Hillsborough Independent Panel findings and release of documents.

[laptop]

Here is the copy that Whites sent out. (pdf)

That's odd: it appears to be a fax of a printout of a dodgy OCR scan of a paper original.

mare,,.

 

[Fedayn]

Yesterday in the Celtic end v St Johnstone

 

[Maltin]

Interesting editorial from When Saturday Comes from their June 1989 issue that has been republished on their website.

http://www.wsc.co.uk/wsc-daily/1152-september-2012/8991-post-hillsborough-disaster-editorial

 

[Voley]

Yesterday in the Celtic end v St Johnstone

Nice to see Reading and Spurs fans stand and applaud through You'll Never Walk Alone at the beginning of their match, too.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

Nice to see Reading and Spurs fans stand and applaud through You'll Never Walk Alone at the beginning of their match, too.

Didn't Man City and Stoke sing YNWA as well?

 

[cantsin]

Yesterday in the Celtic end v St Johnstone

nicely done - if I'd sprayed that banner, I'd have just managed to squeeze the '96' in all squashed up at the end / it'd look like a six yr old had done it.

 

[Mungy]

nicely done - if I'd sprayed that banner, I'd have just managed to squeeze the '96' in all squashed up at the end / it'd look like a six yr old had done it.

the trick is to start with a longer piece of paper than you need

 

[laptop]

Interesting editorial from When Saturday Comes from their June 1989 issue that has been republished on their website.

http://www.wsc.co.uk/wsc-daily/1152-september-2012/8991-post-hillsborough-disaster-editorial

Cool piece, full of well-informed cynicism. Who was working on WSC then?

The key ritual of this organised disinformation is an inquiry. “Experts” are called forth (in this instance, few people other than football fans have any relevant expertise to offer). After accusations are made and refuted, a report is produced and the cheapest and most politically expedient bits form part of a new law. The rest is made voluntary. Identification of the real culprits is lost amid desperate, scurrying attempts to avoid blame.

 

[cantsin]

the trick is to start with a longer piece of paper than you need

will remember that - having a good / kinda graff-y handwrting style like that bod had would help as well

 

[treelover]

Didn't Man City and Stoke sing YNWA as well?

I think many fans are realising, if they hadn't already, that it could have been them...

 

[killer b]

i don't know a football fan of any team who hasn't thought this for years tbh.

 

[butchersapron]

Carol Ann Duffy wrote this about the release/report:

The Cathedral bell, tolled, could never tell;
nor the Liver Birds, mute in their stone spell;
or the Mersey, though seagulls wailed, cursed, overhead,
in no language for the slandered dead…
not the raw, red throat of the Kop, keening,
or the cops’ words, censored of meaning;
not the clock, slow handclapping the coroner’s deadline,
or the memo to Thatcher, or the tabloid headline…
but fathers told of their daughters; the names of sons
on the lips of their mothers like prayers; lost ones
honoured for bitter years by orphan, cousin, wife -
not a matter of football, but of life.
Over this great city, light after long dark;
truth, the sweet silver song of the lark.

 

[killer b]

is that in her official capacity do you know?

 

[butchersapron]

Apparently not.

 

[killer b]

good stuff anyway.

 

[Favelado]

This past week I've watched a lot of old footage.

One guy who crops up frequently is Paul Middup.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/2012...dup-defended-by-police-union-100252-31850383/

He appeared in the days after Hillsborough attacking the fans quite vociferously on various TV channels and was at the heart of the smearing process.

He has declined to apologise.

 

[butchersapron]

This past week I've watched a lot of old footage.

One guy who crops up frequently is Paul Middup.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/2012...dup-defended-by-police-union-100252-31850383/

He appeared in the days after Hillsborough attacking the fans quite vociferously on various TV channels and was at the heart of the smearing process.

He has declined to apologise.

I've got some middup stuff to come back to later i think.

This:

A SENIOR South Yorkshire police chief raised the prospect of a junior officer taking the blame for the fateful decision to open Hillsborough’s Gate C, the ECHO has discovered.

Deputy Chief Constable (DCC) Peter Hayes discussed the possibility despite knowing full well the decision to open gates had been taken by the match commander Chief Supt David Duckenfield.

The possible plan is uncovered in documents contained within the damning Hillsborough Panel Report released last week.

The further people get into the documents the worse it gets.

 

[Fedayn]

This is Middup being interviewed here

 

[butchersapron]

There's a couple of very important points to bear in mind when looking at the role that individual journalists played or failed to play in the immediate aftermath, then the inquests then the long years afterwards.

Firstly, a lot of the reporting was by news reporters who were a) not part of football culture and didn't understand the way fans were treated, the way we were herded like cattle etc and b) used to talking to the police and using them as their primary source - questioning and criticising them is the fast path to getting yourself cut off from those sources.

Secondly, the football reporters at that time were on the whole, private school and university educated outsiders to football culture as well - they wrote about the supporters with barely concealed contempt ( a contempt that i imagine took was directed at the whole class those supporters mainly came from) and thought the conditions that the fans had to put up with was tough shit, their own fault - this was always particularly evident in the reporting on england away games. Since then there is a whole new generation of football writers who grew up with and came out of that football culture that the previous generation of football writers despised - they understand what happened and why (i'm talking about people like Tony Evans here).

Why would people like this dig any deeper? Why would people like this take the victims and their families questions and experiences seriously?

Evidence please?

Do you doubt these things? (i've included your bold in my original). Let's get this clear if we're going to do this.

 

[Voley]

This is Middup being interviewed here

More grim viewing. I'm glad it's recorded for posterity though.

 

[laptop]

More grim viewing. I'm glad it's recorded for posterity though.

I don't believe there's a cop called Widdup. Mounted branch? Widdy-up?

 

[Fedayn]

Goodison tonight.

 

[scifisam]

The journalists wrote it like that because they - or at least a lot of them - already thought football fans, and working-class people in general, were vile violent vermin always pissed up and out to hurt people for a laugh, and leapt on the MP's and PCs' stories as the proof for what they already knew. They'd do the same now - it's not as if the press treat the working class any better these days.

BTW, does anyone remember how the Mirror treated the tragedy?

Evidence please?

Do you also need evidence that the Pope is Catholic?

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Thanks Fed; the contrast between the dishonest self serving Widdup interview and the Goodison commemoration couldn't be much more telling.

All the best - Louis MacNeice

 

[sleaterkinney]

It's all in here, bastards

http://hillsborough.independent.gov.uk/repository/docs/SYP000046060001.pdf

 

[butchersapron]

Interesting to see that Mole, the copper who was replaced on matchday by Duckenfield was right in there trying to sell the drunk fans narrative almost a year later.

 

[sleaterkinney]

More stuff from David Conn, particularly about the Sheffield Wednesday directors and them not accepting liability

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/...eld-wednesday-manslaughter-charge?INTCMP=SRCH

 

[Favelado]

http://www.channel4.com/news/kelvin-mackenzie-doorstepped-by-channel-4-news

OH SWEET JOY

 

[Corax]

And today, we have testimony of Mark Duggan's magic vanishing firearm, which disappeared as soon as Duggan was shot, and could be found nowhere at the scene afterwards. And which the firearms cop forgot to mention the existence of in his initial statement. Well, it's only a trivial detail I guess.

So it's good to see that lessons have been learned by the police.

 

[Fedayn]

He was a cunt for doing The Word but Terry Christian has a really good blog piece here