Immigration to the UK - do you have concerns?
- Thread starter mojo pixy
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JimW
支那暗杀团
There is a fairly recently introduced national insurance scheme that covers you for some major illnesses, and then regional ones that do a bit more. Public hospitals are also generally subsidised a bit too but access can be a bit tricky. Found some of the little rural clinics are OK for vaccinations and childhood scrapes as everyone prefers to go to the big hospitals, so equivalent of a quid for the consultation and no queue. When I worked in rural development medical debt was one of the major causes of poverty though, and it was really fraudulent, people being sent up to the provincial capital for round after round of unnecessary tests.Is there a welfare state there Jim? Is healthcare funded by taxation?
Was arguing the other day with The Man (who has three factories over there) and he thought healthcare was provided by companies. I literally said I’d ask you
Funky_monks
Neo-Rustic
If I wanted to do that, I'd look it up
Loads of people work out of doors (I used to be one of them). I've used the five day forecast to plan my work week. Are we all terrible nationalists for wanting weather data that is in any way relevant to our daily lives?
Tbh, I'd always dismissed the idea of academics and ivory towers, but it is writ large all over this thread.
PTK
Paul Kegan
Yes, but people want to work outside in Calais too. On the other hand, the farmers of Essex do not need to know the weather forecast for County Down. Why are we told one, but not the other?
Funky_monks
Neo-Rustic
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
No indeed. But it can be received in calais
Just to check, do you understand the difference between things being broadcast and things being received?
Funky_monks
Neo-Rustic
Sure, but unless you're specifically interested in the weather in the UK and you live in Calais, you aren't going to be receiving the broadcast because you won't have tuned in.
Fucking hell.... Schroedinger's weather forecast
zedr
new but not *that* new
It seems like you're reading a layer of moral judgment into all this. kabbes didn't imply anything negative about the idea of banal nationalism, its more a descriptive process which reinforces national identity. The weather forecast only showing the weather for a specific nation, on a television channel which only broadcasts in that nation surely helps to reinforce the borders of that nation.
A weather forecast showing the weather within a (say) 100 mile radius of the broadcast, broadcasting to televisions in a 100 mile radius would reinforce different borders/regions.
Funky_monks
Neo-Rustic
Oh, so my desire to have weather information relevant to my daily life has subjectified me now?
Presumably I'd be much freer getting soaked through at work through lack of accurate weather forecasting....
PTK
Paul Kegan
People living in the Republic of Ireland can receive BBC weather forecasts. So why do these forecasts not cover the Republic of Ireland?
Because it is on a different island? That might make sense meteorologically.
However, the weather forecast includes Northern Ireland, because it is part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
So, the weather forecast reinforces the idea that Northern Ireland should be part of the same state as Great Britain, and not part of the Republic of Ireland, and that the latter has nothing in common at all with Northern Ireland. Even the weather in the Republic of Ireland is unconnected to the weather in Northern Ireland, it would seem.
Had history turned out differently, Calais could have remained under the rule of an English monarch and today be part of the UK, and be featured in BBC weather forecasts.
It could be argued that, if the BBC is an institution set up in the UK with the declared aim of serving the people of the UK, then it should limit its forecasts to the places where people pay the licence fee.
Why should the UK have a state-wide broadcasting organisation? Why should there not be an organisation that covers Great Britain, the whole of Ireland, and France, for example?
Well, because then it would cover three different “nations” it may be said in reply. That the idea of a broadcasting organisation covering more than one of the present-day states seems strange is because the “nation state” seems natural to us, rather than the product of political events.
One major problem with the concept of the UK as a “nation state”, of course, is that there are large numbers of people in Northern Ireland, Wales, and Scotland who do not consider themselves to be part of that “nation”.
Because it is on a different island? That might make sense meteorologically.
However, the weather forecast includes Northern Ireland, because it is part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
So, the weather forecast reinforces the idea that Northern Ireland should be part of the same state as Great Britain, and not part of the Republic of Ireland, and that the latter has nothing in common at all with Northern Ireland. Even the weather in the Republic of Ireland is unconnected to the weather in Northern Ireland, it would seem.
Had history turned out differently, Calais could have remained under the rule of an English monarch and today be part of the UK, and be featured in BBC weather forecasts.
It could be argued that, if the BBC is an institution set up in the UK with the declared aim of serving the people of the UK, then it should limit its forecasts to the places where people pay the licence fee.
Why should the UK have a state-wide broadcasting organisation? Why should there not be an organisation that covers Great Britain, the whole of Ireland, and France, for example?
Well, because then it would cover three different “nations” it may be said in reply. That the idea of a broadcasting organisation covering more than one of the present-day states seems strange is because the “nation state” seems natural to us, rather than the product of political events.
One major problem with the concept of the UK as a “nation state”, of course, is that there are large numbers of people in Northern Ireland, Wales, and Scotland who do not consider themselves to be part of that “nation”.
maomao
普費斯
I thought you were a university lecturer. Have things got so bad in HE that there are no longer rooves?
Happy Tree
maagilises metsas
Funky_monks
Neo-Rustic
Prior to that, I was a shepherd and given that my subject is Agricultural Science, it is not unreasonable to suppose I spend quite a bit of time out of doors. Most recently studying dung beetle populations in grazing rotations....
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Quiet as a mouse.
I even bought a bought some lefty propaganda stuff from the 60s.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Not a matter primarily of guilt for me, although I do hate patriotism that leans on ideas from empire. But even the more benign forms of patriotism create in- and out-groups. I find that tiresome at whatever levels I find it tbh, right down to the idea of antagonism between South Wales and South West England that I felt a bit when I was in Bristol, which I found tiresome and not a little bit silly.
It's actually a particular form of individualism at root. You treat the individual in front of you as an individual, not as a representative of some group or other. That's not the same as being 'blind to culture' btw. A person's culture and the way in which it might differ from yours is a part of their make-up as individuals.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
That’s a good post @39thStep as, I’m well aware that I can hold all of those apparently contradictory ideas (and more) simultaneously
My take on the apparent contradiction of capital wanting immigration and yet, at the same time their political wing drip feeding the racist divide and rule is explained by the differing supply side needs of the economic base and the electoral imperative of the political superstructure.
Throughout my lifetime, and probably yours too, immigration has grown the economy but also been a go-to wedge issue for the right seeking electoral power.
Having successfully divided the working class, the broader national identity element of the “culture “ is, IMO, there to hide or subjugate class antagonism.
So, for me, the apparent contradictions are just that, apparent. Everything above is consistent with accelerating neoliberal forms of accumulation and regressive transfers of wealth.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
Sure more people would just use a smartphone to check the weather. Not you, of course, you're auld school
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Why is it always Dairylea?
Saul Goodman
It's all good, man
I don't take it, it follows me. Every time I look outside it's there... like a stalky thing.
And yet we have, even comparing our Gen X to our boomer parents, become increasingly wealthier, had a better quality of life, more further education, more travel, and a bigger middle class. So yunno it’s not all bad. Maybe the rich getting richer doesn’t matter. Maybe the only thing that matters is the reduction in absolute poverty. The rest is all to play for.That’s a good post @39thStep as, I’m well aware that I can hold all of those apparently contradictory ideas (and more) simultaneously
My take on the apparent contradiction of capital wanting immigration and yet, at the same time their political wing drip feeding the racist divide and rule is explained by the differing supply side needs of the economic base and the electoral imperative of the political superstructure.
Throughout my lifetime, and probably yours too, immigration has grown the economy but also been a go-to wedge issue for the right seeking electoral power.
Having successfully divided the working class, the broader national identity element of the “culture “ is, IMO, there to hide or subjugate class antagonism.
So, for me, the apparent contradictions are just that, apparent. Everything above is consistent with accelerating neoliberal forms of accumulation and regressive transfers of wealth.
There’s some class antagonism, but it’s pretty low level stuff- mostly taking the piss out of posh people. There’s no appetite for getting rid of the rich- that idea is alien as far as I can tell. Success certainly isn’t overtly celebrated in the UK as it is in America where complete strangers will honk and give you a thumbs up if you drive a Porsche.
But maybe not- maybe the only metric that matters is comparative wealth and inequality drives misery. Would we all be happier if everyone earnt circa 50k a year?
Serge Forward
Just enjoyin' my coffee.
John Kettley is a weatherman....
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
maomao
普費斯
The US is a huge and varied country with a grand tradition of trade unionism and socialism where three out of four of the last presidents have been elected while professing left-wing positions that would make Starmer blush (though pursuing the same neoliberal agenda natch). Currently Trump looks unlikely to be the next president. Are you sure you're not victim of your own bubble?
emanymton
A cat politely sat on the flaming gardener.
But the quality of life is decreasing for many people, and that is a result of increasing inequality.
Haha it’s a thing!
That seems utterly alien to me.
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[62]
This week the score draws are plentiful
And so is Wincey Willis.
Glad to see this discussion is finally reaching my level.
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