SWP expulsions and squabbles

[butchersapron]

Big big hitter who will drag the issue out globally.

 

[discokermit]

highgate cemetery is the only place that during the zombie apocalypse, the zombies will all be fighting each other.

 

[TremulousTetra]

but this is nothing to do with kronstadt (altho some are making the link between organisational structures of the bolshevik party in 1921 and organisations which claim to be inspired by bolsheviks today) this is something tht has happened NOW, a crime has allegedly been committed, and that is what the thread is about. you dont seem to have a clue about what the thread is about except that the swp is getting a slagging

I don't have a clue, any knowledge whatsoever about the first hundred and 20 pages of this thread, or what takes place in the SWP today. I've already said that. If I discussed something I have no knowledge of I would be damned, quite rightly.



To be honest I don't really care about the SWP. I only oppose people saying things that from my first-hand experience appear not to be true. And that is more for entertainment than allegiance.

From what I red whilst a member , their actions fitted their words and suggested to me Central committee argued for what they thought was going to benefit the working class movement as a whole. Wether what they thought was in fact fact the case, is legitimate debate. some of the things that get said on here ain't FMPOV.

 

[sihhi]

Cheers, surprised that a stone in that place only costs that.

Well I don't know about the specific locations - I imagine - don't know - it runs from several hundred up to a few thousand - depending on the location within the cemetery. I don't know if being near Karl Marks is desired. The guy who wrote Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy his place is some kind of desired spot there.

 

[butchersapron]

I don't have a clue, any knowledge whatsoever about the first hundred and 20 pages of this thread, or what takes place in the SWP today. I've already said that. If I discussed something I have no knowledge of I would be damned, quite rightly.



To be honest I don't really care about the SWP. I only oppose people saying things that from my first-hand experience appear not to be true. And that is more for entertainment than allegiance.

From what I red whilst a member , their actions fitted their words and suggested to me Central committee argued for what they thought was going to benefit the working class movement as a whole. Wether what they thought was in fact fact the case, is legitimate debate. some of the things that get said on here ain't FMPOV.

Look, making all allowances for your voice recognition problems, you say that you have nothing to say then badger people to say something in response to your posts. Don't. Just stop it. This thread doesn't need it . If you do want to get up to date then taking an hour or so and reading this thread and related links is far better then crashing it with what you have done. The working class deserve no less.

 

[discokermit]

taking an hour or so and reading this thread and related links

i'd pencil in at least a fortnight.

 

[butchersapron]

i'd pencil in at least a fortnight.

As a long term defender of the party - and of the cc esp -i reckon he should be able to. Then another for what's happened since.

 

[discokermit]

As a long term defender of the party - and of the cc esp -i reckon he should be able to. Then another for what's happened since.

or at least not post until he has.

 

[butchersapron]

or at least not post until he has.

I think we can get a round table agreement on that.

 

[Nigel Irritable]

Big big hitter who will drag the issue out globally.

Yes, an actual big name. I must admit, there are some on there I've never heard of.

 

[butchersapron]

Yes, an actual big name. I must admit, there are some on there I've never heard of.

That's because you lot don't keep up with marxism.

 

[butchersapron]

Oh sorry, you ARE marxism.

 

[sihhi]

On Callinicos the reaction on twitter - the place where most of the SWP type student left post - seems to be largely negative.

Some people are tweeting him, again bad internet is the only possible conclusion.

YUNG HORSEBURGER ‏@HenriTroppmann
@alex_callinicos what are you wearing? are you sure you should be going out like that?

4h YUNG HORSEBURGER ‏@HenriTroppmann
@alex_callinicos mind giving me some details about your romantic history?

4h YUNG HORSEBURGER ‏@HenriTroppmann
@alex_callinicos is it fair to say that you've liked to have a drink lately?

 

[butchersapron]

On Callinicos the reaction on twitter - the place where most of the SWP type student left post - seems to be largely negative.

Some people are tweeting him, again bad internet is the only possible conclusion.

OOh, that is bad, they have lost them haven't they?

(edit: of course, only one example)

 

[chilango]

but no you won't.

So evidently, being an anarchist is like the film Fight Club. At every meeting the mantra is "the first rule about anarchism is, you do not discuss anarchism".

In all seriousness that would be a good rule.

 

[butchersapron]

Some Proyect stuff

 

[butchersapron]

3 days to get get the 20% - what the news? What's the prep they done when they don't get it.

 

[Nigel Irritable]

That's because you lot don't keep up with marxism.

Apparently not.

Seriously, who is Thomas Walpole?

 

[The39thStep]

i used to work in the white lion in withington and people were queuing up to hear what i had to say

I am not surprised Binka. Was it about cooking by any chance?

 

[butchersapron]

Apparently not.

Seriously, who is Thomas Walpole?

Never heard of him, so maybe expect some names from 'outside' to appear.

 

[Nigel Irritable]

Some Proyect stuff

Grim. He even manages to misread Owen Jones.

 

[butchersapron]

The prof is now done.

 

[butchersapron]

Grim. He even manages to misread Owen Jones.

Yes, that wasn't something i was endorsing. He never gets it right. Signs of ripples over there though,

 

[Nigel Irritable]

The prof is now done.

You think it will do him real damage?

I don' t think it will do him any favours, but suspect he's too well entrenched for it fuck anything up on him.

 

[Nigel Irritable]

Yes, that wasn't something i was endorsing. He never gets it right. Signs of ripples over there though,

Not only is Lenin now a prophet of SYRIZA, Owen Jones is too.

 

[bolshiebhoy]

Robert Brenner joins this list: http://openletterswp.wordpress.com/ it seems to be gathering momentum.

Oh fuck. it really is the July Days.

 

[sihhi]

Big big hitter who will drag the issue out globally.

He could tip the rest of the New Left Review Verso crowd with him - into a similar 'sort out Delta or we're not coming to Marxism position'.

The full list after a day is: Greg Albo, Abbie Bakan, Jairus Banaji, Robert Brenner, Gail Day, Steve Edwards, Nadine El-Enany, Phil Gasper, Peter Hallward, Adam Hanieh, Owen Hatherley, Paul Kellogg, Brian Kelly, Conor Kostick, Robert Knox, Thomas Marois, David McNally, Adam Morton, James Murphy, Kevin Murphy, Ilan Pappé, Charles Post, Nina Power, Gregory Schwartz, Peter Thomas, Alberto Toscano, Thomas Walpole, Jeffery Webber, Rafeef Ziadah.

Within the leftie microcosm (academic style):
Nina Power has a sizeable socialist feminist following, been to lots of Marxisms to debate Judith Orr and others. Owen Hatherley is on the Guardian and leftie architecture people respect him, and has written for Socialist Worker. Jairus Banaji is well respected in India writes in the main serious left Marxist economic journal and won the Deutscher prize in 2011 (Alex Callinicos on the jury), Abbie Bakan is big in gender studies in Canada does Canada's version and US version, David McNally is big in political economy in Canada again both, Ilan Pappe is big in Israel and been lots of Marxisms. Kevin Murphy is a Russia specialist, wrote a history of Moscow engineering workers, respected in wider liberal and left academia (Callinicos was on the jury panel that awarded that book the Deutscher Prize).
Conor Kostick. Seen his book but not sure how far his influence runs in SWP united front organisations/academia in Ireland.
Peter Hallward. Read his internet articles on Haiti, he was supportive of the Middlesex University occupation a while back, don't know how influential. Has done Marxism.

I googled the others who didn't ring any bells and there appears to be a small overlap with the editorial board behind Historical Materialism, that has had other writers and editorial board people at Marxism especially those from SOAS: Robert Knox, Thomas Marois and Alberto Toscano are apparently all part of Historical Marxism - and the SWP's ISJ always refers to articles in HM in its Recommended Reading bit.



If we add Owen Jones too that's quite a large chunk of "prominent lefties" saying No.

ETA:

Apparently China Mieville who wrote

"Therefore we urge all our comrades to ask themselves the question: given all of the above, have you reached your line in the sand? And if not, where will that line be?"

recently is also an editor board member on Historical Materialism.

 

[Nigel Irritable]

Albo edits the Socialist Register.

 

[imposs1904]

He could tip the rest of the New Left Review Verso crowd with him - into a similar 'sort out Delta or we're not coming to Marxism position'.

The full list after a day is: Greg Albo, Abbie Bakan, Jairus Banaji, Robert Brenner, Gail Day, Steve Edwards, Nadine El-Enany, Phil Gasper, Peter Hallward, Adam Hanieh, Owen Hatherley, Paul Kellogg, Brian Kelly, Conor Kostick, Robert Knox, Thomas Marois, David McNally, Adam Morton, James Murphy, Kevin Murphy, Ilan Pappé, Charles Post, Nina Power, Gregory Schwartz, Peter Thomas, Alberto Toscano, Thomas Walpole, Jeffery Webber, Rafeef Ziadah.


If we add Owen Jones too that's quite a large chunk of "prominent lefties" saying No.

If Harvey adds his name to that list, it's game over.

 

[bolshiebhoy]

3 days to get get the 20% - what the news? What's the prep they done when they don't get it.

They won't will they. Hearing some middle grounders watering down their motions ahead of branch meetings this week. pendulum swinging against them.