Middle class anxiety

[Proper Tidy]

It's not an original observation to note the difference in tone between media reporting of consequences of austerity 2010- and reporting of consequences of leaving EU/no deal, or that lots of middle class/chattering types were happy to turn a blind eye or pay lip service to effects of austerity but have become unhinged post ref.

Obviously queues at airports no cherry tomatoes on shelves blah is cited as reason, self interest and blindness to the years preceding referendum which directly impacted on the ref outcome, but interested in whether there is more to it.

Basically, what other factors are at play in the mass outbreak of middle class anxiety and insecurity over the latter which didn't hit home with the former. Is it just self interest or more than that?

 

[Proper Tidy]

I'm basically interested to comprehend people who always prided themselves on their sensible and pragmatic politics and tough choices have to be made, political centre ground types, who managed to ride through post crash/austerity years maintaining this political sensiblism but can now be found in fancy dress and blue and yellow face paint with trot stalls or shouting at the backs of regional news presenters

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

I'm basically interested to comprehend people who always prided themselves on their sensible and pragmatic politics and tough choices have to be made, political centre ground types, who managed to ride through post crash/austerity years maintaining this political sensiblism but can now be found in fancy dress and blue and yellow face paint with trot stalls or shouting at the backs of regional news presenters

Guy in the next office to me is a solicitor and fervent Lib Dem. He's been on two anti-Brexit marches, no fancy dress or baguettes to waive for him, though. But it turns out these are the only two protests he has ever attended. Nothing that has ever happened before has inspired him to make that 45 minute train ride and be counted; poll tax, ripping up the Magna Carta with the CJB 1994, Iraq, austerity. No. Leaving a political union with some other countries in Europe was his line in the sand, what made him rise up.

I asked him why and he's concerned that he'll need to show a passport when travelling to Italy, like he currently does. And that goods entering from the EU will be subject to customs checks, as they currently are. That's his worries.

 

[Proper Tidy]

Guy in the next office to me is a solicitor and fervent Lib Dem. He's been on two anti-Brexit marches, no fancy dress or baguettes to waive for him, though. But it turns out these are the only two protests he has ever attended. Nothing that has ever happened before has inspired him to make that 45 minute train ride and be counted; poll tax, ripping up the Magna Carta with the CJB 1994, Iraq, austerity. No. Leaving a political union with some other countries in Europe was his line in the sand, what made him rise up.

I asked him why and he's concerned that he'll need to show a passport when travelling to Italy, like he currently does. And that goods entering from the EU will be subject to customs checks, as they currently are. That's his worries.

Some of it seems to be emotionally driven too, this need to be european* which takes precedence over material effects (past, current, future)

*obviously we still will be, or as much as we ever were

 

[Proper Tidy]

I'm not having a pop at people taking it seriously btw, fuck knows what it will be like at this stage, just why is this serious but everything else... not

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

Some of it seems to be emotionally driven too, this need to be european* which takes precedence over material effects (past, current, future)

*obviously we still will be, or as much as we ever were

Yeah he does seem to feel that we are 'pulling away from Europe'. Seems unable to disconnect between a political union and a physical relationship. Nice enough fella, who is also entitled to a paddy passport, so can still be 'European' if he really wants to.

 

[tommers]

I'm not having a pop at people taking it seriously btw, fuck knows what it will be like at this stage, just why is this serious but everything else... not

Because the Tories did a great job of convincing people that austerity was necessary. The fucking Labour Party abstained on the Welfare Bill cos they thought it was too damaging to oppose it. The fucking idiots.

That isn't the case with Brexit. Austerity also affected "other people" (it didnt obviously but whatever) whereas this directly affects them.

 

[Supine]

I'm not having a pop at people taking it seriously btw, fuck knows what it will be like at this stage, just why is this serious but everything else... not

Perhaps your proposition is actually wrong

 

[ska invita]

I'm basically interested to comprehend people who always prided themselves on their sensible and pragmatic politics and tough choices have to be made, political centre ground types, who managed to ride through post crash/austerity years maintaining this political sensiblism but can now be found in fancy dress and blue and yellow face paint with trot stalls or shouting at the backs of regional news presenters

This post doesnt address any of that but i can say im feeling very anxious this year --- a variety of reasons for that but UK politics is a part of it.
The tone and dominant agenda of Brexit has a role in that, namely its brought up lots of feelings of 'not belonging' that its taken me years to make peace with - they're back. That's not just a UK phenomenon of course, ethno-nationalism and its connected assorted ideologies are coming up across the world and its upsetting.

Being governed by increasingly right wing governments here in the UK year after year after year takes its mental toll too - this doesnt just have a material effect, its also seeped into the tiniest of social interactions. And the still relatively weak fightback against that political direction is deeply depressing. Were facing yet another pivotal point in the dismantling of the welfare state/deepening of neoliberalism and its making me angsty.

 

[sleaterkinney]

There's a whole other thread full of this sort of stuff.

Suffice to say there are some of us who want nothing of Boris's or Farage's plans.

 

[Proper Tidy]

Perhaps your proposition is actually wrong

What am I proposing?

 

[Proper Tidy]

This post doesnt address any of that but i can say im feeling very anxious this year --- a variety of reasons for that but UK politics is a part of it.
The tone and dominant agenda of Brexit has a role in that, namely its brought up lots of feelings of 'not belonging' that its taken me years to make peace with - they're back. That's not just a UK phenomenon of course, ethno-nationalism and its connected assorted ideologies are coming up across the world and its upsetting.

Being governed by increasingly right wing governments here in the UK year after year after year takes its mental toll too - this doesnt just have a material effect, its also seeped into the tiniest of social interactions. And the still relatively weak fightback against that political direction is deeply depressing. Facing yet another pivotal point in the dismantling of the welfare state/deepening of neoliberalism coming up and its making me angsty.

Cheers, v honest post. But your political concerns/anxiety are broader and long standing (heightened at moment, entirely reasonably), it was more to grasp the drivers behind why people politically unaffected by the radical changes of recent times are so deeply affected by this specific one, if that makes sense

 

[ska invita]

Cheers, v honest post. But your political concerns/anxiety are broader and long standing (heightened at moment, entirely reasonably), it was more to grasp the drivers behind why people politically unaffected by the radical changes of recent times are so deeply affected by this specific one, if that makes sense

selfishness?
a life time of looking the other way runs out of rail
probably that

 

[Manter]

What am I proposing?

That the other stuff didn’t matter; for lots of people it did matter too.

 

[Proper Tidy]

Suffice to say there are some of us who want nothing of Boris's or Farage's plans.

Fair enough, good stance. But why are Johnson & Farage beyond the pale when Cameron, Clegg, Blair, Thatcher weren't. Is the point of the thread.

 

[Proper Tidy]

That the other stuff didn’t matter; for lots of people it did matter too.

Of course it mattered to many.

What I am asking is why these regressive material changes didn't prompt the same response from a huge swathe of the liberal middle class that we've witnessed since 2016

 

[killer b]

They're panicking about the same things as everyone else - unnafordable housing, the rising cost of living, ecological breakdown, the rise of fascism, etc etc. None of these were such a pressing issue in 2008 (or they were, but much less visible to them).

 

[Proper Tidy]

They're panicking about the same things as everyone else - unnafordable housing, the rising cost of living, ecological breakdown, the rise of fascism, etc etc. None of these were such a pressing issue in 2008 (or they were, but much less visible to them).

Yeah I understand that, was interested in other factors at play. Maybe there aren't any.

 

[xenon]

Because Evan Davis has probably never had to sign on. But doubtless enjoys frequent trips to the continent.

 

[xenon]

Shorthand post, on phone,

 

[Pickman's model]

Fair enough, good stance. But why are Johnson & Farage beyond the pale when Cameron, Clegg, Blair, Thatcher weren't. Is the point of the thread.

because they offer platitudes and no solutions, not even for the m/c. there will never be a johnsonism the way there was thatcherism but there might be the way there was mccarthyism

 

[killer b]

There's a good piece by Danny Dorling in the latest Tribune, where he talks about how he - a senior academic at Oxford University - has no expectation of his children being able to afford to buy a house in the city they grew up in. A problem familiar to working class people from Oxford (and countless other places) for decades, but biting into the middle classes now.

(it's not really much to do with the subject of the thread, but worth a read anyway How to Solve the Housing Crisis )

 

[8ball]

Of course it mattered to many.

What I am asking is why these regressive material changes didn't prompt the same response from a huge swathe of the liberal middle class that we've witnessed since 2016

They were packing the theatre at I, Daniel Blake

 

[ska invita]

also worth saying a majority of people voting positively for all this are middle class...i presume their anxieties, if they have them, are different

 

[8ball]

also worth saying a majority of people voting positively for all this are middle class...i presume their anxieties, if they have them, are different

Stop introducing new characters!

 

[Pickman's model]

 

[sleaterkinney]

Fair enough, good stance. But why are Johnson & Farage beyond the pale when Cameron, Clegg, Blair, Thatcher weren't. Is the point of the thread.

If you look at the likes of Johnson's, Raabs, Patels plans they are even more neolib than those you mentioned, they also never used nationalism and racism like Farage does.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

I think there are two deep and long run currents within middle class phenomenology that have been forced to the surface by Brexit. They go to the very core of its collective identity, regardless of politics - and have been upturned by the referendum.

Firstly, the middle class adopts the role of the narrating class of politics and culture in Britain, on the basis of its certainty that what it thinks is influential and important and has agency. This has been their prevailing view, outside of economic matters, for 50 years, but has been confronted head on by Brexit.

Second, they widely possess a mistaken assumption that a) most working class people aspire to join them and adapt and learn their superior values and b) that there is, fundamentally, a set of shared interests between the two classes against the elite rather than two entirely separate classes with opposing interests and divergent histories. Both of these assumptions have been broken by the last three years and the response has been barely concealed resentful fury

Finally, I have heard many middle class liberals, who otherwise rate themselves as impeccably woke, freely toss around the sneers and knowling comments about the working class. Popular middle class culture is awash with implied criticisms of the working class, especially proles with a white skin. These are people who would never dream of telling a racist joke, but they think nothing of ridiculing or criticising those of lesser economic means. Every group has its ‘other.’ For a lot of middle class people it is, and always has been, the working class.

 

[8ball]

Every group has its ‘other.’ For a lot of middle class people it is, and always has been, the working class.

This isn't a dig at you or anything you've said, but I am frequently amused by how people are very proficient at spotting 'othering' in others.