fascist infiltration of the left

[layabout]

No. I think that "someone" should be unable to attend a fascist meeting in the first place as the BNP should be unable to organise them. The mistake you are making is in calling the BNP (or the White Nationalist Party or the National Front) a "legitimate party".

The White Nationalist Party and the National Front can't organise themselves because they are more often than not, operating outside the boundaries of the law. The white nationalist party couldn't even get their own parties name on ballot forms because even it's name is racist.

The problem is Nigel, you can't legistlate against a party from organising meetings. Also breaking the law to stop a party from holding meetings is also a pretty bad idea as well.

To make a law up to stop a party from holding meetings, the party has to have set policies which breaks the law. None of the BNPs policies actually break any laws. You can argue........"Hey but I think they have an agenda"....One could say that about any party.

 

[cockneyrebel]

Layabout when thousands of people smashed the NF on the streets of Lewisham it was a massive step forward for the anti fascist movement. Also the Le Pen demo gave the BNP a lot of negative publicity.

But as I’ve said you have to be tactical about no platform and as I also said that building a positive left alternative is the main objective…..

Fascism is intrinsically about violence and thuggery, even if at times it’s covered up and we have to expose and recognise that and the legitimacy of no platform as a principle.

In terms of what you said:

I do. I was a BNP member at the time. I cringed with embaressment when I heard Le Pen was invited over. Such confrontation only bolsters support for the BNP from people who were wavering and thinking of supporting them.

Why would you not want the BNP bolstered if you were a BNP member? How does that make sense?

PS The BNPs agenda has been exposed time and time again!

 

[danno_at_work]

The White Nationalist Party and the National Front can't organise themselves because they are more often than not, operating outside the boundaries of the law. The white nationalist party couldn't even get their own parties name on ballot forms because even it's name is racist.

The problem is Nigel, you can't legistlate against a party from organising meetings. Also breaking the law to stop a party from holding meetings is also a pretty bad idea as well.

To make a law up to stop a party from holding meetings, the party has to have set policies which breaks the law. None of the BNPs policies actually break any laws. You can argue........"Hey but I think they have an agenda"....One could say that about any party.

yeah nigel don't disrupt meetings its a pretty bad idea

 

[belboid]

Do you think someone should be physically attacked and prevented from attending a meeting held by a legitimate party because people with a different political agenda deem them to be "Nazis"?

as with nigel - they're not a 'legitimate political party'. - even if they are on the elctoral register as such. They are a semi-openly fascist party (they may not use the word, but a look at their website reveals them to be pretty classically corporate fascists. With nice ties). Just because they have achieved a degree of electoral success doesn't mean we should suddenly forget that.

 

[layabout]

Would you say the violence of the Jews fighting back against the Nazis was comparable? Or a slave using violence against a slave master? Or the working class against the oppression of the ruling classes?

Hold on a minute here. You are being pretty simplistic and very assuming about the populace of this country.

There are not enough extreme members of the BNP at present, nor will there be in the future, to successfully steer that party into a true violent facist movement on the scale of making UK nationals of various races second class citizens on a slippery slope to something comparable with Nazi Germany. As I have said, it's nothing to do with the BNP, it's got more to do with the culture that we have within this country...which even affects the asperations of the moderate BNP membership. There is no way, that party is going to be able to find the people who would want to take part in such a scheme. Imagine Herr Furher Griffin walks into Downing street and starts to set such a scheme in place. The police and the army would just shrug the shoulders and say "Yeah......whatever......good luck mate."

I keep repeating myself, but I'll say it again. You have to understand the mindset of the people that are deciding to vote or join the BNP. They just ain't interested in that kind of shit, neither is most of the country. The Nazis in Germany managed to carry out their deeds because the general populace believed in them and what they was doing was right. Yes, I'm totally aware they didn't vote for the Nazis with the knowledge of what they was going to do. My point is that this country would not stand for a repeat of that kind of thing. If Griffin ever got into power and tried to pull that stunt, or even anything remotely close, he would be laughed at.

The BNP will use violence, if they get to any significance, just as every other fascist group has in the past. Their leadership and organisers have openly been shown that they will push for this. While this may alienate some of the membership, history has shown fascist can successfully do this. And as said I don’t believe Britain is somehow qualitively different from every other country in the history of fascism, stiff upper lip or not.

It's got nothing to do with stiff upper lip. Germany was completly fucked after world war one and was looking for scapegoats with a completly different political situation. I'm sorry, but as it is, there are huge rows and internal battles in the BNP as it is between moderates and the extremists about race. The extremists are having a hard time defending their position within the BNP and NG is playing a very interesting game indeed.

I believe he's reforming, but in being very sly about it. He's using the "Sorry chaps......but if we don't reform.....we'll be legally challenged and we'll most probably lose" - He wins. He gets to reform the party without pissing off the extremists or taking the blame.

Also in terms of saying the BNP could never carry out their aim of removing all black and Asian people from the country (which isn’t hidden away but their openly stated aim!), well as said people have said many times in history that fascists would never succeed and their complacency led to disaster….

Nooooooooo. Pack it in. They are looking at just upping the incentives already put in place for voluntary repatriation. Thats not the same as raiding peoples houses and sticking them on the slow boat to China. Besides EVEN if they was looking at forceful repatriation they aint gonna get into power - non issue.

As said there is an argument about how no platform should be used, and obviously the main way to stop the BNP is to have a positive left wing alternative and by mobilising the workers movement. However using self defence against the inevitable violence of fascism is totally legitimate.

No it's completly illogical. It's like someone who believes in the Rapture saying the bible says the world is going to end..........and then pressing the big red button and then smugly saying told you so.

If there are people out there who are planning and executing violence, they are outside the law and should be locked up - end of.

History, again and again, seems to suggest otherwise…..not thuggery alone, but a strong component part of all fascist regimes and many other regimes…..

And your point is?

PS As I said: Wait a minute, if you were a BNP member at the time, why would you have not wanted, in your eyes, the left to look bad?!?!

Sorry, I made a typo on my reply. I left out the word "not".

PPS Can you quote me where I said the entire BNP membership are thugs? Nothing like putting words in peoples mouths.....

I can't. But hey.....you're the one that wants to treat them as if they all are.

 

[layabout]

Layabout when thousands of people smashed the NF on the streets of Lewisham it was a massive step forward for the anti fascist movement. Also the Le Pen demo gave the BNP a lot of negative publicity.

But as I’ve said you have to be tactical about no platform and as I also said that building a positive left alternative is the main objective…..

Fascism is intrinsically about violence and thuggery, even if at times it’s covered up and we have to expose and recognise that and the legitimacy of no platform as a principle.

In terms of what you said:



Why would you not want the BNP bolstered if you were a BNP member? How does that make sense?

PS The BNPs agenda has been exposed time and time again!

It's was possible for me to be a BNP supporter, but not be too enthusiastic about the idea of the party being asscoiated with Le Pen.

Remember I was a moderate.

The LePen visit would have given the BNP a lot of negative publicty if the left had just had a peaceful protest nearby with a load of banners quoting some of the shite Le Pen has come out with in the past. Instead what we got was a legal meeting marred by physical confrontation and violence. The problem with the people on the left or even the right that was there and who opposed the BNP, is that afterwards, they was all wanking and fingering each other off on their "good" work. Instead of spending your time fucking around and getting involved in mutal arse licking with lefties, you should be out there bothering to win the argument against those who are thinking of joining the BNP or those who are even in the BNP. You should treat them the same way as you would a potential customer.....you should be the sales man. You would be suprised what you can achieve.

 

[Streathamite]

Hold on a minute here. You are being pretty simplistic and very assuming about the populace of this country.

There are not enough extreme members of the BNP at present, nor will there be in the future, to successfully steer that party into a true violent facist movement on the scale of making UK nationals of various races second class citizens on a slippery slope to something comparable with Nazi Germany. As I have said, it's nothing to do with the BNP, it's got more to do with the culture that we have within this country...which even affects the asperations of the moderate BNP membership. There is no way, that party is going to be able to find the people who would want to take part in such a scheme. Imagine Herr Furher Griffin walks into Downing street and starts to set such a scheme in place. The police and the army would just shrug the shoulders and say "Yeah......whatever......good luck mate."

I keep repeating myself, but I'll say it again. You have to understand the mindset of the people that are deciding to vote or join the BNP. They just ain't interested in that kind of shit, neither is most of the country. The Nazis in Germany managed to carry out their deeds because the general populace believed in them and what they was doing was right. Yes, I'm totally aware they didn't vote for the Nazis with the knowledge of what they was going to do. My point is that this country would not stand for a repeat of that kind of thing. If Griffin ever got into power and tried to pull that stunt, or even anything remotely close, he would be laughed at.

hold it right there. You are making some absolutely fucking HUGE assumptions about the projected possible behaviour - at some point in the future, after an unspecified turn in historical events - of a nation of nearly 60 million people, a nation with huge diversity of region, class, ethnicity, occupation, political affiliations, age - you name it, we divide on it.
On what magical and mythical inner understanding of the minds and sensibilities of a clear majority of that population do you base those views? becauuse the only way that post could hold water is if it were based on some sort of special insight which you and only you have.
and re; the Nazis. before the Crash of '29 and the pan-European depression it caused, the NSDAP were a JOKE - minimal support, pisspoor polls performance, looked down on by Polite Society.
The depression changed all that, because the NSDAP served up a scapegoat, and a ready remedy. What makes you so very certain economic collapse could not take gthe UK down the same path?

 

[HST]

Layabout when thousands of people smashed the NF on the streets of Lewisham it was a massive step forward for the anti fascist movement. Also the Le Pen demo gave the BNP a lot of negative publicity.

But as I’ve said you have to be tactical about no platform and as I also said that building a positive left alternative is the main objective…..

Fascism is intrinsically about violence and thuggery, even if at times it’s covered up and we have to expose and recognise that and the legitimacy of no platform as a principle.

In terms of what you said:



Why would you not want the BNP bolstered if you were a BNP member? How does that make sense?

PS The BNPs agenda has been exposed time and time again!

I think the election of a tory government with a strong anti-immigrant line coupled with the destructive infighting in the NF (starring one Nick Griffin) around that time explain the NFs decline.

 

[layabout]

hold it right there. You are making some absolutely fucking HUGE assumptions about the projected possible behaviour - at some point in the future, after an unspecified turn in historical events - of a nation of nearly 60 million people, a nation with huge diversity of region, class, ethnicity, occupation, political affiliations, age - you name it, we divide on it.
On what magical and mythical inner understanding of the minds and sensibilities of a clear majority of that population do you base those views? becauuse the only way that post could hold water is if it were based on some sort of special insight which you and only you have.
and re; the Nazis. before the Crash of '29 and the pan-European depression it caused, the NSDAP were a JOKE - minimal support, pisspoor polls performance, looked down on by Polite Society.
The depression changed all that, because the NSDAP served up a scapegoat, and a ready remedy. What makes you so very certain economic collapse could not take gthe UK down the same path?

What makes you think it would?

We are living in a completly different era where the populace is quite well educated.

I'm sorry, but at the end day, your notion that in a depression the general populace of this country would approve of a Nazi or facist government is absurd. Even if you was to argue that we can't risk such a thing from happening, the risks of banning a party or the use of political violence is a far bigger threat to the national security of this country than the remote, if not impossible odds of the populace getting behind a facist government with the intent of an agenda similar to Nazi Germany.

 

[layabout]

I think the election of a tory government with a strong anti-immigrant line coupled with the destructive infighting in the NF (starring one Nick Griffin) around that time explain the NFs decline.

Good point....but the fact that a Tory who goes by the name of Micheal Howard, who has let waved in more asylum seekers than any other home secretary, explains why some Tories have defected to the BNP.

 

[Streathamite]

What makes you think it would?

We are living in a completly different era where the populace is quite well educated.

I'm sorry, but at the end day, your notion that in a depression the general populace of this country would approve of a Nazi or facist government is absurd. Even if you was to argue that we can't risk such a thing from happening, the risks of banning a party or the use of political violence is a far bigger threat to the national security of this country than the remote, if not impossible odds of the populace getting behind a facist government with the intent of an agenda similar to Nazi Germany.

woah! nice try at answering the post you wanted to answer, but no dice. Either go back and READ my post - properly - or at least take on board the following:
1) at NO point did I make ANY assumptions about the likely future political behaviour and affiliations of any part of the UK populace. I do NOT know how they would respond to another Great Depression, and nor do I know where they might stand in, say, 10 years' time. Nor, equally, what events might happen, and what the popular response would be. Nor do I really grasp the inner mental workings of why non-hardcore fash join that squalid little sect.

2. My whole point - absolutely obviously, I'd have thought - was that neither do you, and yet you are making some absolutley whopping assumptions on the motivations, behaviour, views, reactions etc of ALL - or as close to all as makes no odds - of the British public, based on godonlyknows what.
3. Equally, I did NOT say my compatriots would automatically rush into the arms of a UK Nazi party given economic disaster - I asked why YOU categorically, if implicitly, ruled such a scenario right out. My only contention is that it's possible. i.e. 'might'. different chappie to 'would'. yet YOUR words are;

remote, if not impossible odds of the populace getting behind a facist government

YOUR huge, whopping assumption. based on....nothing concrete whatsoever, AFAIK.
I repeat my question; what makes you so sure?

4. And - guess what! I did NOT advocate banning of far-right/fash parties-I'd rather have the little sods right out here, in the open, firstl7y 'cos their views look ridiculous as soon as held up to the light of sustained public debate, and seconde, because that way we can all keepan eye on them.
Now - do please READ my post again, and try again to answer it.
I'll simplify my key Q for you:
on what do you base your huge and sweeping assumptions on the likely political behaviour of the British People?

 

[Pickman's model]

BB, flim, fly, rebel PM if you want an idea of whats happening.

Manchester SWP are at the highest state of alert.

 

[flimsier]

I can't see that.

 

[Pickman's model]

Both their addresses and DS's phone number have been published in several places on the web, including indiemedia.

and what of the addresses, phone numbers and so on which the dreadful duo were able to purloin?

have all the activists whose details may have been passed on the bnp been contacted and advised of this? somehow i doubt it.

 

[layabout]

I can't see that.

Please read your PMs.

Thanks.

 

[bolshiebhoy]

Can anyone explain what in the name of bejeezus is going on with these PMs?

 

[smashthestate]

Can anyone explain what in the name of bejeezus is going on with these PMs?

yeah, me too, pls
since my (admittedly out of date) details are probably in the hands of the fash and i was probably the subject of some of this "loose talk" in pubs, i'd be interested to know wtf is going on.

 

[layabout]

I'll simplify my key Q for you:
on what do you base your huge and sweeping assumptions on the likely political behaviour of the British People?

Neither side of the argument can possibly know for sure that I do concede. However, you haven't read my posts by the looks of it either.

My original point is that any kind of physical intimidation And or banning of a party is a greater threat to the security and stability of this country than the remote possibility of them getting in AND being able to execute a plan they won't even admit to their own membership.

The fact that you don't want to see the BNP banned is irrelivant to main argument.

 

[Groucho]

and what of the addresses, phone numbers and so on which the dreadful duo were able to purloin?

have all the activists whose details may have been passed on the bnp been contacted and advised of this? somehow i doubt it.

The speculation on this thread is that these nazis may have had access to RESPECT, UAF, SWP address lists etc. However, any lists they may have had access to would have been local lists. It might suit some on this forum to speculate as to what info they may have obtained, and then to declare that nothing has been done to deal with the problem.

Fact is you don't know.

It is in the interests of the BNP to inflate the 'achievements' of these two. It is not in the interests of the left. However much some may hate the SWP, it is foolish to attempt to manipulate this to have a dig at SW members, at the risk of providing Nazis with any amunition.

The BNP have been trying hard to build the core of a mass fascist organisation. They have attempted to turn towards electoral 'respectability' as a tactic. However, they contnue to fall on their arses with members exposed as gangsters, as thugs etc. They have no charasmatic leader, few intellectuals, and have failed to make the significant electoral breakthrough they needed. Now they have apparently passed over the opportunity to maintain a couple of moles in the heart of left and anti-racist organisation to instead engage in nah nah playground politics.

Why? Perhaps because the two failed to turn up anything particularly useful? Perhaps because the BNP are having such serious internal difficulties (financial, political infighting, leadership challenges) that they needed something - anything - to give to their members that could be billed as a success.

Why some people on this thread seem to want to assist them is beyond me.

 

[smashthestate]

Groucho, of course they will have had access to the lists, ffs! do you think these two were just put in to the SWP for a laugh?

 

[Pickman's model]

The speculation on this thread is that these nazis may have had access to RESPECT, UAF, SWP address lists etc. However, any lists they may have had access to would have been local lists. It might suit some on this forum to speculate as to what info they may have obtained, and then to declare that nothing has been done to deal with the problem.

Fact is you don't know.

It is in the interests of the BNP to inflate the 'achievements' of these two. It is not in the interests of the left. However much some may hate the SWP, it is foolish to attempt to manipulate this to have a dig at SW members, at the risk of providing Nazis with any amunition.

The BNP have been trying hard to build the core of a mass fascist organisation. They have attempted to turn towards electoral 'respectability' as a tactic. However, they contnue to fall on their arses with members exposed as gangsters, as thugs etc. They have no charasmatic leader, few intellectuals, and have failed to make the significant electoral breakthrough they needed. Now they have apparently passed over the opportunity to maintain a couple of moles in the heart of left and anti-racist organisation to instead engage in nah nah playground politics.

Why? Perhaps because the two failed to turn up anything particularly useful? Perhaps because the BNP are having such serious internal difficulties (financial, political infighting, leadership challenges) that they needed something - anything - to give to their members that could be billed as a success.

Why some people on this thread seem to want to assist them is beyond me.

i would be astonished if the bnp were not right now in possession of pilfered records and petitions.

groucho, what is the point of infiltrating a group if yr not going to get information from them?

what did the swp's mate "searchlight" know about this infiltration? as paul marsh has said above, either searchlight knew and did nothing about it, or they didn't know about it, which means that major operations conducted by the bnp can easily escape their notice.

 

[Pickman's model]

Now that's toy-town politics

you couldn't be an infiltrator - could you?

nah, i don't think any fash infiltrator would be so fuckwitted as to blow their cover as to sing "no surrender" at marxism.

i hope not, anyway!

 

[Nigel Irritable]

The speculation on this thread is that these nazis may have had access to RESPECT, UAF, SWP address lists etc. However, any lists they may have had access to would have been local lists..

Well, one of them was RESPECT's regional treasurer which means he almost certainly had access to any lists of North West members/supporters/contacts. They were involved in Manchester Against Racism, UAF, RESPECT, SWP and SWSS. That means there is a strong possibility that they had access to regional lists of members/supporters/contacts held by those bodies.

What else could they have access too? What national meetings were any of them at of any of those bodies. Who did they work with in any of those bodies? Were they involved in Globalise Resistance? Were they involved in national ring rounds for any of those bodies? Were they on the Marxism organisational team?

The answer is that we don't know. None of the people who might have their home details on lists possessed by any of those groups know. The only people who should know are the SWP, although I suspect they are still trying to assemble a better picture of what exactly these people had access to.

The point is that the answers to those questions can only be assembled by the SWP and the various front groups. Those answers however are of direct concern to everyone who could be on a list these people gained access to. It is not an internal matter to the SWP or to the SWP and its fronts.

The BNP have been trying hard to build the core of a mass fascist organisation. They have attempted to turn towards electoral 'respectability' as a tactic. However, they contnue to fall on their arses with members exposed as gangsters, as thugs etc. They have no charasmatic leader, few intellectuals, and have failed to make the significant electoral breakthrough they needed..

That's a question of perspective isn't it? The BNP are currently the most electorally succesful fascist organisation Britain has seen since the war. If RESPECT had got 800,000 votes in the last election I would bet my last Rollo that people like you would be trumpeting it as the breakthrough of all breakthroughs.

Why some people on this thread seem to want to assist them is beyond me.

What really assists the BNP? Trying to learn lessons from a dismal incident or trying to downplay it?

 

[bolshiebhoy]

you couldn't be an infiltrator - could you?

ffs grow up man

 

[Groucho]

i would be astonished if the bnp were not right now in possession of pilfered records and petitions.

groucho, what is the point of infiltrating a group if yr not going to get information from them?

what did the swp's mate "searchlight" know about this infiltration? as paul marsh has said above, either searchlight knew and did nothing about it, or they didn't know about it, which means that major operations conducted by the bnp can easily escape their notice.

But as to what info. if any they may have obtained, I don't know and nor do you. Those who have an idea (the local SWP/UAF etc) will be taking action, but neither you nor I wil know the details of that either. You shouldn't base accusatory style points on speculation.

Even with the BNP infiltrated by Searchlight it is not necessarily the case they would have known. An intelligent infiltration would involve very few in the know, and would require operatives previously unknown, as appears to have been the case here. I doubt if many in Searchlight know who their infiltrators in the BNP are.

 

[bolshiebhoy]

The answer is that we don't know. None of the people who might have their home details on lists possessed by any of those groups know. The only people who should know are the SWP, although I suspect they are still trying to assemble a better picture of what exactly these people had access to.

Your last sentence is probably closest to the truth. I do agree that people outside the swp have a right to know. But do you really think there won't be a statement soon and wouldn't we rather wait a bit and let them get it right.

I have to say that when one left group gets done over by fascists like this I'd have thought there would be more of an athmosphere of solidarity from other people on the left rather than some of the snidey attacks from many of the usual suspects (not thinking of you here Nigel).

 

[Groucho]

That's a question of perspective isn't it? The BNP are currently the most electorally succesful fascist organisation Britain has seen since the war. If RESPECT had got 800,000 votes in the last election I would bet my last Rollo that people like you would be trumpeting it as the breakthrough of all breakthroughs.

What really assists the BNP? Trying to learn lessons from a dismal incident or trying to downplay it?

I am not suggesting that the BNP are not a threat. They are apparently in internal turmoil having raised their own expectations in the recent elections far beyond their achievements. Consequently the turn to 'respectability' is being questioned by an ever noisier body of hardliners. The BBC infiltration has done them considerable damage. Much of their electoral suport is not hardline. I found this myself canvassing against them in the council elections, where they lost a seat they had gained in a by-election. They have yet to turn their 800,000 votes or significant part, into a hardcore fascist base.

Nor am I suggesting that there is no issue of concern arising from recent events. But let's not get paranoid. Only recently they were saying they had no interest in the left and said they viewed us as a spent force. Now they are clinging on to the fact that two BNP supporters managed to inflitrate the left for a year as an event of some major significance. It is just as significant that they didn't keep them as moles.

 

[Nigel Irritable]

Your last sentence is probably closest to the truth. I do agree that people outside the swp have a right to know. But do you really think there won't be a statement soon and wouldn't we rather wait a bit and let them get it right.

I would pretty much go along with that. If the SWP were able to assemble all the necessary information within a day and a half and make sense of it and come to a coherent decision then they would have a rather more efficient organisation than I would give them or anyone on the left credit for. Apart from anything else, this is the middle of August and you can bet that people who worked with them in various campaigns are on their holidays etc.

I do think it is important that an initial statement - giving a statement of the facts as they are currently known and announcing that a thorough investigation is underway - should be put out as soon as possible. That goes for MAR/RESPECT etc not just the SWP. I suspect that everyone involved in anti-fascist work for instance in the North West of England is currently more than a bit worried and the SWP etc have a responsibility to left them know what is going on quickly. There is still a lot of speculation going around, nobody even knows if the two people at the centre of all this admit the allegations.

After that they should take their time and get an investigation done right, again announcing their findings when they are sure of them.

I have to say that when one left group gets done over by fascists like this I'd have thought there would be more of an athmosphere of solidarity from other people on the left rather than some of the snidey attacks from many of the usual suspects (not thinking of you here Nigel).

The confrontational nature of this board doesn't really help here - if you look back a few pages I got in a heated row with flimsier about what was in retrospect not very much. As some ex-member of the SWP said on Indymedia, this isn't just an attack on the SWP its an attack on everyone on the left. I have my criticisms of the way the SWP approaches recruitment and the political level it develops in its members but ultimately, with enough dedication, the right or the state can infiltrate any of us.

 

[Nigel Irritable]

They are apparently in internal turmoil having raised their own expectations in the recent elections far beyond their achievements.

As I understand it, the BNP were predicting a London Assembly seat and a European Parliament one and a substantial vote. RESPECT were predicting a London Assembly seat, two MEPs and at one stage a million votes.

In the end neither got anyone elected to the GLA or the European Parliament but the BNP got more than three times the vote of RESPECT.

Who exactly had massively inflated expectations here? And are you saying that RESPECT are in turmoil as a result?

You (and other SWPers) have to get out of the habit of deluding yourselves that "our" side always do well and their side always fail if you want to understant the world as it actually is rather than as you want it to be.

 

[fanciful]

but it is pretty astonishing that there has been no statement issued by the SWP or MAR or UAF or Respect or anyone explaining the extent of their infiltration. its almost as if you don't talk about it then it'll go away.
we need to know and it is the responsibility of the SWP in particular to tell us what's going on. until they do everyone should assume the worst.
btw WP and others leafleted Finnon's workplace today and we got a very good response. Unison at the MMU are on board and will be mobilising against Stoker. We're investigating the UMU at present.