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Atos Medicals - Questions, Answers and Support

existentialist said:
Yep. What's so frustrating is that it seems so difficult for people to recognise that. On a thread like this, we're mostly preaching to the choir - but for others to be bothered, they have to be interested enough to see it as a problem, too.
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Hopefully the I, Daniel Blake film will spread the message a bit further - glad to see it won some awards recently.
 
Still not heard anything back about my mate's review medical. Surely we should have received a letter or something by now? It's been over 6 weeks.
 
ViolentPanda said:
The "no such thing as society" flourishes in an environment where social mobility is fluid - people tend to think "if I can pull myself up by my bootstraps, so can everyone else". Create a society where the have-nots consistently become poorer and more alienated, where social mobility barely happens, and social solidarities become more and more important, and the potential for a "flowering" of solidaristic communities becomes far more likely.
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Well, I like your optimism. :)
 
stuff_it said:
Still not heard anything back about my mate's review medical. Surely we should have received a letter or something by now? It's been over 6 weeks.
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You could ring them just to see if there's any progress? Some people on this thread have reported significantly longer.
 
I need a rant and a bit of advice please.

Esa50 filled in and returned in end of April, face to face WCA End of July, decision notice arrived dated 24th of August. Mandatory Reconsideration sent 2nd Sept logged/scanned by DWP 6th sept just had my MR decision arrive today dated 17th Dec. I sent no new information nor made any suggestion that I would be.

The original decision maker awarded me zero points; although wrote in the decision letter I award 6 points on 2 descriptors - 13 and 14 I think as you have to figure it out from the lucid description of the activity not named.

My MR decision maker has supported the original award of 12 points 6 for each descriptor originally stated and upheld the original decision.

I'm confused by which decision the zero point or 12 points as this letter is an absolute shambles with regards to clarity :eek: It's very detailed in disputing my points but.........

I'm arguing for the following

13 (c) - 6 points

15 (b) - 9 points

16 (a) - 15 points

Which is what my 1st Welf argued although my 2nd Welf argued

13/14/15/16 all for 8 points.

I'm thinking of chucking in 14 again for good measure but am pushing for the Support Group this time!

I've been awarded 1st Tribunal 6 for 13 and 9 for 16, 2nd tribunal 9 points for both 14 & 15. I've never been to a Tribunal as a Clerk of the Court normally calls me on the day of the Tribunal saying it's been decided on pre-hearing vetting so........

To complicate matters I've not claimed Universal Credit as I have a fit note from my GP so have been living off my DLA and savings. Plus I have managed to convince the "local living team" that I need help so have an appointment with an NHS psychiatrist next week.

I know I can get ESA back in payment at assessment rate plus SDP (not payable under UC) once my appeal is lodged.

My big problem is that until that appointment my only brush with mental health and reports was a private psychiatrist who tired to push BPD and me back into the NHS in 2014 who'd already refused to treat me. I then got tested by the local CMHT who asked me to tell them a story, count backwards in 12s from 120, then produced a report 2 months later which made the WCA look like something from master mind .

I don't know!
 
Hi Ergo Proxy That's all very technical for me, but I hope someone here has some useful advice for you.

I vaguely recall the point scoring system though not all the details. Do you have a link to what all the numbers mean, are they the question numbers?

Glad you have an appt next week. Do you / or could you get any support from Mind or any other groups who might be able to help?
 
What a shambles with the letter, and what a agonisingly long process. Sorry, I'm not up on all the technicalities either, how many points do you need to qualify for the Support Group? I hope you get it. Have you tried Benefits and Work Home they're very good. I have membership if you need access to any of the membership-only guides (on how to fill in ESA/PIP forms), give me a shout.

Doesn't sound good your previous brush with the CMHT. But hopefully you'll get someone more useful this time. Probably you already will, but make sure you tell them everything relevant, taking a list of everything you want to mention can be helpful. I've had (what I thought were) poor supporting letters from them, but did manage to get Support Group (on the exemption clauses that being found fit for work/work related activity would present a substantial risk to my mental health, not sure if these still exist, this was a couple of years ago).
 
chainsawjob said:
Sorry, I'm not up on all the technicalities either, how many points do you need to qualify for the Support Group?
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"Qualifying for the support group of employment and support allowance (ESA)is not about scoring points. Instead, if the decision maker accepts that any of the following descriptors apply to you, then you will be placed in the support group."

Support group descriptors
 
Thanks for the link Jackobi - I'm going to look through everything tomorrow and work out an action plan. As long as I get a new report from Friday which hopefully backs up my last Psychiatrist report from late 2013 I should be good to go evidence wise. Whilst not at the time of the decision the new report if it links to/ties in with/supports an earlier report the Tribunal panel may consider it if they so wish as being relevant. Worth a shot imho!

Just got to counter how telling the GP who did my WCA that having 1/2 a grapefruit for breakfast and a banana the day before lets a Decision Maker deduce that I'm a god dam sexual Tyrannosaur in the kitchen that appears on Iron Chef and the Great British bake off every night!


friendofdorothy no the only help and support I get has been either paying for it myself out of benefits or non. I don't have a very high opinion of local mental health teams! Although I've researched the Psychiatrist I see next week and I'm actually quite optimistic - he's a bally foreigner with extensive credentials and experience all over the world. All good in my books! Plus thanks to somebody posting a copy of the DSM V5 (in a completely random Brixton forum thread) I actually figured out that what's happening to me exists and that unlike IAPTs' narrow beliefs it's accepted that it exists too!

which is nice (well not nice) but I can pretty much (thanks to Reddit mental health topics on top of the DSM v5) explain now exactly what's happening. Only taken 10 years but hey you just can't get the staff nower days :facepalm:


Good luck with the PIP appeal WouldBe.
 
Ergo Proxy said:
Thanks for the link Jackobi - I'm going to look through everything tomorrow and work out an action plan. As long as I get a new report from Friday which hopefully backs up my last Psychiatrist report from late 2013 I should be good to go evidence wise. Whilst not at the time of the decision the new report if it links to/ties in with/supports an earlier report the Tribunal panel may consider it if they so wish as being relevant. Worth a shot imho!

Just got to counter how telling the GP who did my WCA that having 1/2 a grapefruit for breakfast and a banana the day before lets a Decision Maker deduce that I'm a god dam sexual Tyrannosaur in the kitchen that appears on Iron Chef and the Great British bake off every night!


friendofdorothy no the only help and support I get has been either paying for it myself out of benefits or non. I don't have a very high opinion of local mental health teams! Although I've researched the Psychiatrist I see next week and I'm actually quite optimistic - he's a bally foreigner with extensive credentials and experience all over the world. All good in my books! Plus thanks to somebody posting a copy of the DSM V5 (in a completely random Brixton forum thread) I actually figured out that what's happening to me exists and that unlike IAPTs' narrow beliefs it's accepted that it exists too!

which is nice (well not nice) but I can pretty much (thanks to Reddit mental health topics on top of the DSM v5) explain now exactly what's happening. Only taken 10 years but hey you just can't get the staff nower days :facepalm:


Good luck with the PIP appeal WouldBe.
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Good luck
 
friendofdorothy said:
obviously our lovely govt would prefer to pay money as profits to private companies than to ill people, and pay for by cutting benefits to those in need. Does any one know if the govts total costs of this cruel process has actually saved the the taxpayer anything at all?
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I suspect any 'savings' are dwarfed by the amounts paid out in pensions.

If there are any, of course, I bet there aren't.
 
friendofdorothy said:
obviously our lovely govt would prefer to pay money as profits to private companies than to ill people, and pay for by cutting benefits to those in need. Does any one know if the govts total costs of this cruel process has actually saved the the taxpayer anything at all?
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AAV: How Iain Duncan Smith's Reign of Terror costs far more to administer than it will ever save

The administration fees alone are set to total over £1.6 billion by March 2018, yet the government's own figures indicate that their fit-to-work regime is unlikely to even save £1 billion in reduced disability benefits payouts by May 2020.
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The fact that the Tories demeaning and discriminatory regime for sick and disabled people costs far more in corporate administration fees than they will ever save in reduced benefits payments proves what most sensible people knew all along: Iain Duncan Smith's so-called welfare reforms have nothing to do with the stated objectives of "helping people" and "saving money", and everything to do with diverting as much of the taxpayer funded welfare budget to corporate interests as possible.
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Also AAV: The cost of Tory malice
 
Got round to opening the pack of information from the DWP for my PIP tribunal. Makes interesting reading. Apparently I change sex at one point in the ATOS assessment. :eek:

Nurse notes I walked to assessment room by leaning on the wall but then concludes there is nothing wrong with my walking ability. :mad:

DWP decided to throw out the transcript of recording as they didn't have a copy of the tape to verify the transcript and ATOS have no record of me requesting the assessment be recorded, even though they have included the PIP form which clearly states it will be recorded, a covering letter saying it will be recorded and the assessment was delayed for ~30 mins while ATOS got the OK from the DWP to record it. How many copies of the recording do they fucking want. :mad:

So I'll now have to go through the 189 pages of shit with a fine tooth comb to counter all their bullshit. :mad:

Can I delay my tribunal to 2018? :eek: :mad::(
 
WouldBe said:
Got round to opening the pack of information from the DWP for my PIP tribunal. Makes interesting reading. Apparently I change sex at one point in the ATOS assessment. :eek:

Nurse notes I walked to assessment room by leaning on the wall but then concludes there is nothing wrong with my walking ability. :mad:

DWP decided to throw out the transcript of recording as they didn't have a copy of the tape to verify the transcript and ATOS have no record of me requesting the assessment be recorded, even though they have included the PIP form which clearly states it will be recorded, a covering letter saying it will be recorded and the assessment was delayed for ~30 mins while ATOS got the OK from the DWP to record it. How many copies of the recording do they fucking want. :mad:

So I'll now have to go through the 189 pages of shit with a fine tooth comb to counter all their bullshit. :mad:

Can I delay my tribunal to 2018? :eek: :mad::(
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Well done for facing it. Sounds like shit - I wish you strength to deal with their fuckwittery. Good luck.
 
WouldBe said:
Got round to opening the pack of information from the DWP for my PIP tribunal. Makes interesting reading. Apparently I change sex at one point in the ATOS assessment. :eek:

Nurse notes I walked to assessment room by leaning on the wall but then concludes there is nothing wrong with my walking ability. :mad:

DWP decided to throw out the transcript of recording as they didn't have a copy of the tape to verify the transcript and ATOS have no record of me requesting the assessment be recorded, even though they have included the PIP form which clearly states it will be recorded, a covering letter saying it will be recorded and the assessment was delayed for ~30 mins while ATOS got the OK from the DWP to record it. How many copies of the recording do they fucking want. :mad:

So I'll now have to go through the 189 pages of shit with a fine tooth comb to counter all their bullshit. :mad:

Can I delay my tribunal to 2018? :eek: :mad::(
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Dear God, it would be funny if people's lives weren't directly affected. And as for the changing sex half way through, I have no words.

You raise an interesting question though - what happens to the dwp copy of recordings once made? Obviously the claimant copy is kept by the claimant.

I might try to find out...also paging ViolentPanda to see if he knows the answer to this conundrum.
 
equationgirl said:
Dear God, it would be funny if people's lives weren't directly affected. And as for the changing sex half way through, I have no words.

You raise an interesting question though - what happens to the dwp copy of recordings once made? Obviously the claimant copy is kept by the claimant.

I might try to find out...also paging ViolentPanda to see if he knows the answer to this conundrum.
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The recording is supposed to be filed, both digitally and in the original hard copy. They appear to "lose" them before digitally filing them a lot of the time, as they "lost" mine. They also will only accept transcripts of selected portions, not complete transcripts.

WouldBe , the 180+ pages includes all the evidence you've previously sent, so what you need to focus on is the material relating to the original decision and the MR. That's where I totally fucked over the decision-maker, showing that even where I'd corrected false information in the original assessment when I submitted for the MR, they'd paid no attention, and therefore the MR was conducted on the basis of false and incomplete information.
 
ViolentPanda said:
The recording is supposed to be filed, both digitally and in the original hard copy. They appear to "lose" them before digitally filing them a lot of the time, as they "lost" mine. They also will only accept transcripts of selected portions, not complete transcripts.

WouldBe , the 180+ pages includes all the evidence you've previously sent, so what you need to focus on is the material relating to the original decision and the MR. That's where I totally fucked over the decision-maker, showing that even where I'd corrected false information in the original assessment when I submitted for the MR, they'd paid no attention, and therefore the MR was conducted on the basis of false and incomplete information.
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I know this is is news to no-one on this thread but they really are a bunch of cockwombling fuckmuppets for not storing the recordings properly in any format.
 
equationgirl said:
Dear God, it would be funny if people's lives weren't directly affected. And as for the changing sex half way through, I have no words.

You raise an interesting question though - what happens to the dwp copy of recordings once made?
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Nurse didn't even label the tape as to what it was about. So presumably it was filed straight in the bin. :facepalm:

When they claim they have no record of the recording the best part is the last words on the tape are the nurse saying "you can stop recording now." :facepalm:


There is no way on earth I'm letting the original recording out of my possession and I have no way of duplicating the tape. Is there a gizmo that I can download the tape to PC and burn a CD from there? Is there any cheapo software that will allow me to filter the motor noise out to make the recording more legible(?) ?
 
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