plan to retain control of the Jordan River Valley for another six to twenty years. Finally, and contrary to Dershowitz’s claim, there was no ‘second map’ or map of a ‘final proposal at Camp David’. Indeed, it is explicitly stated in a note beside the map published in Ross’s memoirs that ‘no map was presented during the final rounds at Camp David.’ Given all this, it is not surprising that Barak’s foreign minister, Shlomo Ben-Ami, who was a key participant at Camp David, later admitted: ‘If I were a Palestinian I would have rejected Camp David as well.’

http://www.irmep.org/mw_letter.htm

Rachamim, I hear a voice calling ! Zounds, it's fucking Yasser !!

" Rachaaaami i i i mmmmm, take your 97% and shove it "

 

[big footed fred]

Who was this arafat guy ?

In 1988 came a change of policy. In a speech at a special United Nations session held in Geneva, Switzerland, Arafat declared that the PLO renounced terrorism and supported "the right of all parties concerned in the Middle East conflict to live in peace and security, including the state of Palestine, Israel and other neighbours".

The prospects for a peace agreement with Israel now brightened.peace process began in earnest, leading to the Oslo Accords of 1993.

A guy that worked out that terrorism was a mistake in that it would never win anything. He did plenty himself but saw it was going nowhere fast.
Bloody good try and he gained much for his people including international support much needed to solve the area's problems and help the palestinian people.
Pity the terrorists didn't play along and gave israel the excuse it needed to carry on with the same old story.
I chance missed as a direct result of nutters hell bent on killing jews at any cost.

 

[moono]

BFF;

Pity the terrorists didn't play along and gave israel the excuse it needed to carry on with the same old story.
I chance missed as a direct result of nutters hell bent on killing jews at any cost.

You've spoiled your revision with this phoney ending.

Peace does NOT suit Zionist expansionism. You can't have peace and 'brutal compulsion' simultaneously. They are founded upon 'brutal compulsion' and 'brutal compulsion' is what they prefer.

Palestinian reprisal has always been labelled 'attack' by the hasbara-mill.

 

[big footed fred]

BFF;


You've spoiled your revision with this phoney ending.

Peace does NOT suit Zionist expansionism. You can't have peace and 'brutal compulsion' simultaneously. They are founded upon 'brutal compulsion' and 'brutal compulsion' is what they prefer.

Palestinian reprisal has always been labelled 'attack' by the hasbara-mill.

Peace does not suit israel as if there are no attacks from the terrorist then it's excuse has gone and so international opinion will support the Palestinians.

I must be wrong about the millitant murderers not agreeing with Arafat and I'm sure tha assassination threats and continued murders were just a mistaken wedding invitation - bad translation you know.

The military wing of the radical Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP) threaten to assassinate Yasser Arafat and his aides

I'm guessing this never happened - right moono ?

 

[TAE]

So you would support an Iraqi suiside bomber popping into tesco while you were shopping and blowing you ass accross town.
But I'm sure they would check first to see who they were going to kill.
You know - make sure no women, children, murdering militant supporters and so on were around.

Would you support the army shelling the local tesco store because there are suspected militants there?