ska invita
back on the other side
Excellent bit of reporting here, too much to summarise
Niger coup
- Thread starter ska invita
- Start date
twistedAM
Left Of The Dial
Some context on how jihadists get their arms and how big an effect the regime change in Libya had on the Sahel
issafrica.org
Arms trafficking from Libya to Niger is back in business | ISS Africa
Countries in West Africa need to collaborate to stem the tide of weapons flowing through Niger.
ska invita
back on the other side
NATO's bombing/de facto regime change of Libya was such an utter disaster on so many levels, and got near zero blowback or even signs of awareness from within NATO country populations. A great example of how our own states get away with war crimes under our very noses. Makes me furious...just endless destruction, destablisation and deathSome context on how jihadists get their arms and how big an effect the regime change in Libya had on the Sahel
Arms trafficking from Libya to Niger is back in business | ISS Africa
Countries in West Africa need to collaborate to stem the tide of weapons flowing through Niger.
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
You do know there was a civil war in Libya and attempts to get rid of Gaddafi well before any of the NATO bombing? And the bombing was UNSC backed to try and prevent further civilian deaths?
Not unproblematic but the way some people seem to portray it is that was Libya was all fine until NATO intervened and that caused the chaos.
ska invita
back on the other side
this summarises my opinion on it,
If there were global justice, Nato would be in the dock | Seumas Milne
Seumas Milne: Liberia's Charles Taylor has been convicted of war crimes, so why not the western leaders who escalated Libya's killing?
including
"But while Nato's UN mandate was to protect civilians, the alliance in practice turned that mission on its head. Throwing its weight behind one side in a civil war to oust Gaddafi's regime, it became the air force for the rebel militias on the ground. So while the death toll was perhaps between 1,000 and 2,000 when Nato intervened in March, by October it was estimated by the NTC to be 30,000 – including thousands of civilians.
We can't of course know what would have happened without Nato's bombing campaign, even if there is no evidence that Gaddafi had either the intention or capability to carry out a massacre in Benghazi. But we do know that Nato provided decisive air cover for the rebels as they matched Gaddafi's forces war crime for war crime, carried out massacres of their own and indiscriminately shelled civilian areas with devastating results – such as reduced much of Sirte to rubble last October."
*i take your point LDC in the second line
twistedAM
Left Of The Dial
Hmm, the second line is a smokescreen in that if Gadaffi had been selling oil to France at discount rate and wasn't causing any strategic bother to NATO countries they would have turned a blind eye if not helped quash the rebels.this summarises my opinion on it,
If there were global justice, Nato would be in the dock | Seumas Milne
Seumas Milne: Liberia's Charles Taylor has been convicted of war crimes, so why not the western leaders who escalated Libya's killing?www.theguardian.com
including
"But while Nato's UN mandate was to protect civilians, the alliance in practice turned that mission on its head. Throwing its weight behind one side in a civil war to oust Gaddafi's regime, it became the air force for the rebel militias on the ground. So while the death toll was perhaps between 1,000 and 2,000 when Nato intervened in March, by October it was estimated by the NTC to be 30,000 – including thousands of civilians.
We can't of course know what would have happened without Nato's bombing campaign, even if there is no evidence that Gaddafi had either the intention or capability to carry out a massacre in Benghazi. But we do know that Nato provided decisive air cover for the rebels as they matched Gaddafi's forces war crime for war crime, carried out massacres of their own and indiscriminately shelled civilian areas with devastating results – such as reduced much of Sirte to rubble last October."
*i take your point LDC in the second line
I remember reading at the time that it didn't take a genius to work out the fallout on the Sahel region and once they had ousted Gadaffi they had no plan b for the region meaning high-tech armoury was on the open market for all sorts of jihadist groups that had the cash.
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
this summarises my opinion on it,
If there were global justice, Nato would be in the dock | Seumas Milne
Seumas Milne: Liberia's Charles Taylor has been convicted of war crimes, so why not the western leaders who escalated Libya's killing?
including
"But while Nato's UN mandate was to protect civilians, the alliance in practice turned that mission on its head. Throwing its weight behind one side in a civil war to oust Gaddafi's regime, it became the air force for the rebel militias on the ground. So while the death toll was perhaps between 1,000 and 2,000 when Nato intervened in March, by October it was estimated by the NTC to be 30,000 – including thousands of civilians.
We can't of course know what would have happened without Nato's bombing campaign, even if there is no evidence that Gaddafi had either the intention or capability to carry out a massacre in Benghazi. But we do know that Nato provided decisive air cover for the rebels as they matched Gaddafi's forces war crime for war crime, carried out massacres of their own and indiscriminately shelled civilian areas with devastating results – such as reduced much of Sirte to rubble last October."
*i take your point LDC in the second line
Seumas Milne though, the horrible cunt?
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
The US secretary of state, Antony Blinken, has warned against Russia’s Wagner mercenaries taking advantage of instability in coup-hit Niger, whose neighbor Mali has become a partner of Moscow, according to AFP.
In an interview with the BBC released Tuesday, Blinken doubted that Wagner – which in June staged a shadowy rebellion against president Vladimir Putin – plotted the Nigerien military’s 26 July ouster of the elected president, western ally Mohamed Bazoum.
In the interview Monday, Blinken said:
Military-run Mali has become the rare country to shift toward Russia diplomatically during the Ukraine war, in which Wagner has fought ruthlessly.
Mali and Burkina Faso, whose military leaders have also been accused of ties with Wagner, have sent envoys to Niger in solidarity with the coup leaders.
'Every single place that this group, Wagner group, has gone, death, destruction and exploitation have followed.' And this is said with a straight face by a leading member of a US administration.
In an interview with the BBC released Tuesday, Blinken doubted that Wagner – which in June staged a shadowy rebellion against president Vladimir Putin – plotted the Nigerien military’s 26 July ouster of the elected president, western ally Mohamed Bazoum.
In the interview Monday, Blinken said:
Wagner has partnered with African nations including Mali and Central African Republic, leading to wide accusations of abuses by rights groups and western governments.
Military-run Mali has become the rare country to shift toward Russia diplomatically during the Ukraine war, in which Wagner has fought ruthlessly.
Mali and Burkina Faso, whose military leaders have also been accused of ties with Wagner, have sent envoys to Niger in solidarity with the coup leaders.
'Every single place that this group, Wagner group, has gone, death, destruction and exploitation have followed.' And this is said with a straight face by a leading member of a US administration.
ska invita
back on the other side
Not fussed, it's correct
Also important:
"Almost as soon as Muammar Gaddafi seized power in a military coup in Libya in 1969, nationalising British oil operations, Britain tried to remove him. First came a planned uprising and coup in 1970-71, which was not, however, carried out.
Over a decade later, the UK offered its air bases to US warplanes conducting airstrikes on Tripoli, Libya’s capital, that targeted Gaddafi’s compound, killing a few dozen people but not him.
Britain tried again 10 years later, in 1996, when MI6 secretly funded Islamist militants to assassinate Gaddafi in the city of Sirte, an operation that again killed bystanders but not the Libyan ruler.
In 2011, Britain got him, launching a major air campaign and covert support to Islamist militants on the ground to finally overthrow the regime, with Gaddafi being killed in October of that year."
Britain’s 42 coups since 1945
The UK has planned or executed over 40 attempts to remove foreign governments in 27 countries since the end of the Second World War, involving the intelligence agencies, covert and overt military interventions and assassinations, Declassified has found.
declassifieduk.org
(Not just Britain of course, but framed that way for the article)
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ska invita
back on the other side
Relevant to the Libya and impact on Africa chat
www.middleeasteye.net
How the West's war in Libya has spurred terrorism in 14 countries
The true extent of the fall-out from the Libya war is remarkable: it has spurred terrorism in Europe, Syria, North Africa and sub-Saharan Africa
www.middleeasteye.net
teqniq
DisMembered
Yes, to repeat more or less what I said a few posts above, everybody and their dog is perfectly well aware of western, often US imperialism but it does not make what Binken says here, untrue.
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
Indeed, but I'm known on here for my whataboutery.
twistedAM
Left Of The Dial
Today's non-news but this line is interesting, "Muslim clerics from northern Nigeria, which shares a long border with Niger, had urged Nigerian President Tinubu against using force to oust the coup leaders."
Niger coup: Ecowas to deploy standby force
Ivory Coast's leader says the Ecowas bloc approved military intervention "as soon as possible".
www.bbc.co.uk
ska invita
back on the other side
ECOWAS Military overthrow of the coup far from certain:
"Despite the strong language, a number of key countries that have said they would supply forces are facing domestic political pushback over the proposed intervention, including Nigeria and Ghana.
Nigeria’s senate has expressed objections, while opposition parties in Ghana have questioned the legal basis for an intervention under the country’s constitution.
Another stumbling block is the African Union. The AU’s peace and security council met in the Ethiopian capital, Addis Ababa, on Monday for talks on the crisis in Niger. There were reports that a reportedly “difficult” meeting had rejected the proposed Ecowas intervention, with southern and northern African countries said to be “fiercely against any military intervention”, according to a diplomat who spoke to French media.
While Ecowas in theory does not require the AU’s approval, historically it has often moved in step with the AU.
The US Department of State has also indicated that it would prefer the crisis to be resolved peacefully if possible, lol"
"Despite the strong language, a number of key countries that have said they would supply forces are facing domestic political pushback over the proposed intervention, including Nigeria and Ghana.
Nigeria’s senate has expressed objections, while opposition parties in Ghana have questioned the legal basis for an intervention under the country’s constitution.
Another stumbling block is the African Union. The AU’s peace and security council met in the Ethiopian capital, Addis Ababa, on Monday for talks on the crisis in Niger. There were reports that a reportedly “difficult” meeting had rejected the proposed Ecowas intervention, with southern and northern African countries said to be “fiercely against any military intervention”, according to a diplomat who spoke to French media.
While Ecowas in theory does not require the AU’s approval, historically it has often moved in step with the AU.
The US Department of State has also indicated that it would prefer the crisis to be resolved peacefully if possible, lol"
twistedAM
Left Of The Dial
Interestingly the two countries with the best military but also non-French former colonies. This is a shitfest pretty much caused by France and hopefully the people of Senegal and Côte d'Ivoire (the main movers for Ecowas intervention) will kick them to fuck out as well.
twistedAM
Left Of The Dial
French ambassador told to leave; France say they're not going as the military do not have that authority. Yeah right, they had lots of authority in the past 
Niger junta gives French envoy 48 hours to leave
France says the coup leaders have no authority to order such an expulsion, as ties deteriorate rapidly.
www.bbc.co.uk
teqniq
DisMembered
Heh, the French are generally not having a good time over this. Algeria allegedly refused them permission to use their airspace for a military oeration though the French are denying it:
www.reuters.com
France denies report it asked Algeria to use airspace for a Niger operation
France's army on Tuesday denied it had asked Algeria to use its airspace for a military operation in Niger after an Algerian state radio report late on Monday said such permission had been refused.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
If only Niger was like France
"The problem of Nigeriens today is putschists who are putting them in danger, because they are abandoning the fight against terrorism, because they are abandoning a policy which was economically good for them, and because they are losing all the international funding that was enabling them to get out of poverty”.• “Our policy is simple: we do not recognize the putschists, we support a president who has not resigned”.• “We support the diplomatic action, and when it decides, the military of ECOWAS”. #Niger #NigerCoup #NigerCrisis"
"The problem of Nigeriens today is putschists who are putting them in danger, because they are abandoning the fight against terrorism, because they are abandoning a policy which was economically good for them, and because they are losing all the international funding that was enabling them to get out of poverty”.• “Our policy is simple: we do not recognize the putschists, we support a president who has not resigned”.• “We support the diplomatic action, and when it decides, the military of ECOWAS”. #Niger #NigerCoup #NigerCrisis"
twistedAM
Left Of The Dial
What a cunt. Now him and TotalEnergies and the other French bloodsuckers have another issue to address in Gabon. That's five former French colonies/neo-colonies under military administration.
ska invita
back on the other side
Im still not clear to what extent this coup was an anti-imperialist one, and how much of that is used as justification for a more personalised power struggle
Well at a basic level we know that the French have been benefitting from Nigerien uranium for decades - meanwhile Niger itself continues to be not just a "poor" country but one of the world's "poorest"countries.The incumbent head of State had allowed that situation to continue.Since the coup the French have faced such hostility that they have been obliged to decamp en masse.So there is that.
twistedAM
Left Of The Dial
Niger or Gabon? The latter is unclear but Niger is at least ant-French if not completely ant-imperialist (the US still has a base there and interestingly is one of the few global north nations not to call this a coup yet). Don't forget the "democratically-elected" Bazoum invited in the French army that got displaced by the Mali takeover. There also seems to be some unity between the three Sahel states with some Sankara-esque rhetoric coming out of B-F in particular.
Sadly they're all fucked whatever they try and do such is the deep entrenchment of, and corruption by, global capital in the raw commodities markets.
eatmorecheese
He's fallen out of the car again
A refreshingly candid admission that the French African empire never really went away, just kept being reframed.
Dogsauce
I’ve got Skol but I’m not a Scholar
I read somewhere the other day that there was an investigation into huge corruption in some military contract in Niger, and that those generals involved carried out the coup to avoid being held to account for it. Might be bullshit.
Democratic/decolonisation movements tend not to be lead by the military establishment of the ‘liberated’ nation, just someone else grabbing the power.
ska invita
back on the other side
Exactly. See Gabon thread as well.
As a rule fuck the military
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