9/11 a conspiracy?

[tef]

As for research specifically on 911, i've done plenty of it.

Regardless how much work you do, you're likely to suffer from a heavy case of observer bias here.

You're said in this thread that you cannot comprehend or accept the giant cock up, or that you "just cannot accept that the towers were brought down."

This pretty means that no matter what evidence gets presented to you, you're going to be biased against it and ignore it, because it goes against your core beliefs and assumptions in this matter.

This shows in your argumentative technique. Where instead of refuting claims, or presenting counter evidence, you ask questions about it's authority:

"How do you know they are 'some of the world's leading demolition experts'? 'Some'? 'Leading'? And how do you know to what degree they are qualified in their 'craft'? How 'extremely' is extremely?"

How do we know they aren't martians who are secretly using unicorn mind control technology? It's very easy to come up with random questions to attack the validity of a statement.

If you really want to find out the truth or what ever comes close to it, you have to be able to accept the possibility that you might be wrong. Objectivity is something to strive for, but it seems you have a foregone conclusion when it comes to the events. Sadly, your research only seems to be aimed at reaffirming your beliefs, rather than evaluating it's merits.

Obligatory: I'm not interested here in debating the events, but I am curious to what you hope to achieve from this plotting and researching?

There are many other groups out there working on their theories and so such. Making and updating documentaries with more and more claims. Going back some, conspiracy theories have been around for ever. It's been many years since JFK was assasinated, and the conspiracies are still abound. Which so far, has changed fuck all.

Regardless of any disagreements on what happened, or how it happened - what do you expect to gain from running with your line of enquiry?

 

[editor]

This pretty means that no matter what evidence gets presented to you, you're going to be biased against it and ignore it, because it goes against your core beliefs and assumptions in this matter.

Classic conspiraloonery, innit?

10 characteristics of conspiracy theorists

6. Inability to tell good evidence from bad. Conspiracy theorists have no place for peer-review, for scientific knowledge, for the respectability of sources. The fact that a claim has been made by anybody, anywhere, is enough for them to reproduce it and demand that the questions it raises be answered, as if intellectual enquiry were a matter of responding to every rumour. While they do this, of course, they will claim to have "open minds" and abuse the sceptics for apparently lacking same.
http://www.urban75.org/info/conspiraloons.html

 

[Lock&Light]

Show me any personal abuse i've levelled at you editor. Or is this another slander?

How can you describe the following as not being personal abuse?

Quote: "Nice expose of the editor here jazzz. Step by step. The most weaseling twisting eel on these threads."

 

[Jazzz]

I bet your looking forward to Icke's book on 911 so you can do further 'research'.

er, he wrote "Alice in Wonderland and the World Trade Centre" years ago. Do keep up!

 

[Jazzz]

I don't need to expose editor...

... he does it all by himself!

 

[Jazzz]

Regardless of any disagreements on what happened, or how it happened - what do you expect to gain from running with your line of enquiry?

Would you ask that to the Jersey Girls, the four widows featured in ?

 

[fela fan]

You do realise almost every one of your posts is about yourself,

Which is of course a cardinal sin in britain.

Either way, a wee case of exaggeration i believe. Or have you kept up with all 10000 of my posts?

Incidentally, i've not read anything by icke, but i thought he was very good at the brixton academy, mind, i've only seen the first part of it.

 

[fela fan]

I bet your looking forward to Icke's book on 911 so you can do further 'research'.

Can you explain why you have inverted commas around research?

 

[Bob_the_lost]

Would you ask that to the Jersey Girls, the four widows featured in ?

Didn't you get pulled up before about using the "jersey girls" and trying to pretend they support anything like your fruitloopery?

 

[Jazzz]

"At first, we widows didn’t want to be seen with conspiracy people. But they kept showing up. They cared more than those supposedly doing the investigating. If you ask me, they’re just Americans, looking for the truth, which is supposed to be our right."

Lorie Van Auken

 

[Bob_the_lost]

"At first, we widows didn’t want to be seen with conspiracy people. But they kept showing up. They cared more than those supposedly doing the investigating. If you ask me, they’re just Americans, looking for the truth, which is supposed to be our right."

Lorie Van Auken

Not the same thing at all as saying they agree with your delusions.

 

[Jazzz]

Not the same thing at all as saying they agree with your delusions.

So what? Why do you think they are 'Pressing for Truth'?

It is the seeking of truth that they are supporting, indeed it is what they are doing.

 

[Bob_the_lost]

So what? Why do you think they are 'Pressing for Truth'?

It is the seeking of truth that they are supporting, indeed it is what they are doing.

Pressing for truth and being stupid enough to sign up with people who think that a tactical nuke was used to destroy the towers is not the same thing at all. The line was:

Regardless of any disagreements on what happened, or how it happened - what do you expect to gain from running with your line of enquiry?

Your line of enquiry is not to ask about the intelligence failures, the lack of forward planning or thought. I think that's what they want to know about. Not how to make hundreds of people and four planes disapear...

Stop fucking weasaling about. You were asked about your line of enquiry.

 

[Jazzz]

Stop fucking weasaling about. You were asked about your line of enquiry.

Where?

 

[Bob_the_lost]

Where?

You don't read these threads at all do you? Or are you playing even more dumb than normal?

 

[Jazzz]

I repeat the question. Where was I asked about my line of enquiry?

 

[Bob_the_lost]

I repeat the question. Where was I asked about my line of enquiry?

Oh good point! Fela was asked, i do appologise.

Still, you were pulled up for trying to pretend they supported anything like your fruitloopery before. Weren't you Jazzz.

 

[Jazzz]

Oh good point! Fela was asked, i do appologise.

Apology accepted, and doubtless you will take greater care in future before accusing someone of 'weaselling', or of 'not reading threads', or of being 'dumber than usual'.

Still, you were pulled up for trying to pretend they supported anything like your fruitloopery before. Weren't you Jazzz.

I'll give a longer post on this after I've cooked some chilli

 

[editor]

"At first, we widows didn’t want to be seen with conspiracy people. But they kept showing up. They cared more than those supposedly doing the investigating. If you ask me, they’re just Americans, looking for the truth, which is supposed to be our right."

Lorie Van Auken

Does she agree with you that sci-fi drones that magically appeared in mid air were used for the attacks, her husband's plane was magically and invisibly whisked off to an unknown place where they were all slaughtered by The Man and that the towers were filled with invisibly installed invisible explosives that not a living soul in New York noticed, then?

 

[Jazzz]

You see this is why you are confused. tef asked fela fan what was to be gained from following his line of enquiry. So, I suggested he might ask that to the Jersey Girls - because the line of enquiry is the same. This is the concern, not whether we know exactly what happened on 9/11. That's why they are 'Pressing for Truth' because they don't think we have the truth and it's up the USG to do a hell of a lot more to explain why their husbands died. And that's why they in turn have expressed support for conspiracy theorists, and why they have endorsed Paul Thompson's Co-operative research site (which gets derided here as a 'conspiraloon' site by people that should know a lot better.

Perhaps you editor would ask the Jersey Girls if they don't know the truth what it is exactly they think happened on 9/11 - they wouldn't answer, and rightly so. I certainly don't know what they think happened and make no claim to. It's the line of enquiry that counts, and that's why it was relevant to ask tef, and that's why BobTheLost's comment makes no sense.

When everyone is convinced to throw their weight behind the Jersey Girls, and their campaign for a proper independent enquiry into 9/11, then my work is done.

 

[editor]

You see this is why you are confused. tef asked fela fan what was to be gained from following his line of enquiry. So, I suggested he might ask that to the Jersey Girls - because the line of enquiry is the same. This is the concern, not whether we know exactly what happened on 9/11. That's why they are 'Pressing for Truth' because they don't think we have the truth and it's up the USG to do a hell of a lot more to explain why their husbands died.

So that's a "no" then?

 

[axon]

When everyone is convinced to throw their weight behind the Jersey Girls, and their campaign for a proper independent enquiry into 9/11, then my work is done.

What, everyone on the planet?

 

[Bob_the_lost]

Perhaps you editor would ask the Jersey Girls if they don't know the truth what it is exactly they think happened on 9/11 - they wouldn't answer, and rightly so. I certainly don't know what they think happened and make no claim to. It's the line of enquiry that counts, and that's why it was relevant to ask tef, and that's why BobTheLost's comment makes no sense.

Your line of enquiry is not to find out what happened, you're fairly certain on that one as you've said many times now.

You want to know who did it.

You don't seek the truth, as far as you're concerned you know what happened and you're just trying to fillin the blanks. The jersey girls (presumably) do not share your delusions or faith in them, as such the lines of enquirey are notably different.

 

[Jazzz]

We both want a proper, independent investigation into the 9/11 attacks. I fully support the questions they are asking the USG.

Do you?

 

[Bob_the_lost]

We both want a proper, independent investigation into the 9/11 attacks. I fully support the questions they are asking the USG.

Do you?

B is a subset of A. This does not mean that all A are contained within B. You ask so many quesitons that it's rather hard to find a query that you do not support.

The point was that there is nothing to say the jersey girls support you, not that you support them, let's face it, for conspiracies you're the wonderbra, making mountains out of molehills until at last someone gets a glimpse of the substance behind you and finds it rather lacking.

 

[Jazzz]

B is a subset of A. This does not mean that all A are contained within B. You ask so many quesitons that it's rather hard to find a query that you do not support.

As I said, when all here support the Jersey Girls and their quest for a proper investigation, my work is done. I have little more to add.

 

[Bob_the_lost]

As I said, when all here support the Jersey Girls and their quest for a proper investigation, my work is done. I have little more to add.

A proper investigation does not include looking for bomb residue in the tower rubble. A proper investigation does not include trying to find where the passengers from the planes were hidden. A proper investigation does not include examining the feasability of making a perfect decoy model of a 767 (or two of them).

A proper investigation does not include you or your theories. Even if a more indepth investigation were carried out it would not satisfy you.

Now, where were we? Oh yes: So the Jersey girls do not support your theories in any way (as far as you know)?

 

[Jazzz]

If we alter Van Auken's quote just a little to specify my good self;

"If you ask me, jazzz is just looking for the truth, which is supposed to be our right"

 

[Bob_the_lost]

If we alter Van Auken's quote just a little to specify my good self;

"If you ask me, jazzz is just looking for the truth, which is supposed to be our right"

How about we alter tef's quote just a little:

Regardless of any disagreements on what happened, or how it happened - what do you, jazz, expect to gain from running with your line of enquiry?

 

[Jazzz]

Now, where were we? Oh yes: So the Jersey girls do not support your theories in any way (as far as you know)?

I am not aware of ANY theory which the Jersey Girls support. To announce that they already believe something, whatever it is, will compromise their investigation.

But I do know this - they certainly support William Rodriguez, so put that in your pipe and smoke it.