Climate change sceptics bet $10,000 on cooler world

[Bernie Gunther]

Slowly and simply for me, please: if climate researchers don't have have a vested interest, where do their pay cheques come from?

It's pretty clear in fact that if you're that way inclined you can do very well out of coming up with more convenient results. Look at Bjorn Lomberg for example. He isn't a climate scientist, he isn't even a very good at his own subject by the look of it, but he's got best-selling books and his own institute.

 

[parallelepipete]

And hell even if you belive in man made global warming, koyoto, doesn't do shit, to solve the problem it justs export your jobs to others, who don't have koyoto restrictions, like china and india...

I do so love this stereotypically US attitude to Kyoto: attack it because it's an ineffective agreement - when it was the US government that pulled out all the stops to weaken it during negotiations!

I don't think anyone in the EU is proud of Kyoto; it was simply the best deal that could be cobbled together at the time, and many of us were disappointed in it back then. I'd much rather see a Contraction and Convergence-based agreement on GHG emissions limits.

 

[parallelepipete]

It's pretty clear in fact that if you're that way inclined you can do very well out of coming up with more convenient results. Look at Bjorn Lomberg for example. He isn't a climate scientist, he isn't even a very good at his own subject by the look of it, but he's got best-selling books and his own institute.

Indeed - and gets away with calling himself an environmentalist on the cover too.

 

[parallelepipete]

No it allows them to force other people to pay the price of thier radical agenda. They don't give a shit if the economy go's bad, they still get their checks.

Meanwile the rest of us in the real world don't have jobs.

Slowly and simply for me, please: if climate researchers don't have have a vested interest, where do their pay cheques come from which survive as the rest of the global economy goes into meltdown?

Just realised my post makes no sense, since I was trying to make the point that climate scientists don'thave a vested interest any more than does anyone else with a salary, and that they will suffer from high oil prices etc. as much as anyone else. Can't really edit it since Bernie as already quoted me, but please ignore!

 

[pbman]

Pbman, it is far more profitable to be an oil geologist (for example) than a climate scientist so I have a hard time believing the conspiracy theory you're spouting here. QUOTE]

Just in the last year maybee, as i know two oil geologists, and they didn't make shit with thier degrees that they recived in 1984......... The joke going around in the 80's in denver was that, a geologist aply's at mcDonolds and was told that all of their geologists had master degrees......

But follow the money, and you will see that climate scientists gets loads of money and grants to study the problem..........And here in the us at least their are very few contorls on this grant money> No doubt its the same in the EU.

 

[pbman]

Sorry, childish.


You calling him a RINO is fairly predictable (or putting up a link that assassinates him, etc) but you see, thats my point - first it'll be the dem's, then the RINO's, the the R's, then everyone who doesn't want to live underwater. It'll never be you, ever, obviously, but who cares - you'll be on your own. And hopefully we'll have saved your right-wing ass and pulled your head out of it.

I don't call him a rino because of his views on global warming.

I call him a RINO, cause thats what he is.

In any event, you are loosing the argument, and you don't even know it.

 

[Streathamite]

No it allows them to force other people to pay the price of thier radical agenda. They don't give a shit if the economy go's bad, they still get their checks.

Meanwile the rest of us in the real world don't have jobs.

so your opinion is more reliable if it's sponsored by someone whose overwhelming vested interest indicates it pointing only one way? Rather than someone who pays you to research impartially?
F-me, even for you, peabrain, that's monumentally stupid!

 

[pbman]

Just realised my post makes no sense, since I was trying to make the point that climate scientists don'thave a vested interest any more than does anyone else with a salary, and that they will suffer from high oil prices etc. as much as anyone else. Can't really edit it since Bernie as already quoted me, but please ignore!

Who do you think controles the grant money on all the studies?

Scientists.

http://yosemite.epa.gov/OAR/globalwarming.nsf/content/ResourceCenterFundingEPAGrants.html

And this.

The partnership received permission to start using the funds last week (on Oct. 8). The money is part of a $103 million DOE Genomes to Life Program aimed at taking advantage of the natural capabilities of wild bacteria to solve environmental problems.

http://www.news.harvard.edu/gazette/2002/10.17/01-microbes.html

Thats one very small part of the total money being spent suding the problem.

I would bet they get hundreds of millions every year. And Scientist can loot as well as enron a-holes......

 

[Streathamite]

Jesus are you really this thick or just trolling again.

he's this dense. and more.
<public service announcement. therefore obviously biased>

 

[pbman]

so your opinion is more reliable if it's sponsored by someone whose overwhelming vested interest indicates it pointing only one way? Rather than someone who pays you to research impartially?
F-me, even for you, peabrain, that's monumentally stupid!

Try to follow red, they more the global alarmest cry wolf, the more money they get to solve the problem.

So they have no interest in finding a solution.

They are tripping over each other, trying to get headlines and money.

I know you guys have a natural inclination to trust gov't more than the private sector, but give me a break.

They are on the "money train" as well.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Bjorn Lomberg and Fred Singer are a whole lot richer than any real scientists I know. Most of them are getting by and no more. Lomberg and Singer can look forward to living out their lives in luxury, with a rainbow to their graves and a tombstone that glows in the dark.

 

[Streathamite]

Try to follow red, they more the global alarmest cry wolf, the more money they get to solve the problem.

So they have no interest in finding a solution.

They are tripping over each other, trying to get headlines and money.

that's pathetic, you idiot! compared to Oilco inc. payroll, they get paid FUCK ALL either way!
And publicly-funded academics STILL have tenure either way!
jesus, the sheer idiocy, to argue that the vast majority of the nation's climate science community have invented this to keep universities funded.
christ alive....

 

[pbman]

Bjorn Lomberg and Fred Singer are a whole lot richer than any real scientists I know. Most of them are getting by and no more. Lomberg and Singer can look forward to living out their lives in luxury, with a rainbow to their graves and a tombstone that glows in the dark.

Follow the money.

See how much money is envolved studing the problem, and were it goes and who controles it and how they spend it.

The usual methods work aginst gov't as well as buisness.

 

[pbman]

he's this dense. and more.
<public service announcement. therefore obviously biased>

Are you going to troll another thread into the ground?

 

[pbman]

I do so love this stereotypically US attitude to Kyoto: attack it because it's an ineffective agreement - when it was the US government that pulled out all the stops to weaken it during negotiations!
.

You still have not met your goals.

And it was the us senate that regected it, 98-0. Hell even our nutcases like McCAin didn't vote for it, that ought to tell you something.

Its a bad treaty.

 

[pbman]

that's pathetic, you idiot! compared to Oilco inc. payroll, they get paid FUCK ALL either way!
And publicly-funded academics STILL have tenure either way!
jesus, the sheer idiocy, to argue that the vast majority of the nation's climate science community have invented this to keep universities funded.
christ alive....

They want a lot more than their base salery that is proteced by tenure.

Lots of that "study" moeny is spent on travel and confrenses, in nice vacation spots, they stay in nice motels and and get lots of free meals.......

They live like f-ing kings, and they charge it all of to their "Study".

And thats the leagle shit, who knows how much is lost on the usual illegal methods of looting.

 

[Ae589]

Lots of that "study" moeny is spent on travel and confrenses, in nice vacation spots, they stay in nice motels and and get lots of free meals...

I agree - it's the lecturers and scientists that are the greedy, money driven ones -*not* the multinationals. That makes so much sense.

...usual illegal methods of looting.

Absolutely, looting among scientists is a real problem here in too-much-crystal-meth land.

You really think 'tenure' is a bigger incentive for someone to invent global warming than 'selling the thing that causes global warming' is to pretend it doesn't exist. That's awesome!

 

[Graymalkin]

Pbman, it is far more profitable to be an oil geologist (for example) than a climate scientist so I have a hard time believing the conspiracy theory you're spouting here. QUOTE]

Just in the last year maybee, as i know two oil geologists, and they didn't make shit with thier degrees that they recived in 1984......... The joke going around in the 80's in denver was that, a geologist aply's at mcDonolds and was told that all of their geologists had master degrees......

A masters student having more job opportunities than an undergrad, who'd have thought eh? I guess it was too much to assume that you'd realize I was refering to equivalent degrees Climatology isn't studied exclusively at the undergraduate level, I'm sure even you realize that most if not all of the significant research was done by professors. That said a PhD Geologist working in industry probably takes home considerably more than a climatology professor. And just so you know I study geology so spare me your inside info.

But follow the money, and you will see that climate scientists gets loads of money and grants to study the problem..........And here in the us at least their are very few contorls on this grant money> No doubt its the same in the EU.

Controls on the grant money? That's because science is supposed to be independent from governmental and economic control. Do you accept that corporations have an agenda? Because they are increasingly the ones with the power on University Campus'.

 

[pbman]

A masters student having more job opportunities than an undergrad, who'd have thought eh? I guess it was too much to assume that you'd realize I was refering to equivalent degrees Climatology isn't studied exclusively at the undergraduate level, I'm sure even you realize that most if not all of the significant research was done by professors. That said a PhD Geologist working in industry probably takes home considerably more than a climatology professor. And just so you know I study geology so spare me your inside info.
.

Yes a masters degree is much better for flipping burgers, and thats about all you could do with a geology degree, up until last year or so, so your point about geologist making the big money is laughable.

Controls on the grant money? That's because science is supposed to be independent from governmental and economic control. Do you accept that corporations have an agenda? Because they are increasingly the ones with the power on University Campus'.

Yes it is a pretty good logic scam they have going, to justify their "independence"



But the fact of life is that any time their is a lot of money floating around, people are going to line their own pockets, in varying degrees. Even scientists, and crying that the "sky is falling" is a damn good way to "shake the money tree". The yahoo's who find the bigest problem get the most money. The news papers go along cause its sells papers, and they like to belive it anyways, cause it fits their sense of fear........

Anyways like i said before, i asked my brother the geophysicist about global warming and the european belife in it, and he said you guys belive in it, far far out of proportion to the actual evidence.

And thats good enough for me, he wouldn't lie, to me for no reason.

 

[pbman]

I agree - it's the lecturers and scientists that are the greedy, money driven ones -*not* the multinationals. That makes so much sense.

!

By all means check and see were they hold all their confrences, and the motels they stay in.

I'll give you a hint, its not the motel 6 in in some low rent city.

According to real working class standards they live like spoiled kings.

But its not just me saying that.

Environmentalists Fomenting False Fears?


He spent three years researching "State of Fear." It's a thriller with footnotes, graphs and scientific references. In it he argues that the threat of global warming has been exaggerated by environmentalists.



"I'm saying that environmental organizations are fomenting false fears in order to promote agendas and raise money," he said.



In "State of Fear," environmental groups set off terrorist acts to focus attention on global warming.



Crichton agrees the Earth is getting warmer. But he says there is little to worry about because the climate is always changing and there is no evidence to determine if the changes are manmade or natural. In fact he says, climate scientists admit they can't predict what temperatures will be in 100 years.



"My view of this is that the media is like the guy going down the street with a sign that says 'The End of the World is Near,' and he picks a date and the day comes and goes, and the world doesn't end. So he doesn't stop with the sign. He goes home, makes another sign, puts a new date on it, and starts marching again. That's the way the media is," Crichton said.



He argues that researchers who study global warming often exaggerate the problem in order to get grants, often using celebrities to promote their cause.



By taking on global warming, Crichton hopes to ease some people's worries.

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=316580&page=2

 

[aurora green]

As I've said before, we've had perfectly normal weather this year so far. A few more the same and we'll be hearing a deal less about this global warming nonsense.
..

Yes perfectly 'normal ' weather in Czec Republic...

and in the Alps...

and in Portugal....

 

[aurora green]

bla....

But its not just me saying that.



http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=316580&page=2

...It's Micheal Crichton. (I'm begining to get to know these names now)


Micheal Crichton, the science fiction novelist.
This man is not even a scientist ffs.

 

[Crispy]

Yes a masters degree is much better for flipping burgers, and thats about all you could do with a geology degree, up until last year or so, so your point about geologist making the big money is laughable.

Or you could make millions finding oil...

 

[Streathamite]

Are you going to troll another thread into the ground?

you have ONE post to point out whhich other thread i have 'trolled into the ground' - i.e. dragged debate irreversibly off-topic - before I report this and sundry other posts of yours.

 

[Streathamite]

Yes a masters degree is much better for flipping burgers, and thats about all you could do with a geology degree, up until last year or so, so your point about geologist making the big money is laughable.

so we are agreed that America is too intellectually bankrupt to maximise collective gain from utilising the knowledge of its' educated specialists, yes?
and an American Uni education is worthless?

 

[Streathamite]

Follow the money.

See how much money is envolved studing the problem, and were it goes and who controles it and how they spend it.

The usual methods work aginst gov't as well as buisness.

so errm, there is as much public funding going into objective, highly-regulated, scrutinised, academic study of the issue as there is into being an Oilco cheerleader?
Is it just me, or does leadhead show himself to be 1000% fruitloop on this thread?

 

[nino_savatte]

...It's Micheal Crichton. (I'm begining to get to know these names now)


Micheal Crichton, the science fiction novelist.
This man is not even a scientist ffs.

Aye and Crichton has some pretty dodgy views on other subjects too. He also claims to be a member of MENSA.

 

[Streathamite]

By all means check and see were they hold all their confrences, and the motels they stay in.

I'll give you a hint, its not the motel 6 in in some low rent city.

According to real working class standards they live like spoiled kings.

But its not just me saying that.



http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=316580&page=2

so are you saytting that every scientist who believes that climate change is driven by human action is making this up, 100%, to keep themselves in a job?

YES/NO???

btw, idiotboy, Michael Chrichton writes fiction.
Jurassic Park ain't real, y'know.

 

[Streathamite]

They want a lot more than their base salery that is proteced by tenure.

Lots of that "study" moeny is spent on travel and confrenses, in nice vacation spots, they stay in nice motels and and get lots of free meals.......

They live like f-ing kings, and they charge it all of to their "Study".

And thats the leagle shit, who knows how much is lost on the usual illegal methods of looting.

So are you saying every climate change academic is simply milking the system, unless funded by business?
YES/NO?

 

[41132n]

Pbman -

You are employing terminology that is commonplace in the 'Intelligent Design' arguments.

are you a proponent of these arguments ?