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'Immigration drives down wages' 'Trade Unionists against the EU constitution'

durruti02

love and rage!
those bloody union people they're all racists facists :rolleyes:

Brian Denny of TU's againstthe EU C. writes

http://www.spectrezine.org/europe/Denny5.htm

"Across Europe, it is clear that we are witnessing large movement of capital eastwards as labour heads west. This is happening in accordance to the principles of the single European market, which allow the free movement of goods, capital, services and people, regardless of the consequences. The single market is a mechanism to remove the powers of nation states to control the movement of capital and people in the pursuit of corporate profit. At the same time, it truncates all forms of democracy, including rights to fair wages, working conditions, social protection and collective bargaining by trade unions. These policies also ultimately feed the poison of racism and fascism, the last refuge of the corporate beast in crisis." etc etc
 
another ariticle about workers opposition to this from euro leftists mag

"SPECTREZINE
haunting europe... "




Fight Social Dumping

May 9, 2006 9:16 |by Doug Nicholls

highlighting the significance for unions across Europe of the fight by Swedish builders against a wage-cutting Latvian firm.
Britain, Ireland and Sweden were the only three European Union members to open their immigration doors completely to workers from new EU members when it expanded to the east last year. The Gate Gourmet and Irish Ferries disputes took place almost immediately.

At Gate Gourmet, eastern European labour was brought in to replace British workers. At Irish Ferries, Irish crews' jobs and wages were replaced by eastern Europeans on the minimum wage. There are at least 200,000 Polish workers looking for work in England and 100,000 in Ireland. Capital is flowing east and labour west, causing new problems.

In Sweden, building workers whose collective agreements give them 145 krone an hour were told that they had lost a contract to a Latvian firm which would pay its workers 35 krone an hour.

The Swedish labour movement is not prepared to let this happen and the significance of its case has been realised by the United Left/Nordic Green Left group of MEPs (GUE/NGL), which organised a solidarity conference last month.

Swedish industrial relations rely heavily on collective bargaining. Ninety per cent of workers are covered by such agreements and eighty per cent of workers are in unions. When the Latvian company Laval won a Swedish contract to rebuild a school in Vaxholm, it signed an agreement with the council that included the negotiated building workers' pay rates. However, unlike most employers in Sweden it refused to sign anything with the trade union. It then paid Latvian workers brought in to do the job much less and told them that they would be sacked if they spoke to the union.

Trade unions boycotted the site and forced it to close. They had the full support of the Latvian unions in their struggle and deployed secondary action with electricians to really hurt Laval. Meanwhile, the Employers Federation of Sweden thought that the principles involved - creating greater wage competition - were so important that it challenged the trade union in the courts. Even EU commissioner Charles McCreevy said that the union should be taken to court.

But the Swedish labour court said that the builders' union had acted legally in trying to protect collective bargaining. However, Laval has persisted. It says that the union action violates Article 12 of the European treaty on equal treatment and Article 49 on the free movement of services. It also says that the strike against it restricts the fundamental clauses of the EU about the free mobility of goods, services, labour and capital. The case has now been referred to the European Court of Justice.

The Swedish trade union centre, the LO, was once strongly in favour of the EU project. It is now saying that, if the case is lost, it will campaign for a withdrawal from the EU altogether. This is necessary simply because, if the EU backs Laval in bypassing the whole system of recognition and collective bargaining in Sweden, the country's entire nationally based structure of industrial relations will crumble and foreign and domestic companies will ride roughshod, as the EU intends.

Swedish building workers' union representative Gunnar Ericson explained that employers have been trying to discriminate against imported labour by creating a race to the bottom in wages. Dan Holke of the Swedish Trade Union Confederation clearly demonstrated that, if the EU sided with the employers in this case, it would, effectively, be saying that all national collective bargaining arrangements and rights to industrial action, as enshrined in domestic law throughout Europe, would be jeopardised.

GUE/NGL parliamentary group leader, French MEP Francis Wurtz, linked the attack in Sweden and elsewhere to the new neoliberal tidal wave that has been sweeping through Europe as the European Commission and the right-wing-dominated European Parliament sought to further liberalise markets in labour and capital. The group's vice-president Eva Britt Svensson showed how the latest reports on public services sought to keep the momentum of the slightly amended Bolkestein directive going and to open up more public services to competition.

Taking the example of pensions, I sought to demonstrate that all of the problems faced by workers throughout the continent can be rooted in the undemocratic decisions of the EU as dictated by the European Round Table of Industrialists, the lobby group that most effectively dominates the EU on behalf of the major employers.

For the EU to say that workers must work longer and harder for less in retirement and pay more into pensions in the process is one of the clearest expressions that, as in the Vaxholm building workers case, it has no plans for the long-term welfare and collectively agreed wages, deferred or otherwise, of workers.

It is time to seriously consider where the EU really is going and if its bitter pill can ever be sugared.

Doug Nicholls is secretary of Trade Unionists Against the EU Constitution (UK). The group has produced a new leaflet on the origins of the pensions crisis in the EU. For further details contact TUAEUC 301 The Argent Centre, 60 Frederick Street, Hockley, Birmingham, B1 3HS. This article first appeared in The Morning Star

See also

http://www.spectrezine.org/global/McGiffen.htm
 
so? no borders...international solidarity...free movement of labour...immigrants are welcome here!
 
durrutti02, I think it's pretty widely acknowledged on the left that the EU is a bosses club.

Take your point about immigration, though IMO it makes more sense to organise with immigrants so that employers can't treat them any worse (thereby preventing immigration from driving down wages, you know, that crazy class solidarity bit).
 
yeah immigration can push wages down, but what really pushs the wages down is the precarious position of the migrants. Arguing against immigration is counter productive in that it won't stop the depression of wages in the lowest sectors but rather adds fuel to the fire by putting immigrant workers in a more exploitative position.

If the useless bureacrats actually were looking out for workers interests they would be making links with unions in Eastern countries, and workers in this country, pushing for immigrant working rights and seeking to organise those workers.
 
In Bloom said:
durrutti02, I think it's pretty widely acknowledged on the left that the EU is a bosses club.

Take your point about immigration, though IMO it makes more sense to organise with immigrants so that employers can't treat them any worse (thereby preventing immigration from driving down wages, you know, that crazy class solidarity bit).

hi ib .. while it may be widely acknowledged on the left that teh EU Is abosses club that is teh only article i can find from a leftist talking about the detrimental effect of immigration ..

the SW on here absolutely deny immigration is a material issue to the w/c and that it is just an ideological problem created bythe state to which we need to repond ideopgically .. i.e. thru anti racism

i agree that we should organise with immigrants where neccessary .. but my q to you is ..

if your workplace bosses where plannning to replace you all with cheap labour whether immigrnat or not what do you do??? fight to stop it .. or roll over??
 
revol68 said:
yeah immigration can push wages down, but what really pushs the wages down is the precarious position of the migrants. Arguing against immigration is counter productive in that it won't stop the depression of wages in the lowest sectors but rather adds fuel to the fire by putting immigrant workers in a more exploitative position.

If the useless bureacrats actually were looking out for workers interests they would be making links with unions in Eastern countries, and workers in this country, pushing for immigrant working rights and seeking to organise those workers.

not true revol .. eastern european immigrnats are not illegal ..
 
durruti02 said:
hi ib .. while it may be widely acknowledged on the left that teh EU Is abosses club that is teh only article i can find from a leftist talking about the detrimental effect of immigration ..
This is true, there's a great deal of reluctance on the left to examine the question in any depth, IMO.

if your workplace bosses where plannning to replace you all with cheap labour whether immigrnat or not what do you do??? fight to stop it .. or roll over??
I'd fight to stop myself and my workmates from being sacked. I wouldn't fight for harsher immigration laws, as it doesn't work and only makes it more likely that those immigrants who do make it in will undercut me.
 
mattkidd12 said:
so? no borders...international solidarity...free movement of labour...immigrants are welcome here!
So, what do you say to people who now cannot get a job thanks to the artificial "buyer's market" this situation creates in favour of the employers - who can now set whatever terms and conditions they want, hire and fire at will, pay crap wages and be increadibly choosy about who they take on (the demanding-graduate-qualifications-to-be-a-refuse-collector scenario)?
 
blame the bosses.

Its interersting that in many parts of the world right now right-wing Islamist, Hindu, and Christian parties are gaining in influence by opposing womens entrance into the workplace across Africa, asia etc. Damned women are undermining mens conditions and forcing them out of a job. Exactly the same argument.
 
as you have made f all suggestions at all, simply saying mine are 'vague' is a tad cheeky really.

Starting to organise to defend our basic living conditions and rights is the answer - not blaming other workers.
 
belboid said:
Starting to organise to defend our basic living conditions and rights is the answer - not blaming other workers.
Now that's a bit better. Now we just have to tackle the tricky bit about how this can be achieved. Empty slogans just won't do the trick. Nor will crappy placards with the obligatory "freedom for palestine" tacked on the bottom.
 
arent you thinking of his famous dictum:

'when a man is tired of criticising the SWP, he is tired of life'?
 
I got tired of London, if it helps.

But, like Dr Johnson, not of cats.

gb31.jpg
 
Growing tired of criticising the SWP is impossible as, sadly, they seem to have a bottomless well of things to criticise them about.
 
As an Employer i have to say that migration from Poland etc is good news for employers.They are are generally hard working and will work for less money as well.The more immigration increases the more competitive wages and in turn prices will become.
 
In Bloom said:
This is true, there's a great deal of reluctance on the left to examine the question in any depth, IMO.


I'd fight to stop myself and my workmates from being sacked. I wouldn't fight for harsher immigration laws, as it doesn't work and only makes it more likely that those immigrants who do make it in will undercut me.


i think this is basically right .. and the sensible left on here seem to be coming to some sort of consensus on it

as i've said before the key is to stop the attraction for imigration .. to be honest at what is going on .. to campiagn to stop recruitment overseas .. unions actually getting stuck in re attacks on wages .. re popularising the idea of the closed shop ..essentially everything to helping rebuild some sort of power/defence for w/c people
 
durruti02 said:
not true revol .. eastern european immigrnats are not illegal ..


did i say they were, but they are in a more precarious position. The problems the two polish girls that lived with me had getting any sort of benefits or even getting paid by their boss.

My point was that the unions arguing for tighter immigration controls will further weaken the standing of immigrants and that the union parasites would be better of seeking to organise those workers. Globalisation is a fact of life, the Unions need to start dealing with that instead of pathetically trying to cling to the old national social democratic model.
 
revol68 said:
did i say they were, but they are in a more precarious position. The problems the two polish girls that lived with me had getting any sort of benefits or even getting paid by their boss.

My point was that the unions arguing for tighter immigration controls will further weaken the standing of immigrants and that the union parasites would be better of seeking to organise those workers. Globalisation is a fact of life, the Unions need to start dealing with that instead of pathetically trying to cling to the old national social democratic model.

globalism is not a fact of life .. it is a political phase that we oppose
labour organising is not inherently social democratic at all but the building block of any real w/c alternative
i am not arguing for tighter immigration controls but for first honesty at what is happenning and for the unions to demand that people are employed locally, sustainably and at the proper rates.
 
durruti02 said:
hi ib .. while it may be widely acknowledged on the left that teh EU Is abosses club that is teh only article i can find from a leftist talking about the detrimental effect of immigration ..

the SW on here absolutely deny immigration is a material issue to the w/c and that it is just an ideological problem created bythe state to which we need to repond ideopgically .. i.e. thru anti racism

i agree that we should organise with immigrants where neccessary .. but my q to you is ..

if your workplace bosses where plannning to replace you all with cheap labour whether immigrnat or not what do you do??? fight to stop it .. or roll over??

sp are you suggesting that undercutting-cheap-labour is the problem not immigration :p
 
lostexpectation said:
sp are you suggesting that undercutting-cheap-labour is the problem not immigration :p

of course :rolleyes: :rolleyes: .. it is and always has been, and has been stated a million times by me .. .. if you had been reading the threads you would have noticed the whole arguement is about neoliberalism/thatcherism .. in fact it is my original thread title .. the missing link though is immigration .. everyone out there sees it going on except the left who deny there is an issue

do you think neo liberalism could be doing what it is doing at the moment if it could not import cheap labour??
 
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