DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
he must have degenerated fast. Mentally I mean. on other fronts that ship had sailed some time ago
How much evidence is there of long term high level UK paedophile ring?
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butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Leicestershire police looking for legal way around this apparently.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Milord in action, Feb 2012. Have a feeling there's a convention that you can use notes in Parliament, but not read things out:
"Lord Janner of Braunstone: My Lords, in my career and personal life I have been proud to work and continue to work for both Jews and Arabs in Israel and the neighbouring countries. I have spent much time building bridges between their communities, working together on their similarities and differences, and discussing how we live and more importantly how they can live happily together. This is why I believe it is essential that we work to support Israel and Palestine to create a two-state solution in which the Jews have their state, Israel, and the Arabs have their own state, Palestine.
The role of civil society is important for the continuing encouragement, stability and reconciliation of both Israel and Palestine, but this cannot be achieved without both parties emerging together through a combination of political agreements in conjunction with mutual trust and respect throughout all levels of society. Sadly, I feel at the present moment this mutual trust and respect do not solely exist.
We cannot ignore that both Israel and Palestine have a right to exist. It is important for the Palestinian people, but Hamas is still a strong influence within the region and is not there to benefit its people. It is not the Government; it is a terrorist group that uses its own citizens as shields to hide their operations and that publicly announces the annihilation of the State of Israel. That is impossible and very sad. We must acknowledge Israel’s right to defend its own country, and, for peace, Hamas cannot have power of influence or status within Palestine. Whether you say shalom or salaam, the word is peace—the single word to which we must always return."
I'm not dismissing the way dementia can affect different people at different rates, but it's pretty obvious this is a Saunders. IN passing, he's also a self important fuck.
"Lord Janner of Braunstone: My Lords, in my career and personal life I have been proud to work and continue to work for both Jews and Arabs in Israel and the neighbouring countries. I have spent much time building bridges between their communities, working together on their similarities and differences, and discussing how we live and more importantly how they can live happily together. This is why I believe it is essential that we work to support Israel and Palestine to create a two-state solution in which the Jews have their state, Israel, and the Arabs have their own state, Palestine.
The role of civil society is important for the continuing encouragement, stability and reconciliation of both Israel and Palestine, but this cannot be achieved without both parties emerging together through a combination of political agreements in conjunction with mutual trust and respect throughout all levels of society. Sadly, I feel at the present moment this mutual trust and respect do not solely exist.
We cannot ignore that both Israel and Palestine have a right to exist. It is important for the Palestinian people, but Hamas is still a strong influence within the region and is not there to benefit its people. It is not the Government; it is a terrorist group that uses its own citizens as shields to hide their operations and that publicly announces the annihilation of the State of Israel. That is impossible and very sad. We must acknowledge Israel’s right to defend its own country, and, for peace, Hamas cannot have power of influence or status within Palestine. Whether you say shalom or salaam, the word is peace—the single word to which we must always return."
I'm not dismissing the way dementia can affect different people at different rates, but it's pretty obvious this is a Saunders. IN passing, he's also a self important fuck.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
i.e - i expect last line may prove to be important:
Force 'disappointed' by decison not to prosecute suspected child abuser
He said: “Thanks primarily to the courage of 25 victims who have made a complaint and the complete professionalism of the investigation team, we have built a case that the DPP has acknowledged is the result of a thorough investigation, evidentially sufficient and gives rise to a realistic chance of conviction.
“There is credible evidence that this man carried out some of the most serious sexual crimes imaginable over three decades against children who were highly vulnerable and the majority of whom were in care.
“I am extremely worried about the impact the decision not to prosecute him will have on those people, and more widely I am worried about the message this decision sends out to others , both past and present, who have suffered and are suffering sexual abuse.
“We are exploring what possible legal avenues there may be to challenge this decision and victims themselves have a right to review under a CPS procedure.”
Not to mention the message it sends out to us all regarding the establishment. There is quite clearly a public interest in prosecuting to prove that it's the same rule for everyone, unless of course he is compltyly mentally shot, but the quote from the police suggests they think otherwise.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Wiki mentions he was diagnosed in 2009. That's just 12 months after he completed his book, Jewish Parliamentarians.
There's the obvious point that people with alzheimers can carry on with their normal lives. However, someone with a diagnosis could carry on voting in the Mother of Parliaments for 5 years after his diagnosis, but then was deemed unfit to engage with a court process a few months later. Yeah.
Maybe Injury-Consultants-for-you should pick up on this: 'Need a diagnosis fast?'
There's the obvious point that people with alzheimers can carry on with their normal lives. However, someone with a diagnosis could carry on voting in the Mother of Parliaments for 5 years after his diagnosis, but then was deemed unfit to engage with a court process a few months later. Yeah.
Maybe Injury-Consultants-for-you should pick up on this: 'Need a diagnosis fast?'
Louis MacNeice
Autumn Journalist
Radio 4's 'The World at One', had Uri Geller on defending the CPS decision! But to be fair he does have experience in being the voice of reason when it comes to child abuse allegations against the rich and famous.
Cheers - Louis MacNeice
Cheers - Louis MacNeice
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Fucking hell! Is this like some Ancient Mariner thing he has to do?
SaskiaJayne
Rural Guerrilla
My Nan developed dementia in her late 80s. She became increasingly angry & confused, she became unable to care for herself & in the end would not get out of bed. She went into a care home & became much happier because she had people around her to talk to. She lasted about 18mnths in the care home, got taken to hospital with a urinary infection & that was it. The root of it all appeared to me to be complete loss of short term memory. If you cannot remember anything from a few seconds ago then you are not going to be able to function, you will live your life in total confusion. I can't see how anybody could fake this unless there was a complete cover up by those who normally spent time with them. So dementia is not just being 'mentally shot' it appears to me to be fairly specific, ie short term memory loss causes complete inability to function.
So Janner either has dementia, or he does not. If he does not & he is faking it then there must be collusion from his friends & relatives. In order to put him on trial then it needs to be established that he is faking it & then those around him should be nicked as well.
If he does have it & the evidence of his guilt is overwhelming then does the English legal system allow him to be put on trial if he is unable to instruct his defence council, presumably not?
So Janner either has dementia, or he does not. If he does not & he is faking it then there must be collusion from his friends & relatives. In order to put him on trial then it needs to be established that he is faking it & then those around him should be nicked as well.
If he does have it & the evidence of his guilt is overwhelming then does the English legal system allow him to be put on trial if he is unable to instruct his defence council, presumably not?
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
You could imagine a scenario where a rich public figure had so much support he could 'potter' in and out of parliament and maintain the pretence that he was still an active politico. However it's hard to see someone diagnosed in 2009 still making a minimally scripted public speech 5 years later. He was (and I think still is) the patron of various anglo-Israeli or Jewish groups.
Real issue is that he wasn't prosecuted years ago.
Real issue is that he wasn't prosecuted years ago.
That's pretty much exactly it: if you're not able to understand what's going on and to instruct counsel, then you're deemed unfit to stand trial. That's fair enough tbh, though whether Janner really is so ga-ga that he can't be tried is perhaps a different matter...
Indeed. Yet another investigation nobbled by orders from on high to back off...
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
On high are going to in investigate why on high backed off though. See you in 5 years.
Well yes, of course, which is partly why they're dragging their feet about it!
To be fair to the CPS if they had gone after Brittan and Janner and Keith Joseph previously it would/could have caused a lot of anti Semitic problems. Of course they were are guilty as fuck child abusing filth that needed decades in jail but the potential racist backlash would have caused huge issues. Unfortunately above the law whatever the police may correctly believe.
May they burn in hell.
May they burn in hell.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
They''ve not even began to drag their feet yet, they want to a lord to look at the failing once a new parliament is elected...2019 we'll find that there were failings that would not happen now.
This never ends.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
wtf are you on about. How are you even posting here still? Anti-semitic post after anti-semitic post.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
So, are you saying they shouldn't have gone after Brittan and Janner?
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
He's saying a jew conspiracy based on false claims of pogroms stopped it.
It's like a muslim mirror.
Louis MacNeice
Autumn Journalist
What links Brittan, Janner and Joseph are the allegations of child abuse not their ethnicity or religious affiliation...unless you are suggesting that their Jewishness somehow particularly enabled or encouraged the alleged abuse?
Louis MacNeice
p.s. Hadn't see BA's post...he highlights a probably more likely anti-semitic accusation.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
inshallah no doubt.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
I think he's suggesting rotherham etc that not prosecuting would be to invite anti-muslim pogroms.That these and and others were drummed up anti-muslim cases. And trying to make a messed up analogical case.
Either way, ugh.
elbows
Well-Known Member
What exactly was the October 2014 thing? Perhaps thats when he officially took leave, but I'm pretty sure most publications say he hasn't been to the Lords since police raised his home in December 2013.
I'm quite prepared to believe he is unfit to stand trial now. I am at least pleased to see the language being used today, i.e. details about missed opportunities to prosecute on at least 3 prior occasions.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
It's from his wiki, which links to this:
http://www.parliament.uk/biographies/lords/lord-janner-of-braunstone/880
Yes, I think you are right on the timings. Last report of him being 'active' in the Lords was the Feb 13 speech I mentioned. Maybe the official leave of absence thing was something he or his brief decided he'd need if he was going to claim to be too ill to face a court case. I'm not even going to be bothered with 'allegedly'.
Edit: the link shows the various boards and presidential positions he has. Can't really draw anything from his seeming refusal to resign from any of them, but it would be interesting to know whether he stopped appearing and corresponding with all and sundry.
hot air baboon
Well-Known Member
Ex-Cop 'Forced To Release Five Paedophiles'
http://www.lbc.co.uk/ex-police-officer-breaks-silence-on-cyril-smith-108099
Thursday 16 April 2015
LBC EXCLUSIVE
In an exclusive interview, the ex Met officer known as "John" broke the Official Secrets Act to tell LBC an operation into a paedophile gang in the late 1970s was shutdown after the men said they were connected to the former Liberal MP.
The operation centred around a cafe near a school in east London. Police were alerted to potential abuse by concerned parents who said men were taking young children in and out of the cafe at break time and after school.
You can hear the full, exclusive interview at 5 o'clock tonight with Iain Dale at Drive on LBC.
http://www.lbc.co.uk/ex-police-officer-breaks-silence-on-cyril-smith-108099
Thursday 16 April 2015
LBC EXCLUSIVE
In an exclusive interview, the ex Met officer known as "John" broke the Official Secrets Act to tell LBC an operation into a paedophile gang in the late 1970s was shutdown after the men said they were connected to the former Liberal MP.
The operation centred around a cafe near a school in east London. Police were alerted to potential abuse by concerned parents who said men were taking young children in and out of the cafe at break time and after school.
You can hear the full, exclusive interview at 5 o'clock tonight with Iain Dale at Drive on LBC.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
I feel I'm on slightly dodgy ground with this, people with alzheimers should be able to live life to the full. However, I do find it interesting that, according to the link h took on the Vice-Presidency of the The Jewish Leadership Council in 2010 - a year after his diagnosis.
Blagsta
Minimum cage, maximum cage
People who are very probably child abusers should get no special dispensation just because they have alzheimers
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