Paramedics doubt Dr Kelly's 'suicide' cause

[Stobart Stopper]

http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30000-13263914,00.html
These two paramedics are shedding doubt on the conclusion by the coroner that he died from injuries to his wrist. My husband has been to many such suicides and he says that there's always lots of blood. Weird.
I still think Kelly was murdered.

 

[Pickman's model]

he was topped by the famous vampire of the area where he was killed that i can't remember.

 

[Stobart Stopper]

If the government doesn't like what the messenger is saying, or is about to say, they have them killed.

Diana, John Lennon, Dr Kelly, Marilyn Monroe, JFK.....fucking hell, I would be here allday, but I have to cook a chilli!

 

[Pickman's model]

isn't a curry rather more traditional?

 

[Loki]

Shit! This could be very damaging for the govt if their claims are taken further.

Original Observer article: Kelly death paramedics query verdict


Excerpt:

As they approached the body, Hunt went to the right of Kelly and Bartlett to the left. Hunt checked for a pulse and Bartlett shone a light into his eyes to see if there was any pupil reaction. They then put four electrodes on his chest to detect any heart activity, but there was none. Kelly was pronounced dead at 10.07am.

Both saw that the left sleeves of his jacket and shirt had been pulled up to just below the elbow and there was dried blood around his left wrist.

'There was no gaping wound... there wasn't a puddle of blood around,' said Hunt. 'There was a little bit of blood on the nettles to the left of his left arm. But there was no real blood on the body of the shirt. The only other bit of blood I saw was on his clothing. It was the size of a 50p piece above the right knee on his trousers.'

Hunt found this very strange. 'If you manage to cut a wrist and catch an artery you would get a spraying of blood, regardless of whether it's an accident... Because of the nature of an arterial cut, you get a pumping action. I would certainly expect a lot more blood on his clothing, on his shirt. If you choose to cut your wrists, you don't worry about getting blood on your clothes.

'I didn't see any blood on his right hand... If he used his right hand to cut his wrist, from an arterial wound you would expect some spray.'

Bartlett agreed: 'I remember saying to one of the policemen it didn't look like he died from that [the wrist wound] and suggesting he must have taken an overdose or something else.'

 

[Pickman's model]

that's why i suspect the vampire connection could prove interesting.

 

[Stobart Stopper]

I dress up as a vampire for Pig sometimes.

Anyway, I bet the Editor bins this thread cos he's an anti-conspiracy theoryist. It's just fear, that's all.

 

[Pickman's model]

were editor and dr kelly ever seen in the same place at the same time?

 

[Firky]

My brother's a paramedic and his response was "I don't really care what happened to shipman".

 

[Donna Ferentes]

Diana, John Lennon, Dr Kelly, Marilyn Monroe, JFK.....

I reckon that JFK killed Marilyn, Lennon killed JFK, Diana killed Lennon and Dr Kelly killed Diana. I wondered who killed Dr Kelly though? Possibly that bloke out of Pantera...

 

[sihhi]

If the government doesn't like what the messenger is saying, or is about to say, they have them killed.

John Lennon

What message would that be in 1980?
"Ho! Ho! I'm quite a rich musician"

 

[Random]

My brother's a paramedic and his response was "I don't really care what happened to shipman".

We're talking about the other dead doctor, you nana

 

[Pickman's model]

My brother's a paramedic and his response was "I don't really care what happened to shipman".

wrong thread!

 

[Stobart Stopper]

What message would that be in 1980?
"Ho! Ho! I'm quite a rich musician"

It was probably Give Peace A Chance wot did it.

http://www.mackwhite.com/lennon.html

 

[DrRingDing]

wasn't he supposed to of taken some drugs on top the wrist cutting bit anyways?

dont get me wrong it was blatantly obvious it was murder no matter what the coincident theorists here claim *eyes the editor*

 

[hegley]

wasn't supposed to of taken some drugs on top the wrist cutting bit anyways?

According to the Observer, not a fatal dose though. 'Tis an interesting, and non-hysterical article - worth a read.

 

[Wilson]

it covers that in the obs article

Then there was the issue of an overdose. If Kelly had not died by slitting his wrists, perhaps he had taken tablets to hasten his death. Hutton did reveal Kelly had swallowed several painkillers, believed to have been taken from his wife's medicine cabinet. The pathologist found three blister packets of the painkiller coproxamol in Kelly's left-hand jacket pocket.

Each of these packets would have contained 10 tablets, but there was only one left, leading to the conclusion that Kelly may have swallowed 29 pills. Could this have been enough to kill him? No. Copraxamol is typically prescribed for mild back pain and consists of two compounds: paracetamol and an opiate-type drug, dextropropoxyphene. Both can be lethal if consumed in sufficient amounts, but a detailed toxicology report on Kelly's blood revealed the presence of only one-third of the dose that normally causes death.

Dr Alexander Allan, the forensic toxicologist who examined Kelly's blood and urine, told the Hutton inquiry that although the levels he found were more than therapeutic, they were significantly lower than doses that would lead to death.

 

[Loki]

And what's this?

Dr. Michael Powers QC:
"There evidently are contradictory views that were never put to the experts who gave evidence before Lord Hutton.

“In consequence the rigours that are normally undertaken at a coroner’s inquest simply were not fulfilled.

“The real issue is whether there has been sufficience of inquiry and I don’t think there has been. The inquest is the best way of getting to the root cause of death. Lord Hutton did not take the opportunity fully to explore all the issues.”

...

In an extraordinary move, Oxford Coroner Nicholas Gardiner has ruled that there will be no resumption of an inquest into the death of top weapons inspector and whistleblower Dr. David Kelly.

More here: http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=1621 (March 04)

hmmm...

 

[Loki]

it covers that in the obs article

Then there was the issue of an overdose. If Kelly had not died by slitting his wrists, perhaps he had taken tablets to hasten his death. Hutton did reveal Kelly had swallowed several painkillers, believed to have been taken from his wife's medicine cabinet. The pathologist found three blister packets of the painkiller coproxamol in Kelly's left-hand jacket pocket.

Each of these packets would have contained 10 tablets, but there was only one left, leading to the conclusion that Kelly may have swallowed 29 pills. Could this have been enough to kill him? No. Copraxamol is typically prescribed for mild back pain and consists of two compounds: paracetamol and an opiate-type drug, dextropropoxyphene. Both can be lethal if consumed in sufficient amounts, but a detailed toxicology report on Kelly's blood revealed the presence of only one-third of the dose that normally causes death.

Dr Alexander Allan, the forensic toxicologist who examined Kelly's blood and urine, told the Hutton inquiry that although the levels he found were more than therapeutic, they were significantly lower than doses that would lead to death.

29 pills are normally nowhere near a lethal dose. 60 pills and above can be potentially life-threatening.

 

[sihhi]

It was probably Give Peace A Chance wot did it.

http://www.mackwhite.com/lennon.html

But there was no dangerous/revolutionary movement in 1980.
Medgar Evans, Dr King, Malcolm X in the 1960s are at least have plausible reasons.

 

[Numbers]

Anyway, I bet the Editor bins this thread cos he's an anti-conspiracy theoryist. It's just fear, that's all.

No, he'll bin it (hopefully) cos the thread is full of drivel.

 

[ViolentPanda]

My brother's a paramedic and his response was "I don't really care what happened to shipman".

Has he been eating the stuff in his medical kit by any chance?

 

[Idris2002]

Can I just say that if I'm ever found dead in the woods and they tell you it's suicide, don't believe them.

 

[oisleep]

..., but I have to cook a chilli!

I read that as cook a child

but the unfortunate people who have been beheaded in Iraq recently didn't seem to have much blook loss either.......

 

[Idris2002]

The next question is: If Dr. Kelly didn't die by his own hand. . . what did kill him?

 

[editor]

Anyway, I bet the Editor bins this thread cos he's an anti-conspiracy theoryist.

I'm not 'anti conspiracy'

I'm anti-found-on-some-book-flogging-fruitloop's-website-conspiracy bullshit.

And that's quite a difference.

 

[Idris2002]

Indeed it is quite a difference.

What are your views on these latest Kelly allegations? (genuine question)

 

[editor]

What are your views on these latest Kelly allegations? (genuine question)

Well, the 'allegations' aren't new: they've just been repeated.

Crucially, the family - who have obviously seen a lot more evidence than anyone here - declared themselves satisfied with the findings and that suggests that they believe it likely that Kelly would have committed suicide.

Until someone produces a fact-supported, credible alternative theory as to his death, I'm inclined to believe that his death was suicide.

How about you?

 

[Stobart Stopper]

I'm not 'anti conspiracy'

I'm anti-found-on-some-book-flogging-fruitloop's-website-conspiracy bullshit.

And that's quite a difference.

I am not a fruitloop.

 

[Idris2002]

Well, the 'allegations' aren't new: they've just been repeated.

Crucially, the family - who have obviously seen a lot more evidence than anyone here - declared themselves satisfied with the findings and that suggests that they believe it likely that Kelly would have committed suicide.

Until someone produces a fact-supported, credible alternative theory as to his death, I'm inclined to believe that his death was suicide.

How about you?

I'm inclined not to come to any conclusion either way, because not only does the official cause of death improbable, no alternative explanation has been offered.

And if it was murder (I'm saying this purely for the sake of argument, as I say I've not come to any firm conclusion) it would be entirely possible that the family had been intimidated into silence (I'm not saying they have been, I'm just that it wouldn't be improbable, if - for the sake of argument - murder was the case).