So they were just trying to start a war or get the US to sink their boat?
Nothing makes any sense if Iran did this because they can only lose out and there's no possible gain for them.
Others can gain, the ones tossing accusations around.
Iran
- Thread starter J.C.Decaux
- Start date
So they were just trying to start a war or get the US to sink their boat?
Nothing makes any sense if Iran did this because they can only lose out and there's no possible gain for them.
Others can gain, the ones tossing accusations around.
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
Can we just crack on to the Jooos, it's just that I'm a bit busy later on and I wouldn't want to miss it...
Israel might very well be involved, but that's the Israeli government, not Jews in general.
I'm not into idiotic racism of any sort so please feel free to fuck your assertion up your arse.
Dogsauce
I’ve got Skol but I’m not a Scholar
Why would removing a mine (if that’s what it was) be grounds for attacking a boat? Not really a hostile act.
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
how many times have you seen a bomb disposal team walk (sail) up to a munition that they are unfamiliar with, don't (can't) know how its fused, and just pick it up and wander off with it?
5?
15?
1?
none?
Drrr, the US claims they'd just attacked the ship in international waters and tried to sink it. That's easily enough to justify an attack on the boat they claim was Iranian.
The only reason not to blow them out of the water was it wasn't really an Iranian boat.
DownwardDog
Riding a Brompton with a power meter.
photos of apparently the IRG "removing" a mine that failed to detonate.
now middle eastern militaries tend to have an er "robust " to Health and Safetybut going anywhere near a weapon that's failed to go bang is a good way to end up dead let alone limpet mines aren't designed to be removed hence the name limpet mine
They used teenage Basij to clear minefields in their contretemps with Iraq. They wouldn't think twice about ordering the IRGC Quds to remove a duff limpet mine.
Forgive my ignorance here, but don't boats bob up and down on the water?
If that supposition is correct, I would image removing an armed mine would be a little difficult.
If I were trying to damage a ship, I'd fire at the mine in order to explode it, not remove the fucker
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
depending on the swell it wouldn't be physically difficult, but if its been planted by someone else it would appallingly dangerous - it might be on a timer, it might have anti-tamper settings, it might be an unreliable, ruysty old heap of shit with a mind of its own...
the idea that you would go up to something you hadn't planted and just yank the fucker off is, err... somewhat less than plausible.
The US created pictures show a fucking great big gun on the "Iranian" boat so it's hardly outside their ability to shoot at the fucker.
If it was on a faulty timer, how the hell would they know it wasn't about to go bang?
If it had anti tamper, well .. they tampered with it
Tell us - if a firework fails on bonfire night, do you walk up to it and try to get in back into the box?
Dogsauce
I’ve got Skol but I’m not a Scholar
My point was not whether it was theirs or not, but whether the act of removing it would be considered a hostile act and would allow them to be engaged by US forces (in response to the idea of ‘why didn’t the US shoot at then during the act’).
Suicide bomber disposal team?
elbows
Well-Known Member
Seeing the incidents and tensions only through the prism of US & friends prior military adventures in the region this century, and the sorts of countries we are used to the USA bombing, and the sorts of propaganda we were treated to, is a big mistake.
Countries with very real military capabilities are quite used to making threats, and Iran is one of those, when deemed neccesary. The USA fucked them on the nuclear deal, and one of their responses a couple of months ago was to threaten to make the Straight of Hormuz unavailable to shipping. They dont want that to be an entirely empty threat, so they backed it up with some action.
Again, I know that we had to sit through a load of propaganda shit in the past where there USA & friends were desperate to hype the threat that particular regimes posed, and would have loved these regimes to do something violent that could play into this narrative. But not every situation is like that, and not every violent act is intended to trigger an actual full blown war. All sorts of countries engage in acts which are very much not designed to maximise damage and casualties, but rather to send a message. If Iran is responsible for these incidents, I would file it under that category.
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
With this level of thought process I think the discussion has reached an impressive level of pointlessness.
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
And not having clearance to do so. And not being sure exactly what the boat was doing at that time. And being concerned about firing right near a tanker. And not being 100% certain of who they might be firing on. And not having the capability to do so within the needed time frame. And... And...
You really have fuck all idea about this don't you?
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LDC
On est tous des pangolins
And where's your evidence for this then? And I take it your position is the whole situation is a US created 'false flag' then?
Dogsauce
I’ve got Skol but I’m not a Scholar
Suspect that’s why Trump wants to have his war in the ME rather than somewhere like Venezuela- fuck all chance of displaced millions turning up on his border.
agricola
a genuine importer of owls
Not straight away - most of that lot will find themselves paid to go over there and become anti-regime forces, rebels or some such. Obviously when they come back they will then wreak havoc, as those who went to Libya and Syria did.
I'm no fan of the Iranian government but we all know what happens when the US starts a war to free people.
We simply can't let shit like this go without doing whatever small thing we can to expose the mess.
Reporters can do more, but it probably won't be enough
A US war with Iran looms. Don’t for one second think that it is justified | Owen Jones
The US will probably get a war, loads of civilians will die or be forced into a miserable refugee life, many will try to escape the US brought freedom by moving to the west, then the far right twats will moan about terrorists and invasions by stealth.
Will a good amount of carnage be enough to get Trump back in? sadly, probably.
As for Blair - He can go fuck himself
We simply can't let shit like this go without doing whatever small thing we can to expose the mess.
Reporters can do more, but it probably won't be enough
A US war with Iran looms. Don’t for one second think that it is justified | Owen Jones
The US will probably get a war, loads of civilians will die or be forced into a miserable refugee life, many will try to escape the US brought freedom by moving to the west, then the far right twats will moan about terrorists and invasions by stealth.
Will a good amount of carnage be enough to get Trump back in? sadly, probably.
As for Blair - He can go fuck himself
It serves the PNAC lot very well, if Iran is behind all this. Not sure what Iran would have to gain by doing this, though. And all this "evidence" coming from the US... have they forgotten the flimsy "evidence" that led to the illegal Iraq war, already?
Probably not, but the US is hoping jingoism and stupidity are more powerful than memory and common sense.
Sadly, they're probably right.
Proper Tidy
Arsed
What if it's possible to oppose wars where lots of ordinary people are brutalised and killed while also recognising the governments of said state participants are cunts who do awful things all of the time
It's possible to oppose them, but they carry on regardless
The Iranians have shot down a US drone, the Iranians saying in Iranian airspace, the Americans saying over international waters.
One lot is lying
US confirms drone was shot down by Iranian missile
One lot is lying
US confirms drone was shot down by Iranian missile
This could explain why a tanker with a stated destination of an Iranian port was bombed
China continues buying Iranian LPG despite U.S. sanctions
Given the Iranians are desperate for sales, I find it hard to accept they did it
China continues buying Iranian LPG despite U.S. sanctions
Given the Iranians are desperate for sales, I find it hard to accept they did it
DownwardDog
Riding a Brompton with a power meter.
You don't have the slightest fucking clue how these things work. The Romeo driver doesn't just get to light up an Iranian gunboat with a Hellfire just like that.
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