Climate change sceptics bet $10,000 on cooler world

[parallelepipete]

By all means check and see were they hold all their confrences, and the motels they stay in.

I'll give you a hint, its not the motel 6 in in some low rent city.

Yeah, the Biochemistry 2005 conference was held in the SECC in Glasgow, Scotland - which is a bleeding hangar next to the concrete monstrosity that is the Clydeside Expressway. What a glamorous place that is!

 

[parallelepipete]

I'm saying that environmental organizations are fomenting false fears in order to promote agendas and raise money.

This guy's as bad as Charles Clarke.

until my eyes roll right up into my head and get stuck

 

[Ae589]

According to real working class standards they live like spoiled kings.

Put the pipe down.

But its not just me saying that.

By taking on global warming, Crichton hopes to ease some people's worries.

And he's done really well, made an absolute fortune. I haven't read this book, but I did read Swarm... now it has some interesting ideas... but science it is not. If you use Michael Crichton as your source, you have already lost.


Unfortunately - this is for the relevant people, not pbman - Michael Chrichton *is* a bestseller, and whatever his reasons or beliefs, this book is going to be the most popular source of information on global warming of this year. Let's hope people take it as seriously as they took 'The day after tommorrow'.

 

[Streathamite]

so erm, peabrain, can we assume that your POV is that The Da Vinci code proves the worthlessness of both organised Xtian religion, and the bible as we know it today??

 

[redsquirrel]

Micheal Crichton, the science fiction novelist.
This man is not even a scientist ffs.

He's not much of a novelist either

 

[redsquirrel]

Pbman -

You are employing terminology that is commonplace in the 'Intelligent Design' arguments.

are you a proponent of these arguments ?

He's a creationist.

 

[pbman]

He's a creationist.

Inteligent design works for me.

And creation.

Anything but secular darwinism.

 

[pbman]

...It's Micheal Crichton. (I'm begining to get to know these names now)


Micheal Crichton, the science fiction novelist.
This man is not even a scientist ffs.

LOL he lectured at cambrdge at 22 years of age.

Whats that some lowrent dumbass school that lets any dumbass lecture?

As you will find in many of his books, Michael Crichton was born in Chicago, in 1942. He went the Harvard Medical School. After graduating, Crichton embarked on a career as a writer and filmmaker. Called "the father of the techno-thriller," his novels include The Andromeda Strain, The Great Train Robbery, Congo, Jurassic Park, Rising Sun, and the sequel to Jurassic Park, The Lost World. He has also written four books of nonfiction, including Five Patients, Jasper Johns, and his autobiography, Travels........

Crichton then decided to study anthropology. After graduating from Harvard summa cum laude (GPA 3.8-4.0) in 1965, with a major in anthropology, Crichton, now twenty-three, was a visiting lecturer in anthropology at Cambridge University, in England. Crichton also won a Henry Russell Shaw Fellowship and got to travel in Europe and North Africa for a year.

WTF is an antrhopologist if not a scientist in your book then?

A voodoo doctor?

http://www.globalnets.com/crichton/left/bio.html

 

[nino_savatte]

Inteligent design works for me.

And creation.

Anything but secular darwinism.

It sounds like you don't know what you want. In other words, you don't know whether you want a shit or a haircut.

 

[nino_savatte]

LOL he lectured at cambrdge at 22 years of age.

Whats that some lowrent dumbass school that lets any dumbass lecture?



WTF is an antrhopologist if not a scientist in your book then?

A voodoo doctor?

http://www.globalnets.com/crichton/left/bio.html

So what? He still isn't qualified to make judgements on global warming. Tell me what is the relationship between medicine, anthropology and the environment?

So he lectured at Cambridge at 22. Roger Scruton was Director of Studies at Christ College Cambridge when he was 25. He's a tosser and so is your man, Crichton.

 

[ViolentPanda]

So what? He still isn't qualified to make judgements on global warming. Tell me what is the relationship between medicine, anthropology and the environment?

So he lectured at Cambridge at 22. Roger Scruton was Director of Studies at Christ College Cambridge when he was 25. He's a tosser and so is your man, Crichton.

Ah, a "visiting lecturer"! Surely that's exactly the sort of academic sinecure that peebs is railing against in some of his earlier posts on this thread?

You couldn't make it up, could you?!!

 

[nino_savatte]

Ah, a "visiting lecturer"! Surely that's exactly the sort of academic sinecure that peebs is railing against in some of his earlier posts on this thread?

You couldn't make it up, could you?!!

I know, that was meant to impress us! So he shows up every couple of years to deliver a half hour speech. Whoopee do!

 

[ViolentPanda]

I know, that was meant to impress us! So he shows up every couple of years to deliver a half hour speech. Whoopee do!

I'm sure peebs thought a "visiting lectureship" was some kind of important post rather than (as it often is, especially with Oxbridge) part of an inter-institutional mutual backscratching system.

Now if it had been a visiting professorship I might have pretended to be impressed!

 

[bigfish]

... Micheal Crichton, the science fiction novelist.
This man is not even a scientist ffs.

As a matter of fact Crichton is an anthropologist and a medical doctor by profession, as well as a successful novelist. So you're wrong.

 

[Bob_the_lost]

As a matter of fact Crichton is an anthropologist and a medical doctor by profession, as well as a successful novelist. So you're wrong.

I thought this day would never come:

So what? He still isn't qualified to make judgements on global warming. Tell me what is the relationship between medicine, anthropology and the environment?

 

[bigfish]

Is nino "qualified" bob?

 

[ViolentPanda]

Is nino "qualified" bob?

Are you "qualified", fishie?

 

[bigfish]

Are you "qualified", fishie?

The question is Pandie: is Crichton scientifically trained?

And the answer is: yes, he is.

I'm surprised that someone as sharp as nino's Bushbot tag partner (i.e., you), didn't spot aurora green's rather obvious howler when it was made and point it out to him.

 

[bigfish]

Speaking as a qualified anthropologist in San francisco in 2003, Crichton noted:

Today, one of the most powerful religions in the Western World is environmentalism. Environmentalism seems to be the religion of choice for urban atheists. Why do I say it's a religion? Well, just look at the beliefs. If you look carefully, you see that environmentalism is in fact a perfect 21st century remapping of traditional Judeo-Christian beliefs and myths.

There's an initial Eden, a paradise, a state of grace and unity with nature, there's a fall from grace into a state of pollution as a result of eating from the tree of knowledge, and as a result of our actions there is a judgment day coming for us all. We are all energy sinners, doomed to die, unless we seek salvation, which is now called sustainability. Sustainability is salvation in the church of the environment. Just as organic food is its communion, that pesticide-free wafer that the right people with the right beliefs, imbibe.

Remarks to the Commonwealth Club

 

[aurora green]

As a matter of fact Crichton is an anthropologist and a medical doctor by profession, as well as a successful novelist. So you're wrong.

Lets get this right.
Crichton studied anthropolgy back in the 1960s.
Since then he has ran a mega sucessful computor company in the eighties, pioneering special effects for the film industry,
has written all those novels, Jurassic park Andromeda Strain, etc.
He has even won a bloody Emmy award for writing "ER"...
etc etc.
He has not been writing academic studies, but been making tv programmes,writing best sellers, and collecting entertainment awards
check out his biography
This is not the CV of a scientist.
What ever the man studied back in the day, this man is in showbusiness

 

[Bob_the_lost]

The question is Pandie: is Crichton scientifically trained?

And the answer is: yes, he is.

I'm surprised that someone as sharp as nino's Bushbot tag partner (i.e., you), didn't spot aurora green's rather obvious howler when it was made and point it out to him.

So you'd let an eight year old who knows how to test the growth rates of watercress in a) pitch black b) the shade c) direct sunlight, (after all that is scientific training isn't it) tell you how safe atomic energy is?

Why are you suggesting we listen to a doctor/anthropologist on a technical matter in which the majority of experts who've spent just as long studying, except maybe on useful subjects, disagree with him?

(Edit: Can you answer this question for me, and probably for nino too, he did ask it after all :what is the relationship between medicine, anthropology and the environment?)

 

[Fruitloop]

There's an initial Eden, a paradise, a state of grace and unity with nature, there's a fall from grace into a state of pollution as a result of eating from the tree of knowledge, and as a result of our actions there is a judgment day coming for us all. We are all energy sinners, doomed to die, unless we seek salvation, which is now called sustainability. Sustainability is salvation in the church of the environment. Just as organic food is its communion, that pesticide-free wafer that the right people with the right beliefs, imbibe.

I'm really bored of these 'this is like a religion, that is like a religion' bullshit. With comparisons as half-baked as this you can claim religiosity for anything you like - it's the argumentation of people who have no point to make.

Medicine is like a religion - there's the fallen condition of embodiment, salvation through healthy living and surgical (divine) intervention, communion in the form of pills and a priesthood in the form of doctors. You're still completely facked without it when your appendix starts playing up though.

Fucking muppets

 

[Bernie Gunther]

On the off chance anyone here is interested in reading some stuff by people who actually do know what they're talking about, the Met Office organised a major conference on "Avoiding Dangerous Climate Change" earlier this year and the conference site has some very useful papers. I'd highly recommend a read.

http://www.stabilisation2005.com/programme.html

 

[nino_savatte]

The question is Pandie: is Crichton scientifically trained?

And the answer is: yes, he is.

I'm surprised that someone as sharp as nino's Bushbot tag partner (i.e., you), didn't spot aurora green's rather obvious howler when it was made and point it out to him.

I see, I'm a "Bushbot" now am I? That's fucking cheap, even for you bf.

 

[bigfish]

Lets get this right.
Crichton studied anthropolgy back in the 1960s.
Since then he has ran a mega sucessful computor company in the eighties, pioneering special effects for the film industry,
has written all those novels, Jurassic park Andromeda Strain, etc.
He has even won a bloody Emmy award for writing "ER"...
etc etc.
He has not been writing academic studies, but been making tv programmes,writing best sellers, and collecting entertainment awards
check out his biography
This is not the CV of a scientist.
What ever the man studied back in the day, this man is in showbusiness

If you want to get things right, then you should include all the relevant details... like these, for example:

CRICHTON, (John) Michael. American. Born in Chicago, Illinois, October 23, 1942. Educated at Harvard University, Cambridge, Massachusetts, A.B. (summa cum laude) 1964 (Phi Beta Kappa). Visiting Lecturer in Anthropology at Cambridge University, England, 1965. Henry Russell Shaw Travelling Fellow, 1964-65. Entered Harvard Medical School, M.D. 1969; spent one year as a post-doctoral fellow at the Salk Institute for Biological Sciences, La Jolla, California 1969-1970. Visiting Writer, Massachusetts Institute of Technology, 1988.

 

[aurora green]

If you want to get things right, then you should include all the relevant details... like these, for example:

CRICHTON, (John) Michael. American. Born in Chicago, Illinois, October 23, 1942. Educated at Harvard University, Cambridge, Massachusetts, A.B. (summa cum laude) 1964 (Phi Beta Kappa). Visiting Lecturer in Anthropology at Cambridge University, England, 1965. Henry Russell Shaw Travelling Fellow, 1964-65. Entered Harvard Medical School, M.D. 1969; spent one year as a post-doctoral fellow at the Salk Institute for Biological Sciences, La Jolla, California 1969-1970. Visiting Writer, Massachusetts Institute of Technology, 1988.

Perhaps you could tell me exactly how any of this, qualifies him as an expert on climate change?

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Ahem - Can I just mention that several of the presenters at that Met Office conference on avoiding dangerous climate change I mentioned earlier have degrees too? I think some of them even specialise in climatology.

You can read what they have to say here

 

[ViolentPanda]

The question is Pandie: is Crichton scientifically trained?

And the answer is: yes, he is.

I'm surprised that someone as sharp as nino's Bushbot tag partner (i.e., you), didn't spot aurora green's rather obvious howler when it was made and point it out to him.

1) Bushbot? That's a childish smear even for you.

2) Crichton is scientifically trained, yes. So what? Are you saying that this makes him (a man who is by profession a fantasist) more likely to adhere to "the scientific method" in any analysis he arrives at?

3) You didn't answer the question. Are you qualified? All I hear is bluster from you supporting a dilettante whose current preoccupation coincides with one of yours. Do you really sell your favours that cheaply?

 

[aurora green]

Ahem - Can I just mention that several of the presenters at that Met Office conference on avoiding dangerous climate change I mentioned earlier have degrees too? I think some of them even specialise in climatology.

You can read what they have to say here

I'm having trouble downloading pdfs' at the moment (computer is causing me big headaches) dont want to appear like I'm ignoring vital links though...

 

[Bernie Gunther]

I'm having trouble downloading pdfs' at the moment (computer is causing me big headaches) dont want to appear like I'm ignoring vital links though...

Well, here's a quick summary if you want one.

Their starting point is the findings of the International Panel's third report and based on that, they're looking at three areas in particular.

1. For different levels of climate change what are the key impacts, for different regions and sectors and for the world as a whole?

2. What would such levels of climate change imply in terms of greenhouse gas stabilisation concentrations and emission pathways required to achieve such levels?

3. What options are there for achieving stabilisation of greenhouse gases at different stabilisation concentrations in the atmosphere, taking into account costs and uncertainties?

I'll try to summarise the main points from each session.

1. Impact Assessment. Probable range of temperature increase this century is let's say 1-3 deg C. Around the bottom end of that range you have floods and refugees in the hundreds of millions in places like Bangladesh and Egypt. You also have the potential of serious disruption to food systems. All of this is fairly predictable stuff. At the upper end of that range, we're talking about things like Greenland melting and maybe the atlantic thermo-haline circulation shutting down. Above that you're talking about catastrophic climate change involving the triggering of positive loops that a) make things worse faster, b) are really hard to stop once they've started happening.

2. Stabilisation. If we can stabilise around 450ppm of CO2 equivalent (ie it's more complicated than just CO2), then we're probably going to be sort of in the middle of that range, at about 2C over pre-industrial levels, which is going to cause a hell of a lot of suffering especially in the developing world (with a high degree of confidence) and which may kick off some of the bad threshold effects (lower confidence) early. Unfortunately, due to the present trends, hitting 550ppm or worse seems almost inevitable before before the end of this century.

3. Technology. Both mitigation of hard to predict long term effects of potentially very high severity and adaptation to short to medium term effects, whose probability is known with a higher degree of confidence, are needed.

Adaptation is a lot easier for high-tech wealthy countries than poor countries in places nearer to the equator. Unfortunately those are the countries likely to be worst hit by the effects that are either already demonstrably occuring or which are known to be likely to occur with a very high confidence level.

Unfortunately getting any of this to happen in a market economy is very bloody difficult, this is especially true of the mitigation of long-term effects.