Star Trek TV series(es) - general discussion of the franchise

[danny la rouge]

I used to think you were the voice of reason

Oh come on, even in the wonderful Tribbles episode (which I love), Sisko wrecks all the timing in the gags that are written for him.

 

[maomao]

I started to Google BSG to see what the exact relation between the OS and the reboot was but ended up on the British Society of Gastroeneterology's Twitter page and there are some things you just can't unsee.

Even that was better than most of DS9 though.

 

[danny la rouge]

I was hoping to find a clip of this scene, where Sisko tries to use his old school Star Fleet badge as a communicator:

It’s a great gag, but he completely fumbles it.

 

[ATOMIC SUPLEX]

I didn't mind ds9 at the time, it was just EastEnders in space. These days I struggle with the next generation and only got two EPs into that new one.

 

[krtek a houby]

I didn't mind ds9 at the time, it was just EastEnders in space. These days I struggle with the next generation and only got two EPs into that new one.

Ah, we were both a bit so-what for the first 2 eps but it takes off after that. Am actually excited for the next season. Discovery, that is.

 

[danny la rouge]

ENT and continuity part 102:

The last few episodes of ENT S1 have referred to the crew anticipating shore leave on Risa. Two things: first, I’ll need to check, but I seem to remember that when it is first mentioned in TNG (in a conversation), Riker is describing it to JL Picard in a way that suggests Riker is only newly familiar with it, and that Picard is not. Later it became a regular venue for shore leave, both in TNG and DS9, as well as being mentioned in conversation in VOY. But I was under the impression that at that point, Risa was an exotic place, new to humans. How then can the ENT crew be due to visit in 2150?

That may be a mistaken impression on my part. But the next point is more serious: after DS9 is relocated to the mouth of the Bajor Wormhole, we ate told on several occasions that Risa is only 6 hours by “runabout” from DS9.

Given that this is Deep Space 9, we can assume this is a long way from Earth. We know Bajor is on the edge of Cardassian Space. Bajor has applied for Federation membership at this point (2369ACE), but is not yet a member. This is therefore just beyond the outer edge of Federation territory.

Even if the direction of Risa is back into Federation Space towards Earth from DS9, it is still only 6 hours in.

How can Enterprise NX-01 possibly be there by now? It is warp 5 on paper, but shudders, overheats, and bursts into flames at top speeds.

Is Federation Space just much smaller than I’d imagined?

 

[cybershot]

ENT and continuity part 102:

The last few episodes of ENT S1 have referred to the crew anticipating shore leave on Risa. Two things: first, I’ll need to check, but I seem to remember that when it is first mentioned in TNG (in a conversation), Riker is describing it to JL Picard in a way that suggests Riker is only newly familiar with it, and that Picard is not. Later it became a regular venue for shore leave, both in TNG and DS9, as well as being mentioned in conversation in VOY. But I was under the impression that at that point, Risa was an exotic place, new to humans. How then can the ENT crew be due to visit in 2150?

That may be a mistaken impression on my part. But the next point is more serious: after DS9 is relocated to the mouth of the Bajor Wormhole, we ate told on several occasions that Risa is only 6 hours by “runabout” from DS9.

Given that this is Deep Space 9, we can assume this is a long way from Earth. We know Bajor is on the edge of Cardassian Space. Bajor has applied for Federation membership at this point (2369ACE), but is not yet a member. This is therefore just beyond the outer edge of Federation territory.

Even if the direction of Risa is back into Federation Space towards Earth from DS9, it is still only 6 hours in.

How can Enterprise NX-01 possibly be there by now? It is warp 5 on paper, but shudders, overheats, and bursts into flames at top speeds.

Is Federation Space just much smaller than I’d imagined?

Possibly. When I was properly into this and had ST encyplopedias and what not, explored space in the alpha quadrant was still relatively small in the grand scale of things.

Also, how warp speed was calculated in TOS and TNG was different, so I assume ENT takes that on board. So Warp 5 in ENT, is not the same as Warp 5 in TNG.

 

[danny la rouge]

Possibly. When I was properly into this and had ST encyplopedias and what not, explored space in the alpha quadrant was still relatively small in the grand scale of things.

Also, how warp speed was calculated in TOS and TNG was different, so I assume ENT takes that on board. So Warp 5 in ENT, is not the same as Warp 5 in TNG.

I’m not sure it’s even consistent within a series! But I seem to call the Defiant taking a month to get to Earth from DS9. It’s a warp 9.5 vessel (iirc). I know warp factors increase geometrically, so warp 9 is not “twice warp 4.5”. But I wouldn’t know how to calculate what it is.

We need tables.

 

[cybershot]

You ask you shall get:

 

[danny la rouge]

Don’t know if this helps, but I’m watching ENT S1: E24 “Two Days and Two Nights”, and Archer says Sol is 90 light years away (from Risa), and that Risa is “the farthest any of my people have gone”.

 

[Signal 11]

Don’t know if this helps, but I’m watching ENT S1: E24 “Two Days and Two Nights”, and Archer says Sol is 90 light years away (from Risa), and that Risa is “the farthest any of my people have gone”.

Using the TNG scale from the table above, I make it a little under a year at warp 4 or about 5 months at warp 5, Captain. (nearly double those if using the TOS scale)

The DS9 runabout apparently has a top speed of warp 5, so 6 hours would get you 0.15 light years. Our next nearest star is a little over 4 light years away.

Although the Shore Leave Planet from TOS: "Shore Leave" was briefly considered as the destination, it was rejected because it is depicted as being new to Starfleet in that episode, set in the future of this one. Another idea – Wrigley's pleasure planet, which had been mentioned once in TOS: "The Man Trap" – has a name that was thought to sound too Human and too well-known for the relatively distant region of space which Enterprise was now meant to be in. The writers finally settled on choosing Risa, not only because it had been established earlier in the Star Trek franchise but also due to the increased likelihood that it might be in Vulcan ken. "The Vulcans have been there and T'Pol would know about it,"
Two Days and Two Nights (episode)

 

[Poi E]

danny, this has all happened before. And will again.

 

[CNT36]

Bakula’s sidekick from Quantum Leap is in this one!

Some sort of Guantanamo/internment parable right? Only watched it on first airing.

 

[danny la rouge]

Some sort of Guantanamo/internment parable right? Only watched it on first airing.

Yes. Not a bad one either. Very TOS in feel.

Despite my initial reservations, I’m enjoying ENT. It’s been unfairly maligned.

 

[danny la rouge]

In the episode I’ve just watched Archer and Malcolm are in EV suits on the hull. It was a good enough story, but I have a technical complaint. It may be a spoiler for those who haven’t seen the episode.

Spoiler: “technical complaint”

EVA scenario error - For the manoeuvre that saves their lives, the Captain and Malcolm, floating in space on a section of hull plating, leap from the plating into space, and, floating free, then have to spin to face a blast so that the pod doors they are holding will face the blast. So: leap away, spin 180 to face blast, stop dead.

They wouldn’t stop dead. They’d keep pirouetting.

 

[danny la rouge]

I’ve been giving more thought to the physics of that problem.

Spoiler

Although I don’t know the mass of the plating panel (I’m assuming duritanium, of which I don’t know the properties), the “leap” would have been more of a push off than an actual leap. This may have had the effect of pushing the panel (depending on its mass relative to them). However, were they still in orbit over the mined planet? If so, the orbit vector would come into play. From practical examples, the Apollo and Gemini astronaut Mike Collins was able to push off from a Gemini capsule to reach another orbiting craft. The Gemini capsule was very small compared to the Apollo command pod. But Collins did not push Gemini out of its orbit. However he required a lot of very frustrating manoeuvring involving gas guns to correct his direction.

Indeed Gene Cernan had to abandon an earlier Gemini EVA due to exhaustion when he could not remove equipment from the back of the Gemini pod, due to the frustrations of weightlessness: his efforts pushed him away from his target instead of pulling the equipment off its mountings.

Even once Archer and Malcolm were free of the panel, they faced being buffeted by the explosion shock waves. Their ability to direct their “space walk” would have been hampered by the fact they carried no gas guns. And they faced a frustrating few hours of their efforts working against them. They did not have tethers like the Gemini astronauts, nor did they have teleportation like later Star Fleet crew. Their journey back to Enterprise would not have been accomplished before Travis had to go to warp and leave the sector.

 

[danny la rouge]

I’d like to that you all for being here for me. Very few of my friends or relatives would put up with that kind of geekerie.

 

[krtek a houby]

 

[Santino]

I’d like to that you all for being here for me. Very few of my friends or relatives would put up with that kind of geekerie.

We're listening, danny.

 

[Santino]

[An enemy spaceship repeatedly fires torpedoes on the Enterprise]

Troi: Captain, I'm sensing great hostility from the Bu'kari.

 

[CNT36]

Don’t know if this helps, but I’m watching ENT S1: E24 “Two Days and Two Nights”, and Archer says Sol is 90 light years away (from Risa), and that Risa is “the farthest any of my people have gone”.

The Enterprise finale may hold the answer.

 

[danny la rouge]

The Enterprise finale may hold the answer.

No spoilers!!!

(Although my sister - the elder of my two younger sisters - has already said “I can’t wait to find out your outraged reaction to the finale”).

 

[Idris2002]

I’d like to that you all for being here for me. Very few of my friends or relatives would put up with that kind of geekerie.

Son, have you ever kissed a girl?

 

[danny la rouge]

Son, have you ever kissed a girl?

Several times!

 

[Idris2002]

Anyway. . . I've been reading Philip K. Dick's Flow My Tears,the Policeman Said. Published in 1974, and set in a 1988 dominated by a global police state (he was just thirty years off). One neat little detail is that in this fictional 1988, sci-fi movies are referred to as "captain kirks" (all lowercase), which I thought was a nice little homage to the original series.

 

[emanymton]

Several times!

On the lips?

 

[Idris2002]

On the lips?

And was tonguing involved?

 

[danny la rouge]

And was tonguing involved?

Ew, no. Most of them were aunties.

 

[danny la rouge]

I’ve now caught up with myself. Last night I watched the episode I saw some of a couple of years ago: Star Trek: Discovery

I still didn’t like the idea that not all Vulcans have telepathic abilities and are therefore not all able to mind meld. Even though that’s now been set up.

And actually I thought it was a poor episode. Its tone was more soap-like and the subplot was weak. There have been some very good episodes of late, so it was a poor one for me to have dipped into back then.

 

[CNT36]

I’ve now caught up with myself. Last night I watched the episode I saw some of a couple of years ago: Star Trek: Discovery

I still didn’t like the idea that not all Vulcans have telepathic abilities and are therefore not all able to mind meld. Even though that’s now been set up.

And actually I thought it was a poor episode. Its tone was more soap-like and the subplot was weak. There have been some very good episodes of late, so it was a poor one for me to have dipped into back then.

I think we were supposed as a knowing audience to realise that was bullshit A bit like the stuff about how very few Trills could join in Deep Space Nine being a lie and a means of social control.