Wear masks in shops

[dessiato]

Linking the France and Spain outbreaks to masks would only work if they had stricter rules than most other countries, which they don't.

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France's order came in very late and compliance doesn't exactly seem to be universal in Spain.

How Spain’s face mask rules are being broken

Police officers relate the multitude of excuses employed by people to explain why they are not following the coronavirus safety measure

english.elpais.com

That article was written about Málaga. In my experience, I live in Córdoba and am regularly on the Costa Tropical, in Almunecar, and Motril, and other costal areas, mask wearing is very high.

But, as the article says, the worst offenders are the younger people.

 

[8ball]

But, as the article says, the worst offenders are the younger people.

That’s interesting. I’m think here I see lots of older people wearing masks wrongly. I think a lot of people basically are doing it to avoid censure and don’t really believe they are likely to make much difference.

The thing about cutting holes in the mask was bloody weird, though.

 

[elbows]

It seems like the main difference between that curve and the “nightmare scenario” curve is one of height, and the main mercy was that the virus was nothing like as dangerous as initial projections.
If it had been, then with our Government it seems likely we would have been looking at millions of deaths (millions more even than early projections).

One thing I notice is that older people and younger people seem on the whole less scared of this virus at this point (there was a time where it looked like “the big one” and I’m sure everyone was pretty nervous for a bit there - I certainly was, though I have a fee health problems and now I think the other things queuing up to kill me are probably in with a better chance)..

I dont really know what you are talking about. The age profile of the diseases health burden was known from early on. It was also extremely well known that the case fatality rate estimates from early on were pretty meaningless because the number of cases being detected did not likely resemble the actual number of cases, throwing the crude casse fatality rate calculations out of whack.

The number of possible hospital admissions is one of the key estimates that finally got the government to change their approach in a big way. There have been 133,123 hospital admissions recorded in the UK so far, and thats with lockdown etc having happened, and with many people discouraged or prevented from being admitted to hospital at the very height of the first wave.

Reasonable worst case scenario estimates rarely end up aligning perfectly with reality. Its vital to use them when planning though, and even if they were somewhat wide of the mark in some areas with this pandemic, they still look like a much better fit with reality to me than the far more optimistic predictions from those who wanted to do little to reduce the spread of this virus.

The whole concept of 'the big one' tends to do my head in because peoples perceptions of what would quality as 'the big one' seem to be all over the place and often influenced by the scariest bits of what they've heard about the 1918 pandemic. Well, if very large numbers of deaths in younger people is what people require in order for a particular pandemic to qualify, just enough was known about this virus from the early days onwards to know that this pandemic was not going to qualify. My own sense of what counts as a pandemic with significant implications for the world, leading to the greatest public health crisis in several generations, does not rely on staggering amounts of deaths in the younger age groups. Therefore this pandemic still qualifies as a standout for me, even if it all went away tomorrow.

 

[8ball]

Yes, it is a pandemic, and at the time we went into lockdown (horribly late) based on a "reasonable worst case scenario".
That scenario was pretty scary. We got those new hospitals and fortunately didn't have to fill them.

I'm not sure what has confused you, or sent you on an odd rant about age groups..

With regard to "flattening the curve", you don't remember all the talk of slowing it down, pushing the peak of admissions out into the summer etc.? I remember Boris Johnson saying this, just as I remember him terrifying the nation saying that every family would be losing someone from this virus. The curve on this graph (and all the graphs) peters out to very little well before the end of what I'd consider the spring. How does this differ from the profile you would see on those coronavirus types that we call "a cold".

 

[elbows]

Yes, it is a pandemic, and at the time we went into lockdown (horribly late) based on a "reasonable worst case scenario".
That scenario was pretty scary. We got those new hospitals and fortunately didn't have to fill them.

We took action to prevent that scenario. Therefore we cannot actually judge what would have happened if we had not done so, we cant tell what hopsital admissions would have been like in the period some weeks after our lockdown, because that lockdown happened.

With regard to "flattening the curve", you don't remember all the talk of slowing it down, pushing the peak of admissions out into the summer etc.? I remember Boris Johnson saying this, just as I remember him terrifying the nation saying that every family would be losing someone from this virus. The curve on this graph (and all the graphs) peters out to very little well before the end of what I'd consider the spring. How does this differ from the profile you would see on those coronavirus types that we call "a cold".

Why are you wasting my time with this? Of course I remember the talk of slowing it down, because I said this just yesterday on this very thread in response to you for fucks sake:

Flattening the curve was the original UK plan and it was dead by March 16th, plus they messed up the timing in regards what stage they thought the epidemic was actually at in early March. Thats why all the talk of pushing down on the curve that came out of the mouth of people like Vallance prior to March 16th doesnt have a strong relationship to what actually followed. Not in terms of timing or the shape of the various epidemic curves showing cases, hospitalisations and deaths. The original pushing down thing involved comments like 'pushing the peak into the summer' but our peak actually came on April 8th.

So I'm probably going to stop engaging with you on the subject of the pandemic since I'm clearly wasting my time and you are happy to go around in circles.

 

[8ball]

Well, you can remember what you said in a recent post. Onwards and upwards.

Thinking back, Johnson’s “prepare to lose people” speech was on the 12th and lockdown commenced on the 16th, so a pretty tight timeline. Maybe that speech was meant in the context of taking no action, “prepare for much death, we got nothing”. Very muted reaction, considering.

As for flattening the curve being dead by 16th March, I seem to recall the “protect the NHS” rhetoric going on a lot longer than that (before we later moved onto that weird slogan ending with “control the virus”). Internet also has lots of media discussion (including “expert commentary”) on whether the UK had successful “flattened the curve” around mid-April. A month after the strategy was apparently dead in the water. References continue into July.

Maybe someone should have said something..

 

[FridgeMagnet]

I went for an eye test yesterday and everyone in the opticians was masked up, they had a barrier on the door which was open to allow ventilation, panels inside to separate people waiting, and so on, all what you'd want. On the high street generally it seemed like people were all masked up inside all the shops too (not that I went into any others to be fair). Yet whenever I go to a supermarket, probably on average 50% of people are not wearing masks, often going higher.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Yet whenever I go to a supermarket, probably on average 50% of people are not wearing masks, often going higher.

Yet, when I was in the big Tesco this morning, the only people not wearing masks were the cashiers behind screens. Their petrol station was closed, so I went to the Co-Op one instead, which is also a sizeable convenience store too, everyone was wearing a mask, except the cashier behind the screen. In both, people were largely social distancing too.

When I had to go into town on Thursday, I was impressed that people were even standing about 2m apart in a queue waiting to cross a level crossing, once the barriers went up.

And, Worthing borough, population around 120k, is fairly safe, we only had one new covid case last week, none in the hospital & no deaths at the hospital for over 2 months

 

[FridgeMagnet]

Yet, when I was in the big Tesco this morning, the only people not wearing masks were the cashiers behind screens. Their petrol station was closed, so I went to the Co-Op one instead, which is also a sizeable convenience store too, everyone was wearing a mask, except the cashier behind the screen. In both, people were largely social distancing too.

When I had to go into town on Thursday, I was impressed that people were even standing about 2m apart in a queue waiting to cross a level crossing, once the barriers went up.

And, Worthing borough, population around 120k, is fairly safe, we only had one new covid case last week, none in the hospital & no deaths at the hospital for over 2 months

Well, great, I can cite cases in supermarkets where everyone has been masked, too; also where I'm the only one. The point was supposed to be that it's clearly possible to have it in retail shops, and it seems to me to be common outside of supermarkets.

 

[hash tag]

Yeah, it's bio-warfare (in what way I'm not sure and didn't want to ask) according to a normally sensible person I know.

Why does she think this pray tell? "My uncle used to work in Porton Down, and he said it can't be anything but bio-warfare."

FFS. People really can be fucking morons.

Wow. I was just searching Portion Down because I'm reading Gassed by Rob Evans and even saw a video of an experiment from there on you tube today. From 1963/4 about LSD experiments.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

I went for an eye test yesterday and everyone in the opticians was masked up, they had a barrier on the door which was open to allow ventilation, panels inside to separate people waiting, and so on, all what you'd want. On the high street generally it seemed like people were all masked up inside all the shops too (not that I went into any others to be fair). Yet whenever I go to a supermarket, probably on average 50% of people are not wearing masks, often going higher.

I have not been for an eye test since then.

 

[cupid_stunt]

My mother has been in a couple of hospitals for about 6 months, all staff & visitors had to wear face masks, she hated it, it stressed her out not being able to see faces and because she's hard of hearing struggled even more trying to hear anyone that was talking to her.

Finally she got moved to a small, 20 room, dementia care home today, she was well happy I wasn't wearing one, nor were any of the staff.

All residents & staff are fully jabbed, so it's as safe as it can be, and only fair on the residents to have a bit of normality after so many years.

 

[Pickman's model]

Yet, when I was in the big Tesco this morning, the only people not wearing masks were the cashiers behind screens. Their petrol station was closed, so I went to the Co-Op one instead, which is also a sizeable convenience store too, everyone was wearing a mask, except the cashier behind the screen. In both, people were largely social distancing too.

When I had to go into town on Thursday, I was impressed that people were even standing about 2m apart in a queue waiting to cross a level crossing, once the barriers went up.

And, Worthing borough, population around 120k, is fairly safe, we only had one new covid case last week, none in the hospital & no deaths at the hospital for over 2 months

That's because so few people have any lfts any more. You emphasise no deaths at the hospital, how many have there been elsewhere?

 

[ouirdeaux]

Lfts cause deaths?

 

[Pickman's model]

Lfts cause deaths?

Au contraire. Now people have to pay for lfts they're more sparingly used. So no one knows whether they've covid or whether Worthing is fairly safe. It's certainly dull tho

 

[Pickman's model]

It'd be nice if people said 'bump' when they bump a thread like this

 

[ouirdeaux]

Au contraire. Now people have to pay for lfts they're more sparingly used. So no one knows whether they've covid or whether Worthing is fairly safe. It's certainly dull tho

I have never been to Worthing, although I understand it's a seaside resort.

People may not take LFTs, but if they're admitted to hospital, they're tested for Covid. So I think we have some idea of what's going on in that seaside resort. Obviously there may be any number of cases that don't merit hospital admission, but the point is that serious cases are identified.

 

[hash tag]

I came home on a smallish single decker bus yesterday. I was one of about 25 people standing and I saw one person wearing as mask. People in town are barely wearing them anymore. I wear a mask when visiting clients and that's the only time I wear one.

 

[BigMoaner]

noticed an uptick in mask wearning in ol london town. nothing major.

 

[8ball]

My masks are very low spec, but am I to take it that the East Midlands is far enough North that my chances of being gassed by Rob Evans are minimal?

 

[xenon]

I came home on a smallish single decker bus yesterday. I was one of about 25 people standing and I saw one person wearing as mask. People in town are barely wearing them anymore. I wear a mask when visiting clients and that's the only time I wear one.

I mean what do you expect. people will have their own personal reasons for still wearing masks. personally, I’m quite glad to be shot of the things and never want to do that again.

 

[hash tag]

I'm not surprised and even though I'm vulnerable I am not bothered. It was in part a response to someone on here a week or so ago who gave the impression that more people were still concerned by this. They said they were "reluctant" to share a lift with anyone.

 

[krtek a houby]

Have seen 3 people without masks so far today, think the govt is about to ease its mask wearing guidelines in the next few days.

 

[gentlegreen]

Have seen 3 people without masks so far today, think the govt is about to ease its mask wearing guidelines in the next few days.

Infection is presumably the new booster for all but the clinically vulnerable...

 

[Pickman's model]

I have never been to Worthing, although I understand it's a seaside resort.

People may not take LFTs, but if they're admitted to hospital, they're tested for Covid. So I think we have some idea of what's going on in that seaside resort. Obviously there may be any number of cases that don't merit hospital admission, but the point is that serious cases are identified.

You're very optimistic in thinking serious cases will be identified, or you've switched off brain, which I thinks more likely

 

[AnnO'Neemus]

I had a minor procedure in hospital on Tuesday, stayed in overnight. Hardly any staff wearing masks, which surprised me.

 

[kalidarkone]

I have never been to Worthing, although I understand it's a seaside resort.

People may not take LFTs, but if they're admitted to hospital, they're tested for Covid. So I think we have some idea of what's going on in that seaside resort. Obviously there may be any number of cases that don't merit hospital admission, but the point is that serious cases are identified.

When people are admitted to hospital they are only tested via LFTS unless they are going to ICU. I have had quite a few incidents of patients LFT being negative but the Rapid PCR being positive and the proportion of patients having the rapid is very small. Therefore I would say that we really don't know what's going on anywhere.

 

[kalidarkone]

I had a minor procedure in hospital on Tuesday, stayed in overnight. Hardly any staff wearing masks, which surprised me.

Its not been mandatory since two weeks ago in my trust.

 

[AnnO'Neemus]

Its not been mandatory since two weeks ago in my trust.

Struck me as weird, given the number of vulnerable patients in hospitals, I'd have thought they'd err on the side of caution still, given the potential repercussions if a staff member has it and gives it to patients who might be immune compromised or otherwise at high risk.

I mean, I know no one else gives a shit. I finally caught it in December, after being careful all pandemic, and strongly suspect I caught it from the minicab driver who was coughing on the journey to my friend's funeral. (I hadn't been exposed to anything else like that.) When I phoned to complain I was basically told that they don't have to test, they don't have to wear masks, and they have the right to spread a potentially deadly disease, so fuck you, basically.

I'd have thought hospitals would still be a bit more cautious than the general population, given the 'customer base'.

 

[mentalchik]

My mum who is in hospital due to her advanced alzheimer's got covid a week ago for the first time...