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Why the f-ck did anyone ask Klaus Schwab the time anyway

First of all, I said nothing of the sort. Indeed, I said this:
If you never said that not having a safe space isn't institutionally racist, then please accept my apology - I'm sorry! - but somone definately said that so I'll scroll back and find out who it was when I get the chance.
Again, you are imputing positions to me that exist only inside your head. Where did I say that race is the only thing that matters?
See what happens if you don't mention race, or more to the point, see what happens when I don't mention race!
Sure, why not?
That's an awful lot of safe spaces. I think Buckingham Palace would be able to pull it off.
What makes you think no white people are involved in BAME networks?
Woooah! I was talking about physical safe spaces.

Above all else I'm after equality. It's easy for say working class White people to setup their own support groups on Whatsapp as long as the converstation doesn't turn to discriminating against others.

I don't see how physical self segration in the workplace helps people to get along better. If anything it helps employers break worker unity.

For me, in my working environment, everyone is the same and we all get along great.
 
If you never said that not having a safe space isn't institutionally racist, then please accept my apology - I'm sorry! - but somone definately said that so I'll scroll back and find out who it was when I get the chance.

Apology accepted. Please be more careful in the future.

See what happens if you don't mention race, or more to the point, see what happens when I don't mention race!

I don't understand what you're getting at here. Racism is a thing, and people who are not of the majority white population in the UK face unique challenges on account of their demographic status. I do not see any harm in workplaces having spaces and resources available to help out such employees and/or their families who may be experiencing those kind of issues. I don't see how not talking about racism is going to address it. Saying "I don't see colour" doesn't change the fact that other people do, and will act accordingly.

That's an awful lot of safe spaces. I think Buckingham Palace would be able to pull it off.

I think you vastly overestimate the amount of real estate required. We have quiet rooms in the Manchester office of the company I work for, and these can be used for a variety of purposes. Whether it's a neurodivergent person who needs a space that's out of the way of foot traffic in order to concentrate on a particularly challenging piece of work, or a Muslim who needs somewhere to pray.

Woooah! I was talking about physical safe spaces.

Why? What do you think that a physical safe space actually entails? How common do you know (not think, know, so be prepared to document this knowledge) this practice to be? Can you point to an example that you find particularly egregious? And why?

Above all else I'm after equality. It's easy for say working class White people to setup their own support groups on Whatsapp as long as the converstation doesn't turn to discriminating against others.

The spaces and networks exist at least in part because we do not, in fact, live in a post-racial utopia.

I don't see how physical self segration in the workplace helps people to get along better. If anything it helps employers break worker unity.

What physical segregation? There is none. Even in workplaces with physical rooms dedicated solely to their BAME network activities, I very much doubt that any of them are forcibly separating employees based on skin colour, at least in the UK. That would be illegal and would open the employer up to discrimination cases at employment tribunals. The company's legal department would probably have a fit. You're tilting at windmills.

For me, in my working environment, everyone is the same and we all get along great.

Again, you can only speak for yourself in that regard.
 
Apology accepted. Please be more careful in the future.



I don't understand what you're getting at here. Racism is a thing, and people who are not of the majority white population in the UK face unique challenges on account of their demographic status. I do not see any harm in workplaces having spaces and resources available to help out such employees and/or their families who may be experiencing those kind of issues. I don't see how not talking about racism is going to address it. Saying "I don't see colour" doesn't change the fact that other people do, and will act accordingly.



I think you vastly overestimate the amount of real estate required. We have quiet rooms in the Manchester office of the company I work for, and these can be used for a variety of purposes. Whether it's a neurodivergent person who needs a space that's out of the way of foot traffic in order to concentrate on a particularly challenging piece of work, or a Muslim who needs somewhere to pray.



Why? What do you think that a physical safe space actually entails? How common do you know (not think, know, so be prepared to document this knowledge) this practice to be? Can you point to an example that you find particularly egregious? And why?



The spaces and networks exist at least in part because we do not, in fact, live in a post-racial utopia.



What physical segregation? There is none. Even in workplaces with physical rooms dedicated solely to their BAME network activities, I very much doubt that any of them are forcibly separating employees based on skin colour, at least in the UK. That would be illegal and would open the employer up to discrimination cases at employment tribunals. The company's legal department would probably have a fit. You're tilting at windmills.



Again, you can only speak for yourself in that regard.
Hold on a minute. I need to bring you back to how his debate started.

I was critisizing corporates for telling customers that they are "racist" and should "Take their business elsewhere" merely for saying that they didn't think BAME safe-places is a good idea or otherwise devisive.

That's it.

If a company decides that BAME safe spaces benefits them, that's their business. I take a dim view of it, but that's not enough for me to boycott Sainsbury's, unless I start to see workers (Of any colour) on the news complaining that it's causing them problems.

However, if they (Sainsbury's for example) then tweet about it, claiming that it combats racism, then with a very very big tar brush tweets something like "Racists who have a problem with it, should take their business elsewhere", while is their legal right, is very insulting to anyone who has a problem with it.

I might be right to have a dim view of safe-spaces. I might be wrong.

But a corporate (or anyone else for that matter) claiming that everyone who opposes, is somehow racist, is so far beyond nuts, I wonder whether it's a deliberate provocation to drumb up publicity.

Marketing departments do it and think they will get away with it, because right wingers are statistically nowhere near as good as the left at boycotting.

The left likes to give their business to businesses that are seen and believed to support left wing causes, over neutral companies.

The right isn't as interested in the politics of the companies who produce the produce they consume.

And that isn't a critisim of people with left wing views.
 
I don’t think anyone was saying that tho? There have been lots of criticisms of safe spaces on the left and on this forum over the years, I don’t usually agree with them tbh but it exists?

Also I don't think any businesses are left wing lol but if they're concerned about racism and a happy working environment, probably means productivity will be up from a capitalist point of view, therefore the products will be better?
 
What physical segregation? There is none. Even in workplaces with physical rooms dedicated solely to their BAME network activities, I very much doubt that any of them are forcibly separating employees based on skin colour, at least in the UK. That would be illegal and would open the employer up to discrimination cases at employment tribunals. The company's legal department would probably have a fit. You're tilting at windmills.
That's fair enough. But I've recently reminded you that it goes back to what Sainsbury's tweeted.

It wasn't so much that they even had safe-spaces that got me going, it's the fact that they at least implied (or even directly called out) people for saying they opposed safe-spaces.

For companies to virtue-signal about this stuff is deeply irresponsible and divisive, especially when they react badly to any blowback and concerns from the public.

Imagine you had convinced me that safe-spaces are a wonderful thing and every workplace should have them.

To me, it would be even more irresponsible to do that, because it's getting people's backs up.

A more professional response would be to elaborate exactly the activities that happen in those safe-spaces etc, rather than insult people.

I'm still not convinced that BAME people have "unique challenges" because of demographics as White people can be in the same situations, especially White children in inner city areas. There are plenty of White children who find themselves in the minorty - where is their safe-spaces?

In this age of technology, the only people who need a physical safe-space, is anyone and everyone who just needs to get away from anyone and everyone.
 
Wait so all these past pages are cos some shop said racists should go elsewhere?

That's your fucking beef with "woke"?


:facepalm:


What's next, some students who wanted Churchill's picture taking down are somehow threattening the basis of Western society or some shit. Weak, weak stuff.
 
I don’t think anyone was saying that tho? There have been lots of criticisms of safe spaces on the left and on this forum over the years, I don’t usually agree with them tbh but it exists?

Also I don't think any businesses are left wing lol but if they're concerned about racism and a happy working environment, probably means productivity will be up from a capitalist point of view, therefore the products will be better?
I politefully disagree. If I were an employer hoping to stop a workforce from forming a union, I'd get the workers paranoid of differences. I'd get everyone paranoid about racism to the point that you're all racist if you do and racist if you don't and get it to a point where it's all zero tolerance and you're all one mistep away from a gross misconduct sacking for racism.

No one dare say anything to each other about anything that's not job related.
 
Wait so all these past pages are cos some shop said racists should go elsewhere?

That's your fucking beef with "woke"?


:facepalm:


What's next, some students who wanted Churchill's picture taking down are somehow threattening the basis of Western society or some shit. Weak, weak stuff.
No because it accused people of having a problem with BAME safe-spaces as racist (and in another incident Black History Month) to take their business elsewhere.

If I actually believed it was right to have BAME safe-spaces and black history month, it would be far worse, because it's their response to critism that I have a real problem with.
 
I feel like I have to ask what your workplace is (industry), how many there are of you, and gender/race/class make-up, if it has this perfect egalitarian composition.

Of course, I think we know from your other posts that you're full of shit.
You feel like? Well that's your fucking problem sweetie.
It's too many people's problem that they think their feelings are important.
No one cares about your fucking feelings apart from your Mummy.
Fucking grow up.
 
I politefully disagree. If I were an employer hoping to stop a workforce from forming a union, I'd get the workers paranoid of differences. I'd get everyone paranoid about racism to the point that you're all racist if you do and racist if you don't and get it to a point where it's all zero tolerance and you're all one mistep away from a gross misconduct sacking for racism.

No one dare say anything to each other about anything that's not job related.

Unhappy workers make for shit productivity, that's why even the CBI are kicking off about some of the recent deranged Tory bullshit and why various perks are offered such as gym membership, private health care etc in some places
 
No because it accused people of having a problem with BAME safe-spaces as racist (and in another incident Black History Month) to take their business elsewhere.

If I actually believed it was right to have BAME safe-spaces and black history month, it would be far worse, because it's their response to critism that I have a real problem with.

Who the fuck cares. Does Black History month affect you in any way? I have no beef with it. OTOH I find the wokiest student stuff cringy and naive but here's the thing, it affects my life not a jot. No one's stoppping me shopping where I want, if I disagree with the proprieters politics, I can go elsewhere or not. Thought you were all about libertt and free enterprise?
 
My work place too has BAME groups, LGBT groups. Many of my colleagues across the UK are BAME. Guess how much this negateively affects my working life?...

I mean if you're railing against woke stuff, I'd have thought you'd have some concrete examples of where this is really making life hard. Not just some marketing crap on twitter. It's a bit.. Snowflakey.
 
It's too many people's problem that they think their feelings are important.
Given the amount of time you've just spent whining about Idpol (while constantly banging on about your unique working-classness), and some company hurting your feelings by promoting safe spaces, I don't think you're in any position to accuse anyone else of being too self-important about their feelings.

Though honestly I'm not sure why I'm even bothering to point this out, given you're defending capitalism on a zero-hours contract. Being even slightly coherent or consistent just isn't your bag, is it.
 
You feel like? Well that's your fucking problem sweetie.
It's too many people's problem that they think their feelings are important.
No one cares about your fucking feelings apart from your Mummy.
Fucking grow up.

Gold medalist in the projection Olympics.

You're the one whose feels are disproportionately hurt by an ice cream company saying something you have as yet failed to give a clear explanation of.
 
You feel like? Well that's your fucking problem sweetie.
It's too many people's problem that they think their feelings are important.
No one cares about your fucking feelings apart from your Mummy.
Fucking grow up.

I was writing a longer answer to your previous posts, but this utterly piss-poor response has made me reconsider. If you didn't want to answer the question, then you could have turned it down without employing infantilising and sexist language, "sweetie". Fucking hell.

I'm just going to cut to the chase. If someone has a problem with BAME networks or Black History Month, then odds are very high that they're a racist piece of human shit. The fact you've been ranting on about segregation and white people being sent to the back of the bus when fucking none of that shit happens, shows either your ignorance, or your willingness to justify your stance based on made-up racist bullshit.

So yeah, insults are all that's left, because you have consistently refused to back your position with anything other than unhinged ranting. You talk of "blowback" when there's nothing to indicate anything of the sort beyond the tears of racists.
 
Unhappy workers make for shit productivity, that's why even the CBI are kicking off about some of the recent deranged Tory bullshit and why various perks are offered such as gym membership, private health care etc in some places
Oh I agree. But I'm not convinced that safe-spaces are the way forward and I would be very cautious about an employers motives if they then accused anyone who has concerns of racism.
 
I was writing a longer answer to your previous posts, but this utterly piss-poor response has made me reconsider. If you didn't want to answer the question, then you could have turned it down without employing infantilising and sexist language, "sweetie". Fucking hell.

I'm just going to cut to the chase. If someone has a problem with BAME networks or Black History Month, then odds are very high that they're a racist piece of human shit. The fact you've been ranting on about segregation and white people being sent to the back of the bus when fucking none of that shit happens, shows either your ignorance, or your willingness to justify your stance based on made-up racist bullshit.

So yeah, insults are all that's left, because you have consistently refused to back your position with anything other than unhinged ranting. You talk of "blowback" when there's nothing to indicate anything of the sort beyond the tears of racists.

I was writing a longer answer to your previous posts, but this utterly piss-poor response has made me reconsider. If you didn't want to answer the question, then you could have turned it down without employing infantilising and sexist language, "sweetie". Fucking hell.

I'm just going to cut to the chase. If someone has a problem with BAME networks or Black History Month, then odds are very high that they're a racist piece of human shit. The fact you've been ranting on about segregation and white people being sent to the back of the bus when fucking none of that shit happens, shows either your ignorance, or your willingness to justify your stance based on made-up racist bullshit.

So yeah, insults are all that's left, because you have consistently

I was writing a longer answer to your previous posts, but this utterly piss-poor response has made me reconsider. If you didn't want to answer the question, then you could have turned it down without employing infantilising and sexist language, "sweetie". Fucking hell.

I'm just going to cut to the chase. If someone has a problem with BAME networks or Black History Month, then odds are very high that they're a racist piece of human shit. The fact you've been ranting on about segregation and white people being sent to the back of the bus when fucking none of that shit happens, shows either your ignorance, or your willingness to justify your stance based on made-up racist bullshit.

So yeah, insults are all that's left, because you have consistently refused to back your position with anything other than unhinged ranting. You talk of "blowback" when there's nothing to indicate anything of the sort beyond the tears of racists.
No. You want dealing in any facts.
You wrote a short post about how you feel I should disclose personal information because you feel I is shatting shit without proving I is chatting shit.

How the fuck is sweetie sexist?

Start dealing in facts.

I don't fucking care how you feel and nor should I.

Chexk your privelege, sweetie.
 
You feel like? Well that's your fucking problem sweetie.
It's too many people's problem that they think their feelings are important.
No one cares about your fucking feelings apart from your Mummy.
Fucking grow up.
given what you say here, why should anyone give a fuck about what you feel?
 
No. You want dealing in any facts.
You wrote a short post about how you feel I should disclose personal information because you feel I is shatting shit without proving I is chatting shit.

How the fuck is sweetie sexist?

Start dealing in facts.

I don't fucking care how you feel and nor should I.

Chexk your privelege, sweetie.
you are indeed shatting shit. and not for the first time.
 
No. You want dealing in any facts.
You wrote a short post about how you feel I should disclose personal information because you feel I is shatting shit without proving I is chatting shit.

Quote me where I said you "should" disclose any personal information? I said this:

If you didn't want to answer the question, then you could have turned it down without employing infantilising and sexist language

It's fucking rich of you to talk about facts when you're being such a fucking liar. You can stop at any time, you know.
 
given what you say here, why should anyone give a fuck about what you feel?
I don't want people to care about how I feel.

Yiu should try that.

Get out of bed and look in the mirror and say it to yourself “Life is easier if I dont give a fuck if people care about my feelings. I want to change people's minds based on facts not my feelings."
 
Quote me where I said you "should" disclose any personal information? I said this:



It's fucking rich of you to talk about facts when you're being such a fucking liar. You can stop at any time, you know.
Yeah yeah. It starts with what industry I work in, but eventually my elimination it would have been who I work for.

How is "Sweetie" sexist?

I done know what sex you are and I don't remember disclosing mine to you.

And it's used by just about every sex and gender, sweetie.
 
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