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Rotherham child rape gangs: At least 1400 victims

....OK....I admit its quite possible its part of the picture...

...maybe they all meet at the local Masonic Lodge thats SOP in local govt isn't it...?
 
The man mentioned in that blog, Jahangir Akhtar, deputy leader of the council, was a taxi driver, and does have some previous.

This is the Guardian's report of his conviction for a brawl in the restaurant:

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2002/jun/19/politics.labour

The local paper's initial report makes for rather sinister reading, suggesting that Akhtar is a nasty piece of work:



http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news...es/councillor-suspended-after-brawl-1-2413143

He escaped jail partly due to a glowing recommendation from the local police.

so in that instance the state definitely shielded him from the effects of prosecution . While in other instances hes been appointed administrator of charitable funds..community funded posts ..received preferential licensing for his business . Either exceptionally lucky or someone up there likes hm .

this is precisely what goes on up the shankhill road...particularly the funded communty jobs . This stuff is pretty run of the mill in some quarters. And hes from a community were someone who could guarantee to keep extremists ether under tabs or in line in his community would be looked on quite favourably and let do what he wants pretty much because thats the precise MO elsewhere.
 
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Some of this stuff on Rotherhampolitics is just incredible

http://rotherhampolitics.wordpress.com/2014/08/27/akhtar-and-the-scene-of-the-crime/

The case of Jessica was one of those Rotherham Child Sex Abuse cases reported by Andrew Norfolk in the Times. Jessica claims that when she was abducted from a Children’s Services foster home her abductor and sexual abuser was allowed to go free, un-prosecuted. She further alleged that his freedom resulted from a deal done by former Councillor Jahangir Akhtar to secure a non-prosecution deal in return for her release.

The perpetrator, Ash Hussain, was a close family friend of Akhtars, so close that once when in hospital he named Akhtars address as his home.

She stated that when she was handed over to Police Akhtar was stood nearby and that is was probably Akhtar who arranged for her abuser to be taken home.

Publicly Akhtar focused on the Police assessing whether or not he had done anything illegal despite it never being suggested by the Times that he hsd donr. The allegation was culpability not illegality.

In his version his only involvement was giving the telephone number of the abusers mother of to the Police.

This does beg a few questions;

1. – Which Policeman contacted Akhtar and how did he know of his relationship with the abuser?

2. – Did Akhtar just pass over the mother’s number without questioning what it was about?

3. – Did he discuss it with the mother or Hussain afterwards?

4. – Why do others finger Akhtar as being there?

There doesn’t seem to be any argument about the girl being handed over in a service station. Something in itself that is quite bizarre and a little dramatic; normally a hot potato would be handed over quickly, dropped in town, or outside a police station.

So unusual is the hand over and the failure to prosecute it suggests that a deal was done and more questions need to be asked.

5. – At what level in SYP was the decision to not arrest and prosecute made?

This last question is very important. A policeman or woman, maybe more than one, made a decision to pardon the perpetrator of a clearly committed offence . More questions:

6. Was there a process to decide when and when not to prosecute in these types or case and was it applied?

7. – Was the police officer /s authorised to make that decision?

8. – Was the case referred to the CPS?

It is frankly hard to believe that some deal wasn’t done, and difficult to believe that someone with Akhtars ego would leave it to the perpetrators mum.

AS important is that Akhtar never used or advised the Council of his personal knowledge and experience when later he became a Councillor….

When the Police found that Akhtar had not broken the law on this occasion they did not give an alternative view of the event.

Of course if the Police themselves were breaking the law, Akhtar would anyway have had the defence of simply doing what he was asked. He shelters behinds the Polices own guilt.

The fact is that the Police should never have investigated themselves.
 
this is precisely what goes on up the shankhill road...particularly the funded communty jobs . This stuff is pretty run of the mill in some quarters. And hes from a community were someone who could guarantee to keep extremists ether under tabs or in line in his community would be looked on quite favourably and let do what he wants pretty much because thats the precise MO elsewhere.
This is a very good point. This is his leverage.
 
Others have asked for explanations as to how this could go on for so long undetected, implying that it must have been general knowledge among certain 'communities'. The answer is partly that the abusers were violent men who threatened people into silence, but it also appears that they may well have had friends in powerful places - friends who could get the girls charged with offences rather than them, friends high up in the local political network. And this man's name keeps cropping up. Not sure he's someone I'd be choosing to pin stuff on, given that he's clearly connected.
I understand what you're saying. I'm not sure I have any difficulty in envisaging circumstances in which a lot of bad stuff can happen without being 'visible'. There are plenty of 'blind corners' in public space, even if you aren't dealing - as was the case in Rotherham - with an inability to see and an inability to recognize, which then turned into a refusal to look or to look properly when the skeletons bony fingers started tapping on the closet door. But that's just speculation too.

The problem I have with the refrain that 'the community must have known' is that a lot of it seems to be based on dubious assumptions about what a close knit community is. I've lived in a unusually close knit community - the idea that because you know or are related to a lot of your neighbours you know everything about them, or that there aren't private spaces, private relations and lots and lots of secrets is just utter bollocks. Even a highly integrated community isn't some fucking panopticon.

(Then there is the further problem that some of this suddenly acquired 'expertise' on the Pakistani heritage community in Rotherham is based on the same paranoid conspiraloon bollocks which gets directed to the secret networks of gays, freemasons, jews, etc. etc.)
 
I understand what you're saying. I'm not sure I have any difficulty in envisaging circumstances in which a lot of bad stuff can happen without being 'visible'. There are plenty of 'blind corners' in public space, even if you aren't dealing - as was the case in Rotherham - with an inability to see and an inability to recognize, which then turned into a refusal to look or to look properly when the skeletons bony fingers started tapping on the closet door. But that's just speculation too.

The problem I have with the refrain that 'the community must have known' is that a lot of it seems to be based on dubious assumptions about what a close knit community is. I've lived in a unusually close knit community - the idea that because you know or are related to a lot of your neighbours you know everything about them, or that there aren't private spaces, private relations and lots and lots of secrets is just utter bollocks. Even a highly integrated community isn't some fucking panopticon.

(Then there is the further problem that some of this suddenly acquired 'expertise' on the Pakistani heritage community in Rotherham is based on the same paranoid conspiraloon bollocks which gets directed to the secret networks of gays, freemasons, jews, etc. etc.)
I totally agree. The 'community must have known refrain' is exactly what I'm arguing against. No, those who found out were threatened, and further, the abusers had protection from powerful people, and further way too many people in authority simply didn't give a shit. That's the explanation. No doubt, they will have wanted as few people as possible to have known.
 
<snippage>
The problem I have with the refrain that 'the community must have known' is that a lot of it seems to be based on dubious assumptions about what a close knit community is. I've lived in a unusually close knit community - the idea that because you know or are related to a lot of your neighbours you know everything about them, or that there aren't private spaces, private relations and lots and lots of secrets is just utter bollocks. Even a highly integrated community isn't some fucking panopticon.

(Then there is the further problem that some of this suddenly acquired 'expertise' on the Pakistani heritage community in Rotherham is based on the same paranoid conspiraloon bollocks which gets directed to the secret networks of gays, freemasons, jews, etc. etc.)
I dunno. I really don't get where the idea of conspiraloon bollocks comes from. Have you read the report? I really recommend it, if your stomach is strong enough.

E2A And yeah, the community can't be held to blame for the crimes of an individual. Though this is worth bearing in mind:
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/aug/29/-sp-untold-story-culture-of-shame-ruzwana-bashir
 
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I dunno. I really don't get where the idea of conspiraloon bollocks comes from. Have you read the report? I really recommend it, if your stomach is strong enough.
Yes I've read the Jay report, I read it the day it was published and I was urging other people to do so many pages back in this thread. Where do I get the idea that people are approaching this with conspiraloon goggles on ? By reading a lot of the stuff that is being written about it.

ETA - with one obvious now banned example I'm not talking about here.
 
I understand what you're saying. I'm not sure I have any difficulty in envisaging circumstances in which a lot of bad stuff can happen without being 'visible'. There are plenty of 'blind corners' in public space, even if you aren't dealing - as was the case in Rotherham - with an inability to see and an inability to recognize, which then turned into a refusal to look or to look properly when the skeletons bony fingers started tapping on the closet door. But that's just speculation too.

The problem I have with the refrain that 'the community must have known' is that a lot of it seems to be based on dubious assumptions about what a close knit community is. I've lived in a unusually close knit community - the idea that because you know or are related to a lot of your neighbours you know everything about them, or that there aren't private spaces, private relations and lots and lots of secrets is just utter bollocks. Even a highly integrated community isn't some fucking panopticon.

(Then there is the further problem that some of this suddenly acquired 'expertise' on the Pakistani heritage community in Rotherham is based on the same paranoid conspiraloon bollocks which gets directed to the secret networks of gays, freemasons, jews, etc. etc.)

yeah but white people knew too..white cops..white social workers . And not least white families who sat in impotent fear as their daughters went off with these scum to protect them from reprisal . its not what the Pakistani community knew thats really an issue..its what everyone n Rotherham seemed to know as well . So to try and lay the blame at the Pakistani communty door is ridiculous simply on the basis everyone else knew too . Plenty of people were reporting them..nothing was done. Certanly doesnt appear to have been ther own community sheilding them. Someone else entirely.
 
What on earth are you talking about ? As far as I am aware I was one of the first to draw attention to the section of the report about the role of taxi drivers and firms, and to insist that we were talking about networks of criminals and a criminal subculture. The conspiraloon aspect I was referring to above is the approach to the Pakistani heritage community which insists that it consists of a complicit conspiratorial community.
 
What on earth are you talking about ? As far as I am aware I was one of the first to draw attention to the section of the report about the role of taxi drivers and firms, and to insist that we were talking about networks of criminals and a criminal subculture. The conspiraloon aspect I was referring to above is the approach to the Pakistani heritage community which insists that it consists of a complicit conspiratorial community.
Talking at crossed purposes here, I think. It's only the racist new members who've been saying this crap. We should do our best to ignore them (I know, I often fail in this).

ETA: I don't think it's conspiraloonery. I think it's just simple racism.

ETAA: Good posts by you on this thread, btw. Cheers.
 
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What on earth are you talking about ? As far as I am aware I was one of the first to draw attention to the section of the report about the role of taxi drivers and firms, and to insist that we were talking about networks of criminals and a criminal subculture. The conspiraloon aspect I was referring to above is the approach to the Pakistani heritage community which insists that it consists of a complicit conspiratorial community.
Yeah, apologies! I find it hard to keep track of who said what.
 
I plead guilty to probably not making myself clear for which apologies. But it is Saturday night. I guess I'm trying to say two things - the least interesting being the conspiraloon angle, because as littlebabyjesus said it's best to ignore it.

The other thing about the nature of close knit communities is relevant I think.
 
I plead guilty to probably not making myself clear for which apologies. But it is Saturday night. I guess I'm trying to say two things - the least interesting being the conspiraloon angle, because as littlebabyjesus said it's best to ignore it.

The other thing about the nature of close knit communities is relevant I think.
It is. That story by Ruzwana Bashir is chilling. I believe her.
 
Why do brown people have to be ashamed and sorry because of the actions of scum they don't even know just because they are they same skin colour? Srs question?

...you mean why should they be very publically & determinedly disassociating themselves from the "scum" as much as they can...?

..er....PR...?

...getting your message out to the public directly ?

..."brown people" have just been on the receiving end of about £200m quids worth of free press and tv publicity...none of it very good...
 
...you mean why should they be very publically & determinedly disassociating themselves from the "scum" as much as they can...?

..er....PR...?

...getting your message out to the public directly ?

..."brown people" have just been on the receiving end of about £200m quids worth of free press and tv publicity...none of it very good...

Your contributions here have been less than worthless, please do fuck off
 
Nope, not joking. :)





It isn't necessary for you because like the mainstream/smokescreen debate the concept of race only seems to apply when we are talking about people who are not White.

You disgust me, you cowardly shithouse. You can't even make a baseless accusation with any spine. :rolleyes:
 
So where are we on this thread?

The Economist came up with a good phrase yesterday - "ethnic misogyny"

Thoughts?

(and btw, this thread is of no consequence - a point that is worth underlining in light of "heated" exchanges)
 
So where are we on this thread?

The Economist came up with a good phrase yesterday - "ethnic misogyny"

Thoughts?

(and btw, this thread is of no consequence - a point that is worth underlining in light of "heated" exchanges)
Sounds like this thread has advanced way beyond yesterday's Economist.
 
Another factor that is worth exploring, although I am not directly casting aspersions, is the procedure and provenance of the investigation and report itself.

Delving a bit deeper into Jay, although I may be incorrect here, it appears that she is simply a visiting professor who has never held the full title.

A bit odd.

Further, the report itself is largely unsubtantiated in relation to the severity of its accusations.
 
What on earth are you talking about ? As far as I am aware I was one of the first to draw attention to the section of the report about the role of taxi drivers and firms, and to insist that we were talking about networks of criminals and a criminal subculture. The conspiraloon aspect I was referring to above is the approach to the Pakistani heritage community which insists that it consists of a complicit conspiratorial community.

m largely agreeing with you..and making the point that whether their community reported it or not would have made no difference.
 
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