seventh bullet
sovietwave
Solely the creation of the ISI?
The Fragmentation of Afghanistan - Barnett R. Rubin
Afghan Communism and Soviet Intervention - Henry S. Bradsher
Taliban: The Power of Militant Islam in Afghanistan and Beyond - Ahmed Rashid
And next, Syria?
- Thread starter Idris2002
- Start date
Solely the creation of the ISI?
The Fragmentation of Afghanistan - Barnett R. Rubin
Afghan Communism and Soviet Intervention - Henry S. Bradsher
Taliban: The Power of Militant Islam in Afghanistan and Beyond - Ahmed Rashid
Idris2002
canadian girlfriend
As far as I know, yes. Can't really see what the yanks would gain by it, though I do recall Clinton welcoming the Taliban's seizure of Kabul, claiming it might be good for stability.
Nigel
For A Degenerates' Workers State
Transitional demand: Not what is deemed 'possible' but what is necessary!
Yuwipi Woman
Whack-A-Mole Queen
Map of all the countries John McCain has wanted to attack:
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/09/john-mccain-world-attack-map-syria
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/09/john-mccain-world-attack-map-syria
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
and the turks, hundreds of tonnes of arms came over the Turkish border a few weeks ago . And the zionists are doing their bit too .
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
nice one
His today we are all Georgians pronouncement is one I fondly remember . I was sitting in a bar in Belgrade watching the telly when his big head was on the screen coming out with that . Safe to say it was met with some derision, not least from myself who winged a beer mat at the screen , which endeared me to the locals more than a bit . Neither myself , the smattering of cubans or the boisterous serbs...whod just burned down the US embassy up the street a few months earlier..seemed to feel particularly Georgian on the day in question . The mad prick .
jesus
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
hes insane . What on earth were those Vietnamese thinking of letting that mad cunt loose on the world . He should still be in a bamboo cage getting poked with sticks, the nut.
Yuwipi Woman
Whack-A-Mole Queen
I wouldn't go that far. I used to have some respect for him because he sponsored a bill in the 90s that returned some power to Indian Country. Not any more. I would say its a damn good thing he's not allowed anywhere near the "football."
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
just imagine him at the controls, with Palin giving him advice...
Yuwipi Woman
Whack-A-Mole Queen
In an odd way Sarah Palin saved the world. As soon as she joined the ticket, McCain's chances of winning election were gone. It was so clear that she didn't have two brain cells to rub together, that it drove everyone away.
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
I ..think I..recall reading a book by a Pakistani General who was up to his neck in the arms supply business against the soviets, and a claim that the CIA had directed the newly formed Taliban to a massive Soviet arms cache located in some caves . That was supposedly a pivotal moment in their formation .
Jeb Bush invited them to Florida once as an attempt at an image makeover . Despite his best efforts they didnt seem to go down well with the locals . Have a vague memory of tv footage of some woman who challenged them on womens rights being told to mind her place or something .
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
a number of reports I read claimed that it began one day when some mujahideen warlords men at a checkpoint ..post soviet withdrawal.. had yet again abducted a local boy for use as their sex slave ..or something like that . The one eyed guy gathered up a few rifles and Islamic students and went down to sort them out . Thing sort of took off from there . As it gathered pace then the ISI and CIA got behind it . The first wave of them came directly from the madrassa Islmaic schools an were widely welcomed by those in the hinterlands as they sought to restore order and end corruption at the hands of warlord rule.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
You've been reading Kamal Matinuddin's outdated The Taliban Phenomenon, which gives a very general overview. The large arms cache you're referring to was raided and captured on their own initiative in 1994? It belonged to warlord Gulbuddin Hekmatyar.
The immediate motivation for Taliban action in Afghanistan were abuses by warlord militiamen in and near Kandahar. The incident you're referring to was the abduction, robbery, rape and murder of an entire family travelling from Herat, who were stopped at a checkpoint not far from the city. Mullah Omar is supposed to have made sure the bodies of the victims received a proper burial and gathered a small band of fighters.
By the way, you still haven't responded to my post here, from last week.
The immediate motivation for Taliban action in Afghanistan were abuses by warlord militiamen in and near Kandahar. The incident you're referring to was the abduction, robbery, rape and murder of an entire family travelling from Herat, who were stopped at a checkpoint not far from the city. Mullah Omar is supposed to have made sure the bodies of the victims received a proper burial and gathered a small band of fighters.
By the way, you still haven't responded to my post here, from last week.
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Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
no the book I was reading barely mentions the Taliban except towards the end and was written before 9 11 , essentially a semi autobiography of that generals role in the conflict . The general claimed there were a few dozen soviet trucks laden to the gills hidden in a cave system and the yanks tipped them off as to its location . It mostly concentrates on the arms supplies to the Muhahideen during their anti soviet campaign and the Pakistani armies role in facilitating it . Much overlooked in that affair was the role of China, who supplied near enough as much as stuff as the Yanks and Brits combined . As well as sending in trainers . China expended a pretty massive effort there and to a large extent still calls a lot of the shots as to what the pakistanis get up to . Its strategic interests in Pakistan and therefore afghanistan far outweigh any US or British interest . Pakistan is seen by China as their Israel .
But anyway none of this has anything whatsoever to do with Syria , and on a day when the thing seems to be taking some pretty dramatic turns maybe thats what we should be focussing on in this thread . Putin apparently digging Obama out of a massive hole hed just dug for himself . And the region possibly being saved from a massive catastrophe that US pride and stupidity couldnt extricate itself from .
Yep, gotta save them Christians. They're definitely the main target of the opposition.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
Fair enough. Earlier I thought you were on about the Taliban conquest of the country in the 1990s.
J Ed
Follow Back Pro Expropriation
audiotech
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'Assad regime accepts Russian plan on chemical weapons'.
http://www.democracynow.org/2013/9/10/as_assad_regime_accepts_russian_plan
http://www.democracynow.org/2013/9/10/as_assad_regime_accepts_russian_plan
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
heres an interesting account from 2 kidnapped europeans, one a teacher and one a journalist, who were kidnapped by the Islamists, one of whom describes himself as a fierce supporter of the FSA . They claim that while they were being held they overheard a conversation via skype between their captors and an FSA general that indicated to them the jihadists had carried out the Ghouta chemical attack as a deliberate provocation .
http://rt.com/news/chemical-weapons-rebels-captives-632/
Hard to know what to make of that as both would certainly have obvious grudges against their captors. At the same time though if the account is made up thats a pretty massive fib for 2 men to be telling just days after their release from captivity and all those beatings and mock executions .
http://rt.com/news/chemical-weapons-rebels-captives-632/
Hard to know what to make of that as both would certainly have obvious grudges against their captors. At the same time though if the account is made up thats a pretty massive fib for 2 men to be telling just days after their release from captivity and all those beatings and mock executions .
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
saving christians is the task of jesus.
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
there was never any doubt theyd accept the Russian plan, as its apparent that stockpile has long been more a major liability than an asset . But it remains to be seen whether the west will accept it .
Almost right away there seems to be wrangling over UNSC motions were yet again the western powers seem intent on wording that places blame for the massacre on the Syrian government...without proof..and seeks to use the plan to get rid of the weapons as a possible pretext for war . Thats completely unacceptable to Syria or Russia so its still an uphill struggle . Syria and Russia want rid of the weapons so as to remove them as a pretext for war, their enemies are seeking to retain them in a sense as a pretext for war . Their strategic importance is much more in the wests interests than Assads .
The important thing is though it seems to have taken a fair amount of wind out of the sails of the pro war lobby for the moment and stalled that momentum . It can only make Obamas case for war even more difficult in congress if theres an obvious alternative to it . If the Russians dont budge an inch and insist the issue is dealt with under chapter 6 of the conventions as opposed to chapter 7..which Saddam was subject to..then theres a possibility this issue canbe put to bed for good as opposed to being used as a pretext . All up to the Russians and their resolve here .
camouflage
gaslit at scale.
Frankly I wouldn't be surprised if after the weapons are destroyed there is another chemical attack again blamed on the Syrians so the US can say 'see, they kept some back, now we bomb'.
Still, marvellously wrong-stepped for now. Got to admire the spin though... 'see, our constant war-mongering has brought results'.
Right, & there wasn't much wind in the pro war lobby sails to begin with considering they have no evidence other than saying they have it & they can't explain what this limited strike would accomplish. This thing will just peter out hopefully.
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
thats why the wording of any resolution is vital
thats why it was a definite face saver for them , and most likely conceived as one. The more of that talk the better in my view . They can claim that one as their victory .
Theres reports circulating that Putin actually suggested this to a lonely and forlorn Obama when he was in Russia . If so it would appear to have been a well exercised stroke . He picked off his last ally France and then when fully isolated gave him an alternative to isolation and humiliation . He can avoid his enemies in congress now too. If they fuck this one up they are truly mad .
Then again they might be stupid enough to take the view its a sign of weakness on their opponents part and try and pile the pressure on, as theyve been known to do in the past . That I believe wont lead to any more concessions and quite possibly a show of defiance .
I was against it too but it has indeed brought results.
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
well the result it may have brought is permitting the Syrians and Russians to get rid of a weapon that was a serious liability, a chink in their armour so to speak . Getting rid of them will in many ways make Syria stronger and less prone to attack. The west plainly couldnt give a fuck about them as a threat because it turns out Britian has been selling them the chemicals for the past 6 years, and was still selling them after the trouble broke out .
Getting rid of syrias chemical weapons has never been a western objective .
Interesting. And the US (& possibly Britain ?) sold chemicals for weapons to Saddam & then screamed 'He has WMD & gassed his own people.....invade!'
The increasingly impressive Bernie Sanders comments on the Syria situation. Thought i'd share it here.
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
yup, in the modern age theyre more a liability than a deterrent . The Russian and Syrian initiative is pretty much an admission of that reality .
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
Putin is making clear the price for surrender and disposal of the arsenal is for the western powers to forego any notion of attacking Syria . Seems more than fair to me .
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