Libertarians

[barney_pig]

I once went to a Militant event at the Alexander Palace where we were treated to a live link up with Esteban Volkov...aka Trotsky's grandson; and that wasn't the most surreal part of the day...a full on Militant finacial appeal was something to behold!

Cheers - louis MacNeice

for sheer embarressment julie waterson's attempt to copy the militant appeal at an SWP mayday rally has never been beaten.

 

[Quartz]

Without regulation, markets tend to cartel and monopoly. Adam freakin' Smith knew that.

It was known and exploited long before Adam Smith. One of the ways English monarchs used to raise money was the sale of (limited-time) monopolies.

 

[J Ed]

That's an utterly bog-standard left postion though - read any serious critical account of that period from a left/anarchist/etc perspective and you'll find a series of mistakes that (maybe in hindsight, but people were pointing it out at the time) made by Allende and the coalition. Not dealing with the army officer dissidents - promoting them (Pinochet to the fore amazingly) in fact being quite high amongst them. That's just mainstream left history.

Well sure but these criticisms from WSWS went a bit beyond suggesting that these were tactical mistakes, they seemed to be suggesting that Allende was right-wing and that is why he made them. There are a lot of legitimate criticisms of Allende, a lot of them are eerily similar to the mistakes made by the Spanish Second Republic, especially Allende not arming the w/c but WSWS seem to go further than all of that..

I can't find the thing I saw on reddit but this article from their website seems like it takes a similar tack https://www5.wsws.org/development/en/articles/2013/09/11/pers-s11.html?view=print

Allende was not a socialist, much less a revolutionary. His essential political role was that of holding back the socialist revolution in Chile and imposing “social peace” by suppressing the powerful offensive of the Chilean working class. This was done in close collaboration with the US-trained Chilean officer corps. Its chiefs, including General Pinochet, appointed commander-in-chief of the army by Allende, were invited into the president’s cabinet to better coordinate the suppression of the mass workers movement.

Isn't it a bit much to say that Allende wasn't a socialist?

 

[ViolentPanda]

In what unholy parallel demon dimension is Ruth Lea one of Britain's leading economists?
She may be a favourite of the CBI and right-libertarian wingnuts, but she's as much one of Britain's "leading economists" as Roger Scrotum is one of Britain's foremost philosophers - i.e. only in the most sordid of libertarian fever-dreams.

 

[butchersapron]

Well sure but these criticisms from WSWS went a bit beyond suggesting that these were tactical mistakes, they seemed to be suggesting that Allende was right-wing and that is why he made them. There are a lot of legitimate criticisms of Allende, a lot of them are eerily similar to the mistakes made by the Spanish Second Republic, especially Allende not arming the w/c but WSWS seem to go further than all of that..

I can't find the thing I saw on reddit but this article from their website seems like it takes a similar tack https://www5.wsws.org/development/en/articles/2013/09/11/pers-s11.html?view=print



Isn't it a bit much to say that Allende wasn't a socialist?

Yes, bog standard hard-trot analysis. An always seething near revolutionary w/c formed in conditions of capitals final degeneration being held back by union sell outs and weak leaders (remember "The historical crisis of mankind is reduced to the crisis of revolutionary leadership"). As for being a socialist = well they're talking about his role rather than his personal opinions i suppose. But if you think socialists don't make mistakes such as he did (socialists being the further seeing brain and memory of the class) then those who make those mistakes become non-socialists.

 

[nino_savatte]

The free market does work like most things to a certain extent but like every ism rapidly runs out of steam when facing the real world.
The best system we have worked out is a social democratic mixed economy yes its unfair has comtradictions and the theory is a bit wonky.
But regualted itself and appears to produce the best outcome for the most people.
So called marxist societys tend to tyranny

Many non-Marxist societies also tend to tyranny.

 

[nino_savatte]

Now this is my kind of Freedom Festival.
http://www.freedomfestival.co.uk/about/

 

[nino_savatte]

They're an incestuous lot.
http://thefreedomfestival.net/index.php/people/

This "Freedom Festival" is not a festival at all; it's a conference.

 

[ItWillNeverWork]

It's a certainty that anyone who barks on about 'liberty' and 'freedom' is a complete arse uninterested in either of those things if it involves extending them to me.

 

[butchersapron]

Reason is the biggest libertarian publication in the world - very influential in powerful elite circles. Here's something about it/them.

As Reason’s editor defends its racist history, here’s a copy of its holocaust denial “special issue”

After I exposed Reason’s history as a publisher of racist, pro-apartheid South Africa articles during the 1970s, the current editor-in-chief, Matt Welch, answered back in what must stand as one of the most bizarre responses imaginable.

Rather than simply doing what any sensible editor would do — apologize for the magazine’s past transgressions but reiterate that the racists articles do not represent its current editorial position — Welch instead wrote a long blog post, smearing Pando and my reporting, including describing me (apparently without irony) as an “anti-libertarian conspiracy theorist.” He also admitted that — sure! — Reason published a bunch of sick, racist pro-apartheid articles… but hey, they also published articles critical of apartheid, so what’s the big deal?

Astonishingly, in February 1976, Reason dedicated an entire “special issue” to promoting Holocaust deniers, under the guise of so-called “historical revisionism.” How horrifying is it? You can judge for yourself — the whole thing is embedded below.

PandoDaily contacted noted Holocaust historian and Holocaust Museum expert Deborah Lipstadt to ask her opinion. In 2000, Lipstadt won a much-publicized libel trial in Britain against a leading Holocaust denier, David Irving. When we shared with her the list of Reason’s “special issue” contributors and authors positively cited in the issue, Lipstadt described it as “the Who’s Who of early American Holocaust deniers.”

 

[Jeff Robinson]

Canadian libertarian icon goes on an Elliot Rodger style misogynist rant about women being the source of all evil in the world (at 3:04):



There aren't enough in the universe.

 

[Dogsauce]

The moment you hear him say 'nice guys' you know you're dealing with a complete dicksplash, not that the preamble hadn't flagged that up.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

Yeah its pure Elliot Rodgerism: 'women won't have sex me with me therefore they are the root of all evil'. He's a real oddball fuckwit. He claims that his whole 'philosophy' is based upon opposition to the 'initiation of force' yet he has produced videos supportive of the killing of Trayvon Martin and Michael Brown. Scratch a libertarian and you uncover fascist...

 

[CNT36]

“Ayn Rand has always been popular with teenagers,” we are informed. “But she is supposed to be something you grow out of, like ska music or handjobs.”

The segment notes that Rand is still popular with “a certain type of adult,” using tech billionaire Mark Cuban as an example, pointing out Cuban’s “287-foot yacht is named ‘Fountainhead,’ because sometimes having a 287-foot yacht just isn’t enough to warn people you’re a douchebag.”

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/09/...nduring-influence-of-ayn-rand-selfish-sshole/

 

[nino_savatte]

Hey! I still like ska music!

 

[Dillinger4]

 

[butchersapron]

Always been popular with 10 teenagers in the US. I remember Doug Henwood ( i think it was him on his show) talking about his time as a young and eager randist said that lots of people in his circle bought atlas shrugged, a whole lot less started it, and even fewer finished it - a handful. And that was a pro-rand circle.

 

[likesfish]

Many non-Marxist societies also tend to tyranny.

Yes but name one self declared Marxist societie that survived when people got a choice?

 

[Lurdan]

Hey! I still like ska music!

Doesn't it have different connotations in the US ? I think there was a 'ska-punk' fad amongst frat boys in the 80s/90s.

 

[nino_savatte]

Doesn't it have different connotations in the US ? I think there was a 'ska-punk' fad amongst frat boys in the 80s/90s.

Yes and US ska is shite.

 

[nino_savatte]

Yes but name one self declared Marxist societie that survived when people got a choice?

What is choice and why is it so important to neoliberals?

 

[butchersapron]

Yes and US ska is shite.

Which makes it rather annoying that clip used to represent ska was the specials.

 

[DotCommunist]

NOFX were good. Don't know if just having a trumpet in your punk tunes makes you ska though.

 

[butchersapron]

This is NOFX:



This is ska:

 

[Jeff Robinson]

As its already been noted on here, Tim Aker is now a UKIP MEP and head of the party's policy unit. I saw he said this the other day

“We’re beyond left-right, authoritarian-libertarian—those arguments are for university [common rooms],”

http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/o...-will-ukips-election-2015-manifesto-look-like

This is Tim Aker (far left) from a few years back, demonstrating his 'beyond left-right, authoritarian libertarianness'

But maybe its unfair to drag up a photo from his past. Maybe he really is beyond 'left-right' and 'authoritarian-libertarian' these days. What policies does he support? In the same article:

And the top rate (of tax)? “Abolish it,” says Aker. Above the 40p rate, there will be “no further rates,” he says. “We are for flatter, simpler and lower taxes.”

Aker says that the party is determined to reduce the deficit; the manifesto will outline substantial Whitehall cuts. “Foreign aid is an obvious target,” he says. The party is also committed to the abolition of the Climate Change Act...

“new migrants to this country will not be eligible for any welfare benefits until they have been paying tax and national insurance for five years.”

“We are prioritising people who work and pay into the pot instead of people who have made a living out of having children so that they can get more benefits and a bigger house.”

“we will have a plan to increase the strength of the border force,” an area he believes “needs to become a government priority.”

Like so many people who claim to be beyond left and right, Aker is just another rabid right-winger in denial.

 

[8ball]

What is choice and why is it so important to neoliberals?

It's not that important really, but they like to leave the option open.

 

[Quartz]

Like so many people who claim to be beyond left and right, Aker is just another rabid right-winger in denial.

You should have quoted the paragraphs above that:

“Our people want to know how we’re going to make their lives easier, simpler and how they can just get on and feel more comfortable. That’s it. It’s a blue-collar platform, but for people that want to aspire to achieve absolutely anything.

“We want to take low earners out of income tax altogether. No tax on the minimum wage,”

They're channelling Margaret Thatcher from 1979 when the Tories targeted the aspirational working class.

 

[butchersapron]

You should have quoted the paragraphs above that:



They're channelling Margaret Thatcher from 1979 when the Tories targeted the aspirational working class.

When have the tories - or any other party - not targeted the aspirational working class?

 

[nino_savatte]

Which makes it rather annoying that clip used to represent ska was the specials.

 

[likesfish]

What is choice and why is it so important to neoliberals?

Because it fucking works

Top 20 best countries to live in the world social democratic.
Making leaders accountable to the people means they deliver what the majority want or they are out of a job .
Your 5 year plan doesn't work?sorry we will try somebody's elses plan doesn't matter how great the theory was and how many dead Germans you quote it didn't deliver.

That's why people know who runs the torys and labour they get shit dome it may be done badly or maybe stupid shit but if it is they are out of a job. Nobody knows or cares who runs the swp because they will never have any power.