Boris Johnson tests positive for Covid-19

[Cid]

Bow to greater knowledge of such matters, but I still don't believe a single word they're saying.

This is the hospital issuing a statement though... There may at least be a bit more ethical thought behind that. Though obviously someone will have released them to make that statement.

 

[brogdale]

This is the hospital issuing a statement though... There may at least be a bit more ethical thought behind that. Though obviously someone will have released them to make that statement.

hmmm

 

[nogojones]

Well, bear in mind he was being advised by the 'greatest minds in the UK medical industry' or whatever they call themselves. People he didnt appoint.

They got it spectacularly wrong, as the Swedish model is about to prove.

He was being advised by people the tories appointed to give credence to their policy. These are political apointments. Just look at how the ACMD works

 

[Pickman's model]

Not on ventilator.
This morning's line.

= we're working out how to tell you

 

[ska invita]

Nobody's been through this since 1918. Bird flu kind of pales in comparison to whats going on here.

I disagree, but IMO the issue remains people maintaining physical distancing rather than some future fear of handshakes.

 

[nogojones]

My point stands. Boris Johnson was a mediocre journalist, turned (fuck knows how exactly) a very successful politican. Not a doctor. He was advised by the most senior doctors in the country. What do you suggest his motive was to adopt the herd immunity policy exactly? That he wanted to kill people?

That economic activity was more important to the people who he cared about than the lives of hundreds of thousands of old and infirm

 

[Monkeygrinder's Organ]

Not on ventilator.
This morning's line.

I wonder if hospitals possess any pieces of kit which resemble ventilators, and perform similar tasks, but that are not, strictly speaking, ventilators.

/CT

 

[Raheem]

Not on ventilator.
This morning's line.

"We didn't burn him!"

 

[Yossarian]

Nobody's been through this since 1918. Bird flu kind of pales in comparison to whats going on here.

SARS in Hong Kong was a lot worse than bird flu - it killed almost 300 people, including dozens of health workers, and was all the more terrifying because mainland China was being very secretive about this new virus that had a death rate of nearly 10%. Life did return to normal afterwards, but people there are now a lot more likely to wear face masks when they have minor cold and flu symptoms, and they started taking such measures very seriously indeed when the coronavirus outbreak first surfaced.

 

[LDC]

I wonder if hospitals possess any pieces of kit which resemble ventilators, and perform similar tasks, but that are not, strictly speaking, ventilators.

/CT

CPAP, etc etc. Yeah there's a few things some people end up on on first before they de-saturate and end up tubed and ventilated.

kropotkin and Edie and others know more.

 

[two sheds]

My daughter asked me last night if we were getting a new Prime Minister.

She's in tears at bed time most nights right now and doesn't want to leave us alone.

It was a bit of a shock to me to realize that quite a few people actually like Johnson. The outpourings of grief at Diana's death made me realize just how far removed I am from how other people in the UK feel. If he does die I wonder whether we'll get similar.

 

[The39thStep]

He was being advised by people the tories appointed to give credence to their policy. These are political apointments. Just look at how the ACMD works

Like most people on here I know pretty much nothing about succesful ways to manage corona virus but I'm intrigued as how the government came to the decision about herd community . So was Patrick Vallances advice on herd immunity just a theoretical justification for a decsion already made or did it influence the governments decsion?

 

[pesh]

[

I wonder if hospitals possess any pieces of kit which resemble ventilators, and perform similar tasks, but that are not, strictly speaking, ventilators.

/CT

you think some nurse might have hooked him up to a printer for the lols? worth it.

 

[chilango]

It was a bit of a shock to me to realize that quite a few people actually like Johnson. The outpourings of grief at Diana's death made me realize just how far removed I am from how other people in the UK feel. If he does die I wonder whether we'll get similar.

Oh she doesn't like Johnson. She had the misfortune to meet May a couple of years back so I guess the PM is a slightly more concrete symbol for her because of that.

 

[alsoknownas]

.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

I know, it’s fucked up.

We (Amazon drivers) have to take a thermometer reading every morning now before starting work and get PPE disposable gloves, hand sanitiser and face masks - DPD guy was in shorts and a t-shirt and said they weren’t offered any PPE.

This just popped up in my news feed:

Have you spoke to a union Marty? This is, it goes without saying, a fucking disgrace. Are you in London?

 

[ska invita]

SARS in Hong Kong was a lot worse than bird flu - it killed almost 300 people, including dozens of health workers, and was all the more terrifying because mainland China was being very secretive about this new virus that had a death rate of nearly 10%. Life did return to normal afterwards, but people there are now a lot more likely to wear face masks when they have minor cold and flu symptoms, and they started taking such measures very seriously indeed when the coronavirus outbreak first surfaced.

seeing the number of men washing hands in club/pub toilets before lockdown made me realise how many people dont normally do so! Hopefully that will be something that sticks.

Like most people on here I know pretty much nothing about succesful ways to manage corona virus but I'm intrigued as how the government came to the decision about herd community . So was Patrick Vallances advice on herd immunity just a theoretical justification for a decsion already made or did it influence the governments decsion?

we'll never know for sure as whatever versions we may come to hear will be steeped in blaming others and escaping personal responsibility.
what we do know is these Tories are capitalism above all else, and have a penchant for eugenics, so Im perfectly happy to conclude they went with it because they wanted it. The Daily Telegraphs "good for business cull" is the deeper latent ideology at work here.

 

[nogojones]

Like most people on here I know pretty much nothing about succesful ways to manage corona virus but I'm intrigued as how the government came to the decision about herd community . So was Patrick Vallances advice on herd immunity just a theoretical justification for a decsion already made or did it influence the governments decsion?

I'm not sure how this appointee works personally, but I suspect a bit of both.

I use the ACMD as an example of how these appointees work - They advise, but if their advice doesn't match the political will of the government they no longer work as advisors.

 

[existentialist]

‘Mr Johnson has asked Foreign Secretary Dominic Raab to deputise "where necessary"’.

Mr Johnson has not done any such thing. He’s very ill. The idea that he’s sitting up in bed with a pile of dossiers on his lap dictating memos over Zoom is bizarre. From my limited experience of ICU people there are not well.

From my limited experience of ITU, pretty much everybody in there tends to be sedated to a greater or lesser degree. Certainly - medical needs apart - not in the state you'd want someone to be in to be making national decisions.

 

[two sheds]

Oh she doesn't like Johnson. She had the misfortune to meet May a couple of years back so I guess the PM is a slightly more concrete symbol for her because of that.

Ahhhhh sorry I didn't mean to suggest she liked him (that'd virtually be an insult ) , your post was just a convenient hook to hang mine on.

 

[frogwoman]

Tbh this does make the situation much scarier. I can imagine if I was about to go to hospital myself I'd be terrified.

 

[two sheds]

Yes along the lines of when people are young they realize we're all going to die as a sort of theoretical possibility. As you get older ....

 

[WouldBe]

I wonder if hospitals possess any pieces of kit which resemble ventilators, and perform similar tasks, but that are not, strictly speaking, ventilators.

/CT

How about a faulty ventilator?

 

[brogdale]

It was a bit of a shock to me to realize that quite a few people actually like Johnson. The outpourings of grief at Diana's death made me realize just how far removed I am from how other people in the UK feel. If he does die I wonder whether we'll get similar.

A sociological experiment worth pursuing, I'd have thought.

 

[existentialist]

Not on ventilator.
This morning's line.

So, he's on a ventilator, then?

 

[phillm]

How many people (apart from just Carrie and the unborn) has he wilfully infected by his cavalier attitude as to the rules don't apply to me, I'm invulnerable.

Actions have consequences as he is sadly finding out. Consequences that requires experts to solve them if they can.

 

[brogdale]

At this stage the 'planning' must all be about buying time, I'd imagine.
So much to put in place for if/when.

 

[existentialist]

An intensive care consultant just said in an interview with Adam Boulton, on Sky, that surviving ICU patients often suffer very long term psychological cognitive and physical problems which need to be dealt with.

There was a study done a few years ago which noted that a lot of the sedatives/anaesthesia that is used routinely in ITU leaves people physically sedated, but often in quite psychotic mental states - nightmares, delusions, all the rest. Added to which, ITUs are not particularly relaxing places to be at the best of times.

(I spent altogether too much time in ITUs when Mrs E #1 made a few of her more determined suicide attempts...including at St Thomas', where the views are amazing, even if the reason for being there was anything but)

 

[Pickman's model]

I suspect that this adds to the gathering logic for a GNU. Firstly, if Johnson pulls through, the recovery time and rest is likely to be a matter of weeks and not days. Decisions will have to be made about who is governing and how and for how long it would be necessary. The CS would, I assume, now be drawing up proposals to ‘move beyond politics’ and to have a cabinet off ‘all of the talents’.

Second, the election of Starmer and the assurances he’s offered about not ‘scoring points’ were clearly carefully scripted and in lock step with Johnson’s letter offering partnership talks and Privy Council access. GNU was already on the agenda, the health of the PM makes it more

Third, as the Virus becomes ‘real’ in the popular consciousness (and Johnson being ill will affect this considerably) the Tories will want to share the effort (blame) as the peak arrives.

Fourth, the time for the new consensus that is going to be needed here is most definitely coming. That consensus is state capitalism to bail out capital. History indicates that this works better and achieves consent quicker under GNU exceptionalism.

I hope Johnson recovers, but whether he does or does not, the political and democratic crisis we are living through (and which his condition sharpens) is unprecedented in all of our lives

Desperate stuff.

Your 2. Starmer has been a member of the pc for three years, so dk where this privy council access coming from... The tories may want to share the blame. But they've left it rather late. Oh and the letter of 4 April doesn't mention the pc

If Johnson rolls a seven and then Labour enter a gnu or whatnot it will be too late for the narrative you suggest. Indeed it's too late now as God sent the cv but the tories let it out everywhere. More than 5000 dead, the economy in a desperate situation, and still no concrete moves to bring Labour in to share the blame. Don't think your sc really holds water, it's not really worked here or in the USA as you suggest, where it took a world war to get the economy out of the great depression. You may be thinking of the govt during WW2. But that relied on great alliances, on the Americans giving great assistance, on debts only paid off in recent years. I don't think a gnú will operate before another 5000 people have died and the narrative may well be it took 10000 people to die and the economy to fall apart before the tory party stopped putting party before country

Yeh nothing will go back to how it was before. But far from the parties being in lock step they're dancing round each other, with labour wary of being whipping boys like the Lib Dems were. The Labour leadership would have to be remarkably stupid not to think the tories might try to pin loads of shit on them.

 

[killer b]

Mrs B has an academic interest in Michael Gove, and reckons that when he lies - which he does, a lot - it's never in definitive terms. So Gove saying categorically this morning that Johnson isn't on a ventilator probably means he's not on a ventilator. He also said, for example, that he's not aware whether Johnson has been diagnosed with pneumonia - which means he's definitely been diagnosed with pneumonia.