articul8
Dishonest sociopath
that's a result though - the more parliamentary time gets taken up with that, the less time they have for closing fucking Remploy factories and the rest...
Reforming House of Lords
- Thread starter Mr Blob
- Start date
marty21
One on one? You're crazy.
So, what exactly are the Lib Dems getting out of this coalition then? Their cherished PR was fucked up by the referendum when they suggested something that people didn't want - a vote on pure PR might have won in a referendum - but the Tories weren't in favour of that. Now they go for Lords reform - suggesting a 15 year term! and only 80% elected - and the Tories manage to block that too as they aren't interested in Lords reform - the only thing the backbenches and rebels seem to want is a general election - convinced that they have now truly fucked the Lib Dems as an electoral force and an election will deliver a Tory victory and more juicy cabinet seats for Tories that were stolen from them by the Lib Dems
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Ooh look, it was a plan all along. OK, why were you previously opposed to this happening and saving Remploy etc?
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
a nice casket
articul8
Dishonest sociopath
opposed to what happening? When have I been either a) been in favour of the programme motion or b) opposed to saving Remploy?
marty21
One on one? You're crazy.
now that their Lords reform looks fucked - a nice little earner when they all lose their seats and become Lords
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
You would have liked this important epoch changing reform to pass and asap right?
articul8
Dishonest sociopath
No, I would have voted down the programme motion to fuck up the coalition and their parliamentary timetable.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
So why did you say 'shit' then?
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
??? Without it, they will have got almost precisely zero from being in the coalition.
claphamboy
The wheels on the bus go round and round....
They have certainly got themselves into a right pickle.
This amuses me, mildly.
This amuses me, mildly.
And at that it is something that can only appeal to political geeks and wonks
gosub
~#
Well, they won't have seats in the commons after the next election
Gmart
Well-Known Member
There seems to be a hope that watered down reforms could still be passed. There is an article about it here and here. Maybe a 50/50 elected/sortition would make it more direct and representative while still being less a threat to the primacy of the HoC.
It depends if you feel that it serves the ends to be against all efforts to improve a system which is still oppressive, or whether it is more important to finally introduce a check on power.
It depends if you feel that it serves the ends to be against all efforts to improve a system which is still oppressive, or whether it is more important to finally introduce a check on power.
The big problem with an elected Upper House is that sooner or later - and likely sooner - an elected member is going to say, "I have a mandate from my electors to do X; I was elected on this platform." Cue crisis.
Let me put forward the start of an idea:
1. The Upper House is now called the Senate, members are Senators. Senators are wholly appointed.
2. There are Senators Spiritual (widened to more than the CoE), Legal, and Military, just as now, perhaps more formalised.
3. MPs who have been members of the Privy Council, Speaker, or have served for 20+ years and have chaired a Select Committee may become members upon retirement or losing their seat in the Commons.
4. MPs and recently ex-MPs may become Senators by appointment by the Prime Minister (as at present). Note that the PM may not appoint people who are not MPs or recently ex-MPs. That should cut down on the selling of honours.
5. There should be an independent commission to appoint Senators from outside the political arena who should be leaders of their fields and are prepared to contribute. There should be a limited number of such Senators and those who make up the recommending body should be forbidden from political appointments and positions for 20 years.
6. Just as in the Roman Senate, Senators should be subject to review, and those who do not ahem Ashcroft or cannot participate should lose their positions.
7. Public disgrace ahem Archer should also result in losing one's seat.
8. ...
It's not much, but it's better than what's been presented.
Let me put forward the start of an idea:
1. The Upper House is now called the Senate, members are Senators. Senators are wholly appointed.
2. There are Senators Spiritual (widened to more than the CoE), Legal, and Military, just as now, perhaps more formalised.
3. MPs who have been members of the Privy Council, Speaker, or have served for 20+ years and have chaired a Select Committee may become members upon retirement or losing their seat in the Commons.
4. MPs and recently ex-MPs may become Senators by appointment by the Prime Minister (as at present). Note that the PM may not appoint people who are not MPs or recently ex-MPs. That should cut down on the selling of honours.
5. There should be an independent commission to appoint Senators from outside the political arena who should be leaders of their fields and are prepared to contribute. There should be a limited number of such Senators and those who make up the recommending body should be forbidden from political appointments and positions for 20 years.
6. Just as in the Roman Senate, Senators should be subject to review, and those who do not ahem Ashcroft or cannot participate should lose their positions.
7. Public disgrace ahem Archer should also result in losing one's seat.
8. ...
It's not much, but it's better than what's been presented.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
No it isnt, it's just the same as now with miniscule changes.
Either all elected or completely abolished, there is no decent half way house.
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
awr but it's such a magnificent bit of architecture... can we not repaint in a dashing ox red type colour...
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
awr but it's such a magnificent bit of architecture... can we not repaint in a dashing ox red type colour...
Hmmm, we could get a decent oxblood red if we bleed out all the mps and lords, and mix their blood with some glue and chalk.....
And that's still better than what was proposed.
hmmm Quartz posting a mad back of a fag packet saloon bar bore political idea surely not?
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
Yeah you got it.
Well, it wasn't presented as more than that and got you commenting on it.
It was more of a comment on your stupidity than any real statement on the content of your dribbling.
Keep on dreaming.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
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