Who will be the next Labour leader?

[Proper Tidy]

It is. But it's not as awful as the liberal-left moaners, going on about how terrible it is that the LP isn't doing what they want

Well yeah they are a big part of why it's awful tbf #labourdoorstep

 

[Smokeandsteam]

I find it weird how new labour explicitly made a break with labour hence new and yet their heirs spend their lives pissing and moaning about how they're true labour not like these new cunts. God the labour party is awful isn't it

But they are all united by one idea, that capitalism and its failings can be explained and challenged on moral grounds. The only real difference is the extent of the severity of the criticism. But whether it’s Blair, Corbyn, Nandy or Long Bailey capitalism’s failings are about values. None attempt to present it as untenable or incoherent and challenge it on that basis. Dead end politics

 

[Gramsci]

That may well be true but there's a new Labour culture that runs through the modern Labour party... It has a feel and a way of talking, Blair onwards. Corbyn, Benn, Skinner etc are noticeably of a different non managerial cut, I would suggest. And there's positive signs of a change with some of the younger intake in their 20s...

I might be making too much of it, but it feels that way to me at least

Not sure exactly where you are but in Lambeth Id say you are spot on.

In Streathan new succesful candidate who was elected to replace Chuka is from the new younger intake.

Bell Ribeiro-Addy now an MP for Streatham. The LD remain "surge" didn't happen. Despite this being Remain area.

In fact the streatham area Labour party membership never supported Blairites. Bell getting the seat when up against two other women local Cllrs who were Blairites didnt surprise me .

When the seat fell vacant , when Chuka went for it, Steve Reed arch Blairite Leader of Lambeth Council went for seat. Chuka was the left candidate. I know that might sound odd but he was then. Membership went for Chuka to criticise the Blairite project. They were sadly disappointed in the long term.

It need to be remmbered that the Blairite project held what was considered its core voters / supporters in contempt. Middle class Guardian readers and Councl tenants were laughed at.

So imo , despite the declining membership in Lambeth pre Corbyn , the opposition and ressentment against the Blaiirite project pre dated Corbyn

I see it with the rise of the Green party in Lambeth. Several really good black working class candidates have stood as Greens in my Ward. People imo who should have been mainstays of the local Labour party.

What im saying is in my area the general publlic who are Labour voters/ members never have been that keen on the "centre" ground.

There is a space for left politicians in Lambeth.

Bell is off to a good start taking up local issues. So hopefully as an MP she will take my New Labour Council to task.

 

[two sheds]

Why?

Because Pidcock's chairing his campaign?

 

[sleaterkinney]

You are not even a social democrat. You argued in favour of austerity - a position never really supported by the majority of LP members, hence Corbyn's win. The idea all these horrible far left entryists took the party away from you (were you ever a member?) is deluded crap. Your politics was more or less aligned with the leadership of the party for a short time, it was never aligned with the wider party membership/culture.

They definitely entered from whichever micro - cult they were part of with the aim of moving Labour to the far left. They were there previously in the 80s, but that was before my time.

 

[sleaterkinney]

It is. But it's not as awful as the liberal-left moaners, going on about how terrible it is that the LP isn't doing what they want

Yeah, like winning elections.

 

[killer b]

Corbyn won comfortably with the pre-2015 membership too though

 

[Proper Tidy]

Imagine thinking a couple of hundred k of people or whatever came from leninist sects that at their height were only ambitions enough to make up membership figures of single digit thousands

 

[redsquirrel]

Like I said deluded.

 

[alex_]

Bell Ribeiro-Addy now an MP for Streatham. The LD remain "surge" didn't happen. Despite this being Remain area.

Err

LD vote share went from 6.5% to 23.5% in streatham.

Alex

 

[Gramsci]

Err

LD vote share went from 6.5% to 23.5% in streatham.

Alex

In Streatham Bell Ribeiro-Addy got 54.8% of the vote. So LDs came nowhere near winning the seat. This in an area that was Rmain . Bell Ribeio - Addy was a candidate from the left of the party. Replacing Chuka. So its good result and shows inner London didnt reject Labour party.

 

[killer b]

The LDs never had any expectation of taking Streatham though tbf, otherwise Umuna would have stayed there.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

The moral failings of capitalism/the Tories part 132,837:



From the sound of the booing there are about 15 people at the rally. Shades are weird as well

 

[cantsin]

Why?

committed socialist that hasn't wobbled like Rayner has - Dep Leader doesn't mean much, but better for morale if Burgon wins

( won't pretend to partic enthused about any of it btw )

 

[killer b]

But what about him being a fucking idiot?

 

[SpackleFrog]

But what about him being a fucking idiot?

I think you answered your own question.

It's easy to forget that there isn't actually that many people in parliament - and of course currently Labour are on a historic low anyway. Once you remove the terminally depraved, the brain dead and the inbreds you're lucky if there's 10-15 people you'd even be happy to share a cab with, let alone let run the country.

We've had dealings with Rayner in UCU cos she was shadow Education. She's hardly an intellectual herself. Burgon is probably the better option politically but that's hardly a ringing endorsement.

 

[Supine]

Burgon comes across as thick as mince. He’d be election suicide. RLB appeals to the party maybe but not the people who count. Labour need to finally realise it’s the country who vote in a government and not the sacred membership.

 

[butchersapron]

Burgon comes across as thick as mince. He’d be election suicide. RLB appeals to the party maybe but not the people who count. Labour need to finally realise it’s the country who vote in a government and not the sacred membership.

Did you make this argument over brexit? I don't recall you doing so.

 

[Supine]

Did you make this argument over brexit? I don't recall you doing so.

I made a different argument over a different subject. Not relevant.

 

[killer b]

Labour need to finally realise it’s the country who vote in a government and not the sacred membership.

isn't it the sacred membership who need to finally realise this?

 

[butchersapron]

I made a different argument over a different subject. Not relevant.

No, if your logic above is correct, if the content of the post is correct, you should have been arguing for labour to have a more leave friendly position over the last few years. You didn't. Your post is just pure opportunism.

 

[butchersapron]

isn't it the sacred membership who need to finally realise this?

Just leaders, don't need a membership. I doubt this poster has ever been in a political organisation in their life.

 

[SpackleFrog]

Burgon comes across as thick as mince. He’d be election suicide. RLB appeals to the party maybe but not the people who count. Labour need to finally realise it’s the country who vote in a government and not the sacred membership.

You also come across as thick as mince but nobody has said you shouldn't be Labour leader.

 

[Supine]

isn't it the sacred membership who need to finally realise this?

labour IS the membership is it not? They need to elect an electable leader. The future is speculation, the data from history on this is available for all to see.

 

[SpackleFrog]

I made a different argument over a different subject. Not relevant.

How are they different? On Brexit you say they should do what members want. When it doesn't suit you you say they should do what 'the country' wants?

Why don't you just say Labour should do what you want? Then we'd all just let you prattle on.

 

[butchersapron]

labour IS the membership is it not? They need to elect an electable leader. The future is speculation, the data from history on this is available for all to see.

What is this utter cant. It's like the way the state underfunded and ran down nationalised services then said see they're shit, they have to go. None of you types are ever going to wear what you did are you?

 

[Supine]

No, if your logic above is correct, if the content of the post is correct, you should have been arguing for labour to have a more leave friendly position over the last few years. You didn't. Your post is just pure opportunism.

My position on brexit is personal opinion on how the country is related to Europe. I’ll not be changing that view ever. Elections are not about personal opinions they are about everybody else’s opinion.

 

[butchersapron]

My position on brexit is personal option on how the country is related to Europe. I’ll not be changing that view ever. Elections are not about personal opinions they are about everybody else’s opinion.

This is just waffle, hypocrisy exposing waffle i grant you - but waffle nonetheless.

 

[Supine]

Why don't you just say Labour should do what you want?

They should! But you’d say the same and you’d be wrong

 

[JimW]

cupid_stunt - its long been a political truth (with the odd exception) that the Tory party understands that principle, without power, is a wasted breath. They long ago decided that it's better to have 40% of what you want, 40% of what you can live with, and 20% of what you don't like than 0% of what you want, and 100% of what you don't want.

Both Cameron and Johnson are indicators of this attitude - they don't particularly like either of them, but they recognise that they'd bring them power. Some power is better than no power...

This works for them because they are the establishment, it doesn't work for even milksop social democrats because just having power and no principles means you will also serve only the establishment, as Blair did. The few percentage of less awful policies weren't worth the further undermining of the already quite fanciful notion of a mass party representing the working class.