The Reform UK Party (latest nigel farage vehicle) is it to be laughed at or not

[Elohim]

Completely agree the lottery shouldn't be run by a private company but 'brown envelopes' have got fuck all to do with it.

The profits from the lottery aren't spent by the private company. They are given straight over to the various lottery grant distributors (National Lottery Community Fund / National Lottery Heritage Fund / Sport England / Arts Council etc). Charities and sometimes councils apply to these for money through a completely open process.

If instead the lottery funded essential services like the NHS a huge amount of charitable activity in this country would immediately collapse. It keeps loads of stuff afloat. It's taxes (with more on wealth) that should fund essential services not poor people buying a fucking lottery ticket.

Why do you call everyone who buys a lottery ticket poor?
The lottery would be better funding essential services NHS, mental health services , Detox/Rehabilitation etc

I very much doubt all the profits from the lottery are spent on charity causes don't forget alot of charities have become more like corporations and have fat cat CEOs at the top and people in poverty often doing the actual work.

 

[klang]

so non-lottery-ticket-buyers would be to blame for underfunding of essential services?

 

[lazythursday]

Why do you call everyone who buys a lottery ticket poor?
The lottery would be better funding essential services NHS, mental health services , Detox/Rehabilitation etc

I very much doubt all the profits from the lottery are spent on charity causes don't forget alot of charities have become more like corporations and have fat cat CEOs at the top and people in poverty often doing the actual work.

Not everyone is poor - but more people play the National Lottery in poorer regions o f the country.

As someone who has applied for grants I can assure you you are completely wrong. You can take some money to cover overheads (which includes the CEO salary) but the vast majority goes on project delivery. If there was no lottery funding for charities, sports etc we would be an even more miserable country. And some lottery money does already go on mental health initiatives anyway. Pay for public services through progressive taxes ffs, then it is fair.

 

[a_chap]

...alot of charities have become more like corporations and have fat cat CEOs at the top and people in poverty often doing the actual work.

Really?

Name these charities with fat cat CEOs and people in poverty doing the "actual work".

 

[lazythursday]

Really?

Name these charities with fat cat CEOs and people in poverty doing the "actual work".

I think Elohim is quite right that there are some large charities with very well paid management teams and poorly paid frontline staff. Charities can be terrible employers sometimes. But the charity sector is really diverse and most charities are small and local.

 

[Sue]

Would make more sense for the lottery to be publicly owned to fund our essential services the only reason is not is because too many brown envelopes circling.

Or you know essential services could be funded by tax rather than depending on gambling? Crazy idea I know.

 

[Pickman's model]

Why do you call everyone who buys a lottery ticket poor?
The lottery would be better funding essential services NHS, mental health services , Detox/Rehabilitation etc

I very much doubt all the profits from the lottery are spent on charity causes don't forget alot of charities have become more like corporations and have fat cat CEOs at the top and people in poverty often doing the actual work.

why do you separate the nhs from mental health services and detox / rehab?

 

[a_chap]

I think Elohim is quite right that there are some large charities with very well paid management teams and poorly paid frontline staff.

Name them.

 

[lazythursday]

Name them.

I used to work for a charity - it's not exactly a controversial view that pay within the sector is often poor. I'm not going to name specific charities as that will take a fuck load of research - I don't want to name those I know personally as I could help make me identifiable. I don't agree with the often expressed view that all the money gets stuffed into management's pockets but christ I saw some poor practice during my stint in the sector so I don't think everything is rosy either.

 

[smokedout]

Name them.

British Heart Foundation - CEO on £218,400, sales assistants on minimum wage with much of the heavy work carried out by people on community payback or Jobcentre work experience schemes who don't get paid at all. Lots of other charities who run shops are the same.

 

[smokedout]

St Mungos - from UNITE - CEO pay stands at £189,000 while the lowest paid workers get just £20,000

I could do this all day.

 

[The39thStep]

Or you know essential services could be funded by tax rather than depending on gambling? Crazy idea I know.

Tankie

 

[a_chap]

British Heart Foundation - CEO on £218,400, sales assistants on minimum wage with much of the heavy work carried out by people on community payback or Jobcentre work experience schemes who don't get paid at all. Lots of other charities who run shops are the same.

Get people to boycott the BHF. Evil bastards.

St Mungos - from UNITE - CEO pay stands at £189,000 while the lowest paid workers get just £20,000

Them too.

I could do this all day.

Keep going.

Expose all the charities that pay people to much. Close them down.

 

[smokedout]

Have a look for yourself: Average CEO pay at large charities rises to £175,000, survey shows

With an annual income of over £1.2m, Steve Gray of Nuffield Health remains the highest-paid chief executive. Gray earned between £930,000 and £940,000 in 2021.

Al Russell, chief executive of the London Clinic Trustees and Paul Nurse, CEO of the Francis Crick Institute, ranked second and third, earning respective incomes of £510,000-520,000 and £420,000-430,000.

Julie Maxton, executive director of the Royal Society, is the 4th highest earner and the highest-paid female leader, with a salary of £385,000.

 

[Ax^]

Is this because I dared to ask questions regarding Raja Miah ? These questions are in the public eye right now your response is like being back on the CLP chat group

What Raja Miah is saying about the labour party is it true or false and if its false then the labour party can start taking this man to court slander/libel.
At the moment grooming gang cover ups are a hot topic now we have 2 options scream far right propaghanda and eventually ReformUK conduct their own enquiry or we challenge the labour party to see if these allegations are true or false.

are you Raja Miah

 

[Elohim]

are you Raja Miah

Yes I am and so is my wife

 

[Monkeygrinder's Organ]

Have a look for yourself: Average CEO pay at large charities rises to £175,000, survey shows

With an annual income of over £1.2m, Steve Gray of Nuffield Health remains the highest-paid chief executive. Gray earned between £930,000 and £940,000 in 2021.

Al Russell, chief executive of the London Clinic Trustees and Paul Nurse, CEO of the Francis Crick Institute, ranked second and third, earning respective incomes of £510,000-520,000 and £420,000-430,000.

Julie Maxton, executive director of the Royal Society, is the 4th highest earner and the highest-paid female leader, with a salary of £385,000.

Tbh though none of these are the sort of charities people donate to are they. That's not how they run or what they're for. There's probably a wider debate about what should and shouldn't be charities but they don't back up the 'all your donation goes to the chief exec' point.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Tbh though none of these are the sort of charities people donate to are they. That's not how they run or what they're for. There's probably a wider debate about what should and shouldn't be charities but they don't back up the 'all your donation goes to the chief exec' point.

Private healthcare companies and private schools are both examples of charities for the rich. They're an odd phenomenon.

Eta: however, looking up the Francis crick institute, it is part funded by Cancer Research UK, which is the sort of charity that runs shops, sponsored walks etc.

 

[DotCommunist]

I totally agree, from a marketing and messaging point of view, the Reform name is perfect for their project.

And, somewhat more successful than 'Change UK', remember them?

Ah yes, change uk. Their financial records were mysteriously destroyed. Perfectly normal party there, a genuine real party and not a wrecking operation stuffed with clowns which failed to survive contact with the electorate. Shennanigans.

 

[Pickman's model]

Have we ever discussed the name of the party? Not wishing to sound too much like the brewdog thread's greatest troll, but isn't the company/"party"name Reform a bit of genius marketing?

Starting with the established, usual meaning of the term, it signals a differentiation from the established right who seek to conserve and an intent to make changes that bring about improvement. It also implies changes to established institutions that, potentially, appeals to the disaffected voters and implies that the party has an 'insurgent' element in conflict with the incumbent parties of Government.

For the politically literate voter the term also has a meaning implying an anti-revolutionary, gradualist or reformist agenda that might appeal those thirsty for change, but not too much change. Some older voters may also even see, maybe subconsciously, a nod to authoritarianism in the name; they may be old enough to remember Reform schools where were 'bad' youths were sent for correction?

My final thought relates to the provenance of the party; born out of the collapse of UKIP and the Brexit party, which both had redundant titles to closely associated with the limp failure of withdrawal from the supra-state, the notion of reform gives Falange the ideal platform to simultaneously take credit for the "independence" whist also saying how the established parties had blown the opportunities it afforded; brexit just need reform for the golden age to arrive!

I dunno, we laugh at the Falangist project/company, but maybe that choice of party name was pretty smart?

it's like the ruc, people often ignore the party's full name - reform uk, or refuk for short

 

[emanymton]

I totally agree, from a marketing and messaging point of view, the Reform name is perfect for their project.

And, somewhat more successful than 'Change UK', remember them?

Nope never heard of them.

 

[Dystopiary]

Ah yes, change uk. Their financial records were mysteriously destroyed. Perfectly normal party there, a genuine real party and not a wrecking operation stuffed with clowns which failed to survive contact with the electorate. Shennanigans.

Oh yeah, I remember all the liberals fawning over Anna Soubry because she was against Brexit.

 

[Boo Radley75]

All I remember about Change UK was a bunch of anti brexit Tory MPs going out for a Nandos with a bunch of anti Corbyn Labour MPs, before fucking off into the political wilderness as the next general election.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Yep, those were the fuckers.

 

[smokedout]

Tbh though none of these are the sort of charities people donate to are they. That's not how they run or what they're for. There's probably a wider debate about what should and shouldn't be charities but they don't back up the 'all your donation goes to the chief exec' point.

The Francis Crick Institute and the Royal Society both fundraise, although more from grant/corporate funding, high value donations and legacies rather than rattling cans in the street. There are plenty of charities who do carry out that sort of fundrasing who's CEOs are paid £200,000+.

 

[Pickman's model]

All I remember about Change UK was a bunch of anti brexit Tory MPs going out for a Nandos with a bunch of anti Corbyn Labour MPs, before fucking off into the political wilderness as the next general election.
View attachment 460977

chuka umunna has had his chips

 

[Smokeandsteam]

Not sure how reliable the polling company is, but the general direction of travel is pretty clear.

Reform into the lead, and Labour down to third. The two establishment parties now below 45%…

 

[cupid_stunt]

Not sure how reliable the polling company is, but the general direction of travel is pretty clear.

Reform into the lead, and Labour down to third. The two establishment parties now below 45%…

View attachment 461043

They always, together with More in Common, seem to give Reform a higher polling number, in comparison with Lab & Con, than the others, take with a pinch of salt.

Opinion polling for the next United Kingdom general election - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Jeremiah18.17]

Anderson posting pictures of nooses on his social media now, alongside all his usual racist and fascist dog whistles…
But I am sure his supporters will say he just wants a fair and nuanced discussion on sentencing policy…