Amanda Knox Is Innocent

[ViolentPanda]

She came in too the house took off her shoes then went into Kercher's room and deliberately stepped in her blood? Plausible?

She could have come into the house, gone to her own room, taken her shoes off, then gone to Kercher's room to see how she was/beg a fiver/who know's what, and come across Ms. Kercher dead.
No-one has said anything about anyone "deliberately" stepping in blood, Joe. Engage with what people write, not with what you're fantasising they've written, eh?

 

[ViolentPanda]

Uncontested? Right, so the other flatmate, Ms Romanelli, and the postal police are all in on the conspiracy to convict Knox! And they all perjured themselves, right?

Was anyone not in on the conspiracy?

I bet even the Pope was, the American-hating bastard!

 

[eskdave]

I didn't realize that Cardiff was in the east midlands.

Actuallaly,Boyo, its in the West Midlands

 

[Anudder Oik]

Also, when the mobile phone police called at the flat they were told by Knox and BF that they had themselves just called the police. Phone records refute this. They apparently went into the other room, then called the police. The whole place stank of bleach. Knox had removed the mop from the flat.

People who believe them guilty think that they were finishing the clean up and staging the break in. There was, however, blood still visible in different parts of the flat.

 

[eskdave]

I have been reading your posts on this thread because I consider you to be very levelled headed and consistant as a poster....one thing that gets me is that....Had I been at the home or and with my newish BF I would not think to change that story at all. The idea that two people relatively newly together spent a night at home together with their phones off is the most believable thing ever....which is why their changing statements is weird.

One could argue that their statement changes were due to manipulative questioning techniques, sure... There are though things that certainly feel odd about this and whether it's DNA evidence, changing stories and the type of injuries that MK had which are consistant with there being more than one person involved...I don't believe we have the full picture of what happened at all.


Kicking and screaming...Knox will not return to Italy any other way...regardless of whether she was involved in this or not...I imagine Meredith would have wanted to kick and scream for her life too.

When was the report submitted?

Any kind of privilege means tosh

 

[eskdave]

Sorry folks I am drunk again ,sorry for spurious comments,somehow relieves my pain-I dont know,anything now -I get the discussion/argument/-but I am old-wtf.

 

[Joe Reilly]

To find out what was going on / exercise some control over the scene / play the part of shocked flatmates.

So their over-riding concern was not to delay the discovery of the body?

 

[spanglechick]

I'm not a stoner - how plausible are the various claims that Sollicito didn't know whether Knox was there or not on the night?

Because while i see little evidence that either of them committed murder, there's so much about their versions of events that just don't add up. They weren't using the computer in the evening, they weren't where they said they were when they used their phones, they were up and about very early the next day when they claimed to have slept til late, they said they'd called the carabineri when they almost certainly hadn't yet, and then you have what seems to me utterly implausible 'I don't remember' sections. Like they were in alcoholic blackouts?

And then it seems very clear that someone - not Guede - staged the break in and locked Kercher's bedroom door. And highly likely that someone other than Guede repositioned the body and stripped off her bra quite some time after she died.


And I don't know why Sollicito and Knox would've covered things up, but it seems pretty likely that they're lying about some things, when all the incentives are there for then to tell the truth.

 

[Joe Reilly]

She could have come into the house, gone to her own room, taken her shoes off, then gone to Kercher's room to see how she was/beg a fiver/who know's what, and come across Ms. Kercher dead.
No-one has said anything about anyone "deliberately" stepping in blood, Joe. Engage with what people write, not with what you're fantasising they've written, eh?

Anyone that opens a door a sees a body covered in blood, with pools of it on the floor, would have to make a conscious and thus deliberate decision to proceed. if she stepped on the blood it would have left a foot-print and possible DNA trace of her in the room first of all.

But as we know there was no footprint of hers in the room and the foot-prints in the hall tested negative for Kercher's blood.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

I'm not a stoner - how plausible are the various claims that Sollicito didn't know whether Knox was there or not on the night

Really not very plausible at all. I spent my early 20s pretty much constantly stoned and I never forgot where I was or who I was with, the vast, vast majority of stoners, IMO, would say the same thing. Fine if I was at a party I won't remember all who was there but if it was just me and someone else, like it was for Sollicito, then there's no chance i'd be unsure.

Because while i see little evidence that either of them committed murder, there's so much about their versions of events that just don't add up. They weren't using the computer in the evening, they weren't where they said they were when they used their phones, they were up and about very early the next day when they claimed to have slept til late, they said they'd called the carabineri when they almost certainly hadn't yet, and then you have what seems to me utterly implausible 'I don't remember' sections. Like they were in alcoholic blackouts?

And then it seems very clear that someone - not Guede - staged the break in and locked Kercher's bedroom door. And highly likely that someone other than Guede repositioned the body and stripped off her bra quite some time after she died.

And I don't know why Sollicito and Knox would've covered things up, but it seems pretty likely that they're lying about some things, when all the incentives are there for then to tell the truth.

Quite, I'm not convinced they committed the murder either but I am convinced they know more than they're letting on.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

But as we know there was no footprint of hers in the room and the foot-prints in the hall tested negative for Kercher's blood.

Yeah still waiting for you to show that the test was negative. Not saying I don't believe you but you must've read it somewhere. Would you also care to explain why Kercher's blood was mixed with Knox's in the bathroom?

 

[Joe Reilly]

*sighs* Can't you get anything right?

No motive.
No witnesses.
No confession.
No forensics.
No murder weapon.

But none of it makes a blind bit of difference to you. You still think your on top of things.

Your like a guy who after watching 12 Angry Men continues to argue: "I dont care what Henry Fonda says I still think he had something to do with it'.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

No motive.

Not true. Apparently one has been established at this recent trial

No witnesses.

None to the actual deed, no but that's hardly unusual. There are witnesses that place them near the scene, running from the house etc. Whether credible or not is another matter

No confession.

And? Again that means nothing

No forensics.

Completely false and you know it

No murder weapon.

I'm guessing that kitchen knife presented as evidence passed you by then?

I accept that all these things are contested but you're talking bollocks to say they don't exist otherwise there would've been no court case to begin with. Mind you have been talking bollocks quite a lot through out this thread. You're exactly the same as what you accuse PK and Oik of being just in reverse.

 

[Fez909]

But as we know there was no footprint of hers in the room and the foot-prints in the hall tested negative for Kercher's blood.

Even in the appeal court judgement which disallowed the luminol footprints to used as evidence they say that Meridith's blood was present.

As for the footprints revealed by luminol, the Hellmann Court of Appeal judges held that
these traces were also the result of probable contamination; that the negative response of
the generic blood test was not due to the scarcity of biological material available, since the
test using tetramethylbenzide is sensitive even in the presence of just five red blood cells;
that a mixed trace with a mixed biological profile, belonging to [both] Meredith and
Amanda, appeared in only two instances, while the one relating to only Amanda appeared
in four other instances. The quantity of available DNA was not sufficient to provide a
reliable result, so that even the footprints in question were not considered to have any
evidentiary value.

Page 17 of the report which I linked you to earlier.

 

[Theisticle]

Not sure if this has been posted, but I couldn't believe how bias the Guardian is being over this story.

Pro-Knox piece: http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-sollecito-case-harsh-verdict-italian-justice

Buried at the very bottom: Andrew Gumbel was co-author of Raffaele Sollecito's account of the case, Honor Bound: My Journey to Hell and Back with Amanda Knox

It's amazing how the media in this country have fallen for the PR. It's not the least bit objective.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Anyone that opens a door a sees a body covered in blood, with pools of it on the floor, would have to make a conscious and thus deliberate decision to proceed.

In Joe-world, maybe.
In the real world, people may be so stunned by what confronts them, that logic goes out of the window, and they do something counter-intuitive.

if she stepped on the blood it would have left a foot-print and possible DNA trace of her in the room first of all.

Yep, if she stepped in it/came into contact with it in the room ("deliberately" or not).

But as we know there was no footprint of hers in the room and the foot-prints in the hall tested negative for Kercher's blood.

Naughty naughty.

 

[Theisticle]

Here's the pro-Amanda wiki

http://murderofmeredithkercher.com/

 

[Anudder Oik]

 

[Treacle Toes]

I'm not a stoner - how plausible are the various claims that Sollicito didn't know whether Knox was there or not on the night?

In one of his statements he said she did go out.

Because while i see little evidence that either of them committed murder, there's so much about their versions of events that just don't add up. They weren't using the computer in the evening, they weren't where they said they were when they used their phones, they were up and about very early the next day when they claimed to have slept til late, they said they'd called the carabineri when they almost certainly hadn't yet, and then you have what seems to me utterly implausible 'I don't remember' sections. Like they were in alcoholic blackouts?

Quite.

And then it seems very clear that someone - not Guede - staged the break in and locked Kercher's bedroom door. And highly likely that someone other than Guede repositioned the body and stripped off her bra quite some time after she died.

Aha.

And I don't know why Sollicito and Knox would've covered things up, but it seems pretty likely that they're lying about some things, when all the incentives are there for then to tell the truth.

That's it isn't it?

Even if you panicked, fucked up and did things you shouldn't have at a crime scene... the misremembering and story changing is weird. They did admit they were high though the night before and the night before that.

I've always wondered if they delayed calling the police to get rid of some stuff (their stash) from the cottage, just being there and walking around may have meant they realised they had trod blood about or whatever...you go home, you've been burguled and you get the bleach out? Doesn't make sense at all.

 

[not-bono-ever]

ok them just to add" science" to this in a jermey kyle fashion

http://statement-analysis.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/amanda-knox-statement-analysis-repost.html

 

[Miss Caphat]

What is your point here?

That the lawyer will happily represent people who are guilty of a crime?

That the lawyer is anti-American?

That the 3 years isn't long enough?

just thought it was an interesting tidbit. I don't really know enough to comment.

 

[Treacle Toes]

just thought it was an interesting tidbit. I don't really know enough to comment.

Oh come on lady.

/pours her girl a large rum

Tidbit? You know me better than that....spill!

 

[Fez909]

ok them just to add" science" to this in a jermey kyle fashion

http://statement-analysis.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/amanda-knox-statement-analysis-repost.html

I've been reading "statement analyses" for two days now and I can't make up my mind on them. The main people involved seem to claim things which aren't true (credentials, accreditation, etc) and some of the stuff they highlight looks bollocks. But then, some of it seems OK, too.

Wikipedia is light on details and says it's been condemned as a psuedoscience, but Germany uses a similar kind of thing in their justice system.

The Knox statement and email look very damning, even if you leave out the fruitloop stuff, though.

 

[Miss Caphat]

Oh come on lady.

/pours her girl a large rum

Tidbit? You know me better than that....spill!

no, really.
it seems a bit strange, that they just took the guy's word (if that is what happened) that he fell asleep at the wheel, that he didn't notice he hit anyone, etc. But I know next to nothing about the case.

 

[Treacle Toes]

I agree Fez, I have a very good imagination but some of the statement analysis stuff rings siren loudness alarm bells about the person who wrote them, not Knox.

That said, and what has been repeatedly sad on this thread...despite the obvious stress, shock and confusion...there are some things missing here in terms of the way that AK and RS have interacted with and reported what happened.

 

[Treacle Toes]

no, really.
it seems a bit strange, that they just took the guy's word (if that is what happened) that he fell asleep at the wheel, that he didn't notice he hit anyone, etc. But I know next to nothing about the case.

I know nothing about the case either. But falling asleep at the wheel is not uncommon.

From the article you posted:

Stefanoni, 56, told authorities he fell asleep at the wheel on Sunday when it fatally struck Allison Owens, 23, from Columbus, Ohio, news reports said.

Possibly the impact woke him up and he tried to cover it up. Did he know it was a girl, did he think it was a dog or something? Who knows?

I am still wondering why you posted it though. For sure witnesses and guilty parties are unreliable for any number of reasons...I don't think anyone here is arguing otherwise.

 

[Miss Caphat]

I know nothing about the case either. But falling asleep at the wheel is not uncommon.

so is drunk driving.

and it may be uncommon to fall asleep at the wheel, but it's more uncommon to fall asleep at the wheel and cause someone's death, drive off, repaint the scratches on your car, etc.

 

[Treacle Toes]

so is drunk driving.

and it may be uncommon to fall asleep at the wheel, but it's more uncommon to fall asleep at the wheel and cause someone's death, drive off, repaint the scratches on your car, etc.

Not disagreeing with you at all.

Equally I feel it uncommon to imagine myself cowering in a kitchen listening to my flatmate scream when it didn't happen to me and change my statement, misremeber things etc...

Truth is, in either case neither of us know and may never do.

 

[Miss Caphat]

Oh Jesus Christ.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Oh Jesus Christ.

NO, it's me RM, commonly known as Rutita.