Papers, please - covid passport bollocks

[Pickman's model]

You didn't think, did you. Never mind.



Are you sure about this? Which ones?

fredonia

 

[Border Reiver]

You didn't think, did you. Never mind.



Are you sure about this? Which ones?

Vaccination for Haemophilus influenza type B is mandatory in nine Countries (Bulgaria, Croatia, Czech Republic, France, Hungary Italy, Latvia, Poland, Slovakia,) and is recommended in twenty-two Countries.14 Jun 2018

Italian Journal of Pediatrics › ...
Mandatory vaccinations in European countries, undocumented information, false news and the impact on vaccination uptake: the position of the Italian pediatric society | Italian Journal of ...

 

[Border Reiver]

fredonia

Vaccination for Haemophilus influenza type B is mandatory in nine Countries (Bulgaria, Croatia, Czech Republic, France, Hungary Italy, Latvia, Poland, Slovakia,) and is recommended in twenty-two Countries.14 Jun 2018

Italian Journal of Pediatrics › ...
Mandatory vaccinations in European countries, undocumented information, false news and the impact on vaccination uptake: the position of the Italian pediatric society | Italian Journal of ...

 

[fishfinger]

Those appear to be for children, not health workers.

 

[mojo pixy]

That's mandatory childhood vaccinations. You said:

Many other countries already mandate flu vaccines for all health staff.

So what countries have that?

 

[Border Reiver]

You didn't think, did you. Never mind.



Are you sure about this? Which ones?

17 states with hospital staff flu shot requirements

About one-third of states require hospitals to offer employees flu shots or track their vaccination statuses to help boost flu vaccination rates in healthcare settings, according to a new ranking from Kaiser Family Foundation.

www.beckershospitalreview.com

 

[fishfinger]

http://[URL='https://www.beckershos...staff-flu-shot-requirements.html[/URL[/COLOR]

]

There are exemptions for most of those.

 

[mojo pixy]

17 states with hospital staff flu shot requirements

About one-third of states require hospitals to offer employees flu shots or track their vaccination statuses to help boost flu vaccination rates in healthcare settings, according to a new ranking from Kaiser Family Foundation.

www.beckershospitalreview.com

...require hospitals to offer employees flu shots or track their vaccination statuses to help boost flu vaccination rates in healthcare settings,

Offer, not mandate. Try again?

Edit...

OK that comes across smug and sarky which i'm not feeling. For what it's worth I was happy to accept it when you said it, then I started looking and couldn't find even one country that mandates flu vaccinations for health care staff. Not one! Not Israel, not Saudi Arabia, not South Korea, not Japan, not the USA, not Canada, not NZ or Australia.

I found NY state mandated it in 2009, but then the rule became vaccination or wear a mask throughout your shifts. And I just can't find any healthcare system that does more than that, most don't even go that far.

So I don't have any axe to grind with you, I'm just interested in the relative strictness developing around covid vaccine compared to the laxity around flu vaccine. I really think it's more about optics than actual risk. With an insurance premium dressing. And as usual it's low paid workers in line for the stick, should they not accept the carrot.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Oh, this is going well.

 

[Border Reiver]

Offer, not mandate. Try again?

Illinois and Colorado only allow exemptions with a medical certificate.

Several European countries require all staff to have lnfluenza injections unless medically exempt but I cannot find the references currently. I learned this on a nursing discussion board about working in the EU. I myself was surprised at the time.

I happen not to support compulsory vaccination but it is the case that it exists.

 

[andysays]

Does the three strikes and you're out rule apply on this thread?

 

[Border Reiver]

There are exemptions for most of those.

Not for Colorado or Illinois. US Hospitals also often individually require vaccinations.

 

[Pickman's model]

Those appear to be for children, not health workers.

it's ironic that there's 'false news' on the title the twat chose. he affects to be a medico of some sort - medico MY ARSE

 

[fishfinger]

Not for Colorado or Illinois. US Hospitals also often individually require vaccinations.

Colorado allow medical exemptions and Illinois allow religious or medical exemptions.

 

[Pickman's model]

17 states with hospital staff flu shot requirements

About one-third of states require hospitals to offer employees flu shots or track their vaccination statuses to help boost flu vaccination rates in healthcare settings, according to a new ranking from Kaiser Family Foundation.

www.beckershospitalreview.com

let's just cut to the chase, even with the vast amount of information on the internet you can't back up your claim.

 

[mojo pixy]

Not for Colorado or Illinois. US Hospitals also often individually require vaccinations.

This is quite a step down from your original claim!

And it's not mandatory anywhere as far as I can find, for healthcare staff to have a flu jab; it's mandatory in some places to either have it, or mask up on shift. Which is quite different.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I really think it's more about optics than actual risk. With an insurance premium dressing. And as usual it's low paid workers in line for the stick, should they not accept the carrot.

Do you think it is unreasonable for people to expect their carers to have had the covid jab, given that most of those needing care have been ordered to shield due to covid for an entire year?

Covid isn't 'just the flu', is it? Whatever arguments there may be regarding the flu, it's not the same case. It's more than just optics imo.

 

[andysays]

let's just cut to the chase, even with the vast amount of information on the internet you can't back up your claim.

Even if they could, when talking about making vaccination against a particular virus mandatory in a particular country, it's not much of an argument to say "but some different countries make vaccination against some different virus mandatory".

 

[Pickman's model]

Do you think it is unreasonable for people to expect their carers to have had the covid jab, given that most of those needing care have been ordered to shield due to covid for an entire year?

Covid isn't 'just the flu', is it? Whatever arguments there may be regarding the flu, it's not the same case.

tbh i don't give a monkey's whether any medical personnel treating me have had the vaccine or not.

i just don't want to catch it from them

 

[Pickman's model]

Even if they could, when talking about making vaccination against a particular virus mandatory in a particular country, it's not much of an argument to say "but some different countries make vaccination against some different virus mandatory".

no indeed. but they picked their ditch and they're dying in it.

 

[Border Reiver]

let's just cut to the chase, even with the vast amount of information on the internet you can't back up your claim.

Colorado and Illinois mandate influenza vaccines for health staff.

 

[Border Reiver]

This is quite a step down from your original claim!

And it's not mandatory anywhere as far as I can find, for healthcare staff to have a flu jab; it's mandatory in some places to either have it, or mask up on shift. Which is quite different.

Colorado and Illinois.

 

[andysays]

Do you think it is unreasonable for people to expect their carers to have had the covid jab, given that most of those needing care have been ordered to shield due to covid for an entire year?

Covid isn't 'just the flu', is it? Whatever arguments there may be regarding the flu, it's not the same case. It's more than just optics imo.

This might be a bit of a tangent, but are your parents still in their own home or in a care home?

The reason I ask is because I recently discovered that my neighbour, who is a care worker going into people's own homes rather than in care homes, wasn't offered a jab as a priority but had to wait until her age cohort was offered.

If we're concerned about protecting the vulnerable, this appears to me to be potentially far more significant than whatever number of care workers are are actually refusing to be vaccinated.

 

[mojo pixy]

Do you think it is unreasonable for people to expect their carers to have had the covid jab, given that most of those needing care have been ordered to shield due to covid for an entire year?

Covid isn't 'just the flu', is it? Whatever arguments there may be regarding the flu, it's not the same case. It's more than just optics imo.

Flu isn't 'just the flu' either, it's a killer, especially of the elderly and disabled. Flu -> pneumonia -> death. Rhinovirus too -> pneumonia -> death, even a nasty cold can kill someone frail enough.

But covid is transmitted via the same means as flu or rhinovirus, and we trust staff to use PPE so as not to spread those. So why change the rules for covid? 'Because people die' is only half the answer IMO.

 

[Border Reiver]

Additionally in most countries hospitals are private organisations with the right to require vaccinations. be that is the case for people seeking employment there. As I say my information on this was from a nursing site of people working in Europe and the USA being surprised at mandated vaccination.

 

[Border Reiver]

Flu isn't 'just the flu' either, it's a killer, especially of the elderly and disabled. Flu -> pneumonia -> death. Rhinovirus too -> pneumonia -> death, even a nasty cold can kill someone frail enough.

But covid is transmitted via the same means as flu or rhinovirus, and we trust staff to use PPE so as not to spread those. So why change the rules for covid? 'Because people die' is only half the answer IMO.

The disease profile is greatly different. That is why Covid may be treated differently.

Already there is a difference in vaccination protocols.

 

[Pickman's model]

Colorado and Illinois mandate influenza vaccines for health staff.

so this is what you're reduced to.

 

[klang]

I thought Colorado and Illinois were just invented places to use in country songs without running into copyright issues? I had no idea they really existed.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Flu isn't 'just the flu' either, it's a killer, especially of the elderly and disabled. Flu -> pneumonia -> death. Rhinovirus too -> pneumonia -> death, even a nasty cold can kill someone frail enough.

But covid is transmitted via the same means as flu or rhinovirus, and we trust staff to use PPE so as not to spread those. So why change the rules for covid? 'Because people die' is only half the answer IMO.

That doesn't answer my question.

tbh given the amount of nosocomial transmission of covid during this pandemic, the use of PPE clearly hasn't been enough to halt its spread.

 

[WouldBe]

Flu isn't 'just the flu' either, it's a killer, especially of the elderly and disabled. Flu -> pneumonia -> death. Rhinovirus too -> pneumonia -> death, even a nasty cold can kill someone frail enough.

But covid is transmitted via the same means as flu or rhinovirus, and we trust staff to use PPE so as not to spread those. So why change the rules for covid? 'Because people die' is only half the answer IMO.

Because flu doesn't kill 100,000+ a year whereas covid does.