Atos Medicals - Questions, Answers and Support

[ViolentPanda]

Sadly, this does not appear to be an isolated incident, judging by the reports on the internet in the press.

In the absence of recordings, however, Atos can claim (untruthfully, obviously) that it was just a misunderstanding on the atos assessor's part, or that the claimant didn't say that, and given that these are some of the most vulnerable people in society, they bank on the fact that not everyone will fight back simply because they are vulnerable.

It's state sanctioned bullying, with the taxpayer picking up the tab.

Which is why if called for a medical, I'll request a recording, and take a laptop with me. That way, if the recorder is broken, I can record the assessment to the HDD, and give the assessor a copy on a memory stick. Worth the price of a cheap memory stick, and they can hardly protest, as it's merely my apparatus being used rather than theirs.

 

[equationgirl]

Which is why if called for a medical, I'll request a recording, and take a laptop with me. That way, if the recorder is broken, I can record the assessment to the HDD, and give the assessor a copy on a memory stick. Worth the price of a cheap memory stick, and they can hardly protest, as it's merely my apparatus being used rather than theirs.

Cracking plan VP

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Which is why if called for a medical, I'll request a recording, and take a laptop with me. That way, if the recorder is broken, I can record the assessment to the HDD, and give the assessor a copy on a memory stick. Worth the price of a cheap memory stick, and they can hardly protest, as it's merely my apparatus being used rather than theirs.

But if they've done away with recording and have said you're not allowed to record it yourself (and a woman has quoted verbatim a letter she received saying you're not allowed to), then they may just decide they're not going to assess you, unless they get advice about you giving them a copy on a memory stick first, and that'll really fuck things up (although it could delay your assessment while they seek legal advice as to whether you can do it)

 

[equationgirl]

But if they've done away with recording and have said you're not allowed to record it yourself (and a woman has quoted verbatim a letter she received saying you're not allowed to), then they may just decide they're not going to assess you, unless they get advice about you giving them a copy on a memory stick first, and that'll really fuck things up (although it could delay your assessment while they seek legal advice as to whether you can do it)

But why can't it be recorded, if equipment is provided at no cost to atos by the claimant? What do they have to hide?

Equally, why do they ask doctors to sign the official secrets act when it's not a contractual requirement by the government?

 

[ViolentPanda]

But if they've done away with recording and have said you're not allowed to record it yourself (and a woman has quoted verbatim a letter she received saying you're not allowed to), then they may just decide they're not going to assess you, unless they get advice about you giving them a copy on a memory stick first, and that'll really fuck things up (although it could delay your assessment while they seek legal advice as to whether you can do it)

They haven't done away with it (yet), and until they do (something I and many others will make sure we contest VERY LOUDLY!!!), I'm perfectly within my rights to take my own equipment in case their is faulty.

E2A. Given my memory problems (same with himself!), then their providing recording equipment, or me providing my own recording equipment should amount to a "reasonable adjustment" to compensate for my memory problems under the Disability Discrimination Act.

Hmm, that one may be worth pursuing further.

 

[ViolentPanda]

But why can't it be recorded, if equipment is provided at no cost to atos by the claimant? What do they have to hide?

Everything, hence the farce of ony having 11 recording machines in the entire UK.

Equally, why do they ask doctors to sign the official secrets act when it's not a contractual requirement by the government?

If they were direct employees, there's a case for it - to bind you from giving out patient details, but I can't see how they can compel conractors other than through "if you don't sign, you don't get any work".

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

But why can't it be recorded, if equipment is provided at no cost to atos by the claimant? What do they have to hide?

Equally, why do they ask doctors to sign the official secrets act when it's not a contractual requirement by the government?

Well quite, and their response to recording of assessments is:

I am writing further to Rhian Davies’ letter of the 29th June in response to your
concerns regarding your Work Capability Assessment (WCA) appointment.

I am sorry that on this occasion Atos is unable to meet your request for an
audio recording of your Work Capability Assessment on 20107/2012.

The Department for Work and Pensions has asked Atos Healthcare to try and
accommodate requests for audio recordings where this is made in advance of
the assessment. A limited facility to audio record was introduced by the
Department for Work and Pensions at a time when only small numbers of
requests.were anticipated and since that time the number of requests has
increased significantly. This has put pressure on our ability to provide
sufficient capacity to meet all requests. The DWP have therefore requested
that we inform customers when a recording cannot be made, and in these
circumstances, that the WCA process should continue. This will ensure your
claim is dealt with in a timely manner. The DWP decision maker will take into
account all available evidence in deciding your claim.

In view of security and confidentiality considerations Atos does not permit the
recording of WCAs by a customer using their own recording devices.
However, it is permissible for you, or your representative, to take notes during
an assessment for your own use.

The DWP are currently looking at ways to improve the availability of audio
recording in the short term and Atos Healthcare remains committed to assist
the DWP in the evaluation of the audio recording of Work Capability
Assessments later in the year.

Yours sincerely

Gemma Bowes
Customer Relations Manager
On behalf of Natalie Gorshkov-Vickers

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

They haven't done away with it (yet), and until they do (something I and many others will make sure we contest VERY LOUDLY!!!), I'm perfectly within my rights to take my own equipment in case their is faulty.

E2A. Given my memory problems (same with himself!), then their providing recording equipment, or me providing my own recording equipment should amount to a "reasonable adjustment" to compensate for my memory problems under the Disability Discrimination Act.

Hmm, that one may be worth pursuing further.

Well I read that ALL ELEVEN machines are broken and are apparently not being replaced

 

[equationgirl]

Well I read that ALL ELEVEN machines are broken and are apparently not being replaced

Yeah, I read that too. Surely it's just a cost-saving exercise though? What's wrong with having a recording device in each assessment room, with a stac of recording media?

It's not difficult or technically complex, they simply don't want to. Buying 11 machines for what, 140 centres, was simply a panacea for the DWP. They had zero intention of contemporaneous recording facilities being made available to claimants long-term.

But then my mind is extremely suspicious

 

[equationgirl]

Oh yes, and this weekend I've actually managed 2 good days instead of the usual 1 or none, my first since Easter.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Well I read that ALL ELEVEN machines are broken and are apparently not being replaced

In which case, if Atos cannot provide the facilities for the recording of an assessment, as is any claimant's current right, that's their problem. I'm within my rights, however hard they try and coerce me, to refuse to be assessed without my assessment being recorded, whether that's on my equipment or theirs.
They expect people to fold, but most of us (IB/ESA claimants) are now in a situation where we can't, physically or emotionally, afford to fold.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

They had zero intention of contemporaneous recording facilities being made available to claimants long-term.

But then my mind is extremely suspicious

No suspicious at all. I reckon everyone's thinking the same

 

[equationgirl]

My MP still hasn't signed the Early day Motion 295 about ATOS. I'm giving them the benefit (LOL) of the doubt, given that they might be on holiday but 49 MPs have now signed the motion.

http://www.parliament.uk/edm/2012-13/295

 

[audiotech]

But why can't it be recorded, if equipment is provided at no cost to atos by the claimant? What do they have to hide?

Some poor practitioners, who may damage their corporate image further?

 

[Greebo]

My MP still hasn't signed the Early day Motion 295 about ATOS. I'm giving them the benefit (LOL) of the doubt, given that they might be on holiday but 49 MPs have now signed the motion.

http://www.parliament.uk/edm/2012-13/295

Neither has mine (Chuka Umunna). Given that he's now a minister of something or other I only half expected him to sign the EDM, but even so.

 

[yardbird]

The recording situation has been my fight with ATOS long before it came to precedence.
If ATOS had 11 working recording machines, then surely it is their responsibility to keep them in working order.
Why are they are broken??
Just a trifle convenient isn't it?

If ATOS are not capable of taking care of 12 pieces of (pretty basic) tech machinery , then htf can they be trusted with giving opinions on minds and bodies which are a tad more complex?

Well convenient that the machines are fucked innit?
Carefully dropped so as to make the pesky machines useless?
Surely it will be difficult to argue against us recording by ourselves?

 

[equationgirl]

The recording situation has been my fight with ATOS long before it came to precedence.
If ATOS had 11 working recording machines, then surely it is their responsibility to keep them in working order.
Why are they are broken??
Just a trifle convenient isn't it?

If ATOS are not capable of taking care of 12 pieces of (pretty basic) tech machinery , then htf can they be trusted with giving opinions on minds and bodies which are a tad more complex?

Well convenient that the machines are fucked innit?
Carefully dropped so as to make the pesky machines useless?
Surely it will be difficult to argue against us recording by ourselves?

Yeah, bunch of lying gobshites in my opinion - my suspicious mind is wondering about the coincidence of all being broken at the same time, whilst my mathematical mind is curious about the statistical probability of 12 identical devices all being broken at once.

I'd love to know how they get them between sites as well - surely all the shipping costs mount up?

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Yeah, bunch of lying gobshites in my opinion - my suspicious mind is wondering about the coincidence of all being broken at the same time, whilst my mathematical mind is curious about the statistical probability of 12 identical devices all being broken at once.

I'd love to know how they get them between sites as well - surely all the shipping costs mount up?

I think someone suggested on another site that maybe the excuse for them all being fucked is the way they were manhandled by delivery drivers

 

[audiotech]

Atos management infiltrator? How convenient. Blame 'white van man'.

 

[quimcunx]

Not if you're only recording for your own use/records. You do need permission if you're going to use the recording "for training purposes" etc, or otherwise publish it.

Just been looking at this because I thought for private individuals as long as one party (yourself) knew it was being recorded that was fine. But it seems that's ok if it's just for you, or to play back to the other party, but not if you share with a third party, which it's quite possible you might during appeal processes or whatever.

I've only kept up with this thread sporadically but the little I've read absolutely fucking enrages me. If anyone needs equipment for recording either phone calls or assessments and can source a cheapish one but can't afford one (you know what with being on benefits and all) I'd be glad to buy one or two as a donation to the cause depending on price.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Just been looking at this because I thought for private individuals as long as one party (yourself) knew it was being recorded that was fine. But it seems that's ok if it's just for you, or to play back to the other party, but not if you share with a third party, which it's quite possible you might during appeal processes or whatever.

I've only kept up with this thread sporadically but the little I've read absolutely fucking enrages me. If anyone needs equipment for recording either phone calls or assessments and can source a cheapish one but can't afford one (you know what with being on benefits and all) I'd be glad to buy one or two as a donation to the cause depending on price.

That's very nice of you Quimmy. I'd like a top of the range covert spycam please, maybe in the form of glasses

 

[quimcunx]

That's very nice of you Quimmy. I'd like a top of the range covert spycam please, maybe in the form of glasses

If you can find it for under 20 sovs it's yours, minnie.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

$100 over budget

http://www.spyville.com/spy-camera-eyeglasses.html

 

[quimcunx]

unlucky.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

unlucky.

They're probably too big for my head anyway

 

[audiotech]

This sticky shouldn't be distracted too much with a comedy slot IMHO, so there's this to ponder:

Upcoming changes to the benefit appeals process.

 

[audiotech]

Noticed this: 'PCS Union to ballot Atos staff for strike action'.

By sponsoring the Olympics, Atos is trying to buff up its image and associate itself with the ‘spirit of the Games’. The reality of course is very different because, while company executives and shareholders cream off the profits, Atos is condemning the rest of its staff to poverty pay. It’s a scandal that, at the same time, this company is taking millions of pounds of our money to help the government cut vital benefits for sick and disabled people.

http://socialwelfareunion.org/archives/652

 

[toggle]

This sticky shouldn't be distracted too much with a comedy slot IMHO, so there's this to ponder:

Upcoming changes to the benefit appeals process.

The government’s interim response to the consultation indicates that there will be no time limit by which the DWP must complete a revision request, nor will there be provision for Employment and Support Allowance to be paid pending the outcome of the revision.

so they can basically sit on the case and delay it until the claimant has to give up or starve.

 

[audiotech]

The 'freedom to starve' is now official is it?

 

[audiotech]

It's difficult keeping up to speed on all this. Is the present coalition government attempting to redefine disability in economic terms?

http://loanwolffe.blogspot.co.uk/2012/07/british-government-attempt-at.html