England vs South Africa, 2012
- Thread starter Santino
- Start date
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
That's a somerset related thing i expect - his brother pretty much took Trego's place in our t20 side and Pete is getting a bit of revenge.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Hildreth. Jos is just still too rash and impatient.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
That said, i don't think Hildreth is going to make it. The selectors think they've identified a problem with the short ball that he can get away with at County level but not test level, and they also seem to think he scores the bulk of his runs at taunton and that he falters elsewhere (this is according to Brian Rose iirc). The first maybe true, the second hasn't been true for at least three seasons now.
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
Boucher gone to hospital with a serious eye injury, sounds nasty.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Somerset into the SA tail now - 19-2 after declaring on 312-8.
Boucher was hit from a bail flying off Hussain's broken stumps - operation already scheduled.
Boucher was hit from a bail flying off Hussain's broken stumps - operation already scheduled.
That Boucher injury sounds like a complete freak incident. I've kept wicket for years and have had the bails fly past my head on numerous occasions, really unlucky for him. I really hope its not as serious as it sounds.
Who is SA's back-up keep on the tour? I know AB De Villiers can keep but surely they'd want him to concentrate on his batting.
Edit - Looking at their squad they havent brought a second specialist keeper, so if Boucher is out of the tour it'll have to be De Villiers unless they plan to fly someone out, or perhaps there is a SA keeper already playing county cricket over here? Apart from Kieswetter obviously.
South Africa Test squad to face England: Graeme Smith (captain), Hashim Amla, Mark Boucher (wk), Marchant de Lange, AB de Villiers (vice-captain), JP Duminy, Imran Tahir, Jacques Kallis, Morne Morkel, Alviro Petersen, Robin Peterson, Vernon Philander, Jacques Rudolph, Dale Steyn, Lonwabo Tsotsobe.
Who is SA's back-up keep on the tour? I know AB De Villiers can keep but surely they'd want him to concentrate on his batting.
Edit - Looking at their squad they havent brought a second specialist keeper, so if Boucher is out of the tour it'll have to be De Villiers unless they plan to fly someone out, or perhaps there is a SA keeper already playing county cricket over here? Apart from Kieswetter obviously.
South Africa Test squad to face England: Graeme Smith (captain), Hashim Amla, Mark Boucher (wk), Marchant de Lange, AB de Villiers (vice-captain), JP Duminy, Imran Tahir, Jacques Kallis, Morne Morkel, Alviro Petersen, Robin Peterson, Vernon Philander, Jacques Rudolph, Dale Steyn, Lonwabo Tsotsobe.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
They don't have one. Cricinfo says they'll probably call up Thami Tsolekile, who was earmarked as Boucher's replacement anyway (Boucher is retiring after this tour).
Well he better get on the plane sharpish. Actually just looking at his stats on cricinfo and I can't imagine for one minute that they would throw him into the first test. A 31 with a 1st class average of 29 and all made in South Africa? This English summer will not be kind to him I suspect.
De Villiers will have to keep if this injury is as bad as it sounds.
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
Wasn't he retiring at the end of the series? Not a good way to end a career.
Indeed. Thing is even if he was wearing a helmet it might not have made any diiference as the bail could have flown through the grill.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Boucher retires. Sounds like a really nasty injury. At least it was at the end of his career, not the beginning, I suppose. But really bad luck.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
I don't know much about him, but that average might be on the way up, and if he's a good keeper, then something approaching that average in tests would be as good as Boucher did.
As for the English summer, South African conditions aren't so different from English conditions. He'll be used to playing the seaming/swinging ball.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Somerset wrestle them to the ground. Bring on the aussies.
Apparently he's played 3 tests back in that period when Boucher got kicked out because the senior players were getting to big for their boots. He seemingly didnt impress much scoring 47 at an average of just over 9. My comment about the summer was more regarding this particular summer when the ball is hooping around all over the place at the moment.
A test average for a wicket keeper is ok at 29, but not that great in this age. A first class average of 29 is not good enough (compare it to the keepers England can call on: Prior - 40.28, Kieswetter - 38.75, S. Davis - 39.09) and suggests a real lack of talent for SA in this position. I'll be amazed if De Villiers doesnt keep and probably will do for the foreseeable.
Of course this will unsettle what has been a very impressive batting line-up.
paulhackett
voiced by strother martin
He broke the SA record for dismissals in a first class cricket in his last match for SA A vs SL A.. 8 catches in an innings.. http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/565856.html
Good teams have both. And its not a case of 20-30 runs its the big centuries that can change matches. It must be De Villiers unless they genuinly think it'll badly adverse his batting.
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
Who's the batsman who would come in instead of the back up wicketkeeper if De Villiers keeps wicket?
I expect their top seven will be Smith, A Peterson, Amla, Kallis, Duminy, Rudolph and De Villers.
De Villiers was batting down at 5 anyway so I suspect he will either drop to 6 or 7. The final batting spot was always going to be between Duminy and Rudolph with Rudolph more likely because of his experience of English conditions.
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
That's a pretty impressive list of batsmen tbf.
ETA: Although Rudolph and Duminy don't actually have great averages. Both mid 30s which surprised me a bit.
ETA: Although Rudolph and Duminy don't actually have great averages. Both mid 30s which surprised me a bit.
paulhackett
voiced by strother martin
Has De Villiers kept in a Test before? I imagine it would have to affect his batting if he keeps for a long period of time, even if he drops down the order? Prepares to eat words..
He must have done, but I'm not good enough on statsguru to work out what his average is when he keeps as opposed to when he just bats. I know Alec Stewart's batting average dipped as soon as he started keeping full time and Sangakarra no longer keeps in tests because his batting is to important.
It has to have a negative affect on his batting as Boucher would have been ditched years ago otherwise, its already been said that Boucher's test average is no better then ordinary. Its a bit difficult for the SA selectors I just think they will take a look at the English attack and say we need the extra batsman. The English batting can be flakey but the bowling unit is formidable and in these conditions you'll want as much batting in your team as possible.
Of course if SA lose the first test and Rudolph, Duminy and De Villiers all fail there may be a rethink. Has it happens I've seen a lot of De Villiers's keeping and he is actually very tidy so in some ways its a nice problem to have.
paulhackett
voiced by strother martin
You're right - whilst they have Philander, Steyn, Morkel, Tahir and Kallis they'll add a batter?
Just seen a Cricinfo article saying he finds keeping more relaxing than fielding
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/current/story/572131.html and he's kept in Tests before (has a stumping).. hmmph. More, his ODI average as batsman/keeper is 80 odd versus 38 when just a batter! And he's kept to Murali etc. in T20 (he was also interviewed on the field whilst playing with the on field mike). Hmmph.
Just seen a Cricinfo article saying he finds keeping more relaxing than fielding
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/current/story/572131.html and he's kept in Tests before (has a stumping).. hmmph. More, his ODI average as batsman/keeper is 80 odd versus 38 when just a batter! And he's kept to Murali etc. in T20 (he was also interviewed on the field whilst playing with the on field mike). Hmmph.I think that stat is slightly misleading in the sense he had quite a slow start to his international career and the ramping up of his average when he started keeping was probably coincidence. I very much suspect you'd see a similar upturn in his test stats in the second part of his career even though he is not keeping.
I still think its a big ask, keeping wicket is mentally tiring because you are in the game all the time, keeping for 5 or 6 sessions is a lot different to 50 overs.
If England were given the choice I bet they'd much rather see some virtual unknown coming in at number 7 rather then De Villiers strolling out.
paulhackett
voiced by strother martin
Absolutely. He's been punishing as a batsman recently - it seems, I don't know if the stats back it up or I'm just going on the IPL.. 
I can't see England batting for 5 or 6 sessions against their attack? I see more of a Pakistan 2010 series (minus the shenanigans hopefully) of seam up, swing and low scores.. De Villiers coming in at 7 equals nightmare
I can't see England batting for 5 or 6 sessions against their attack? I see more of a Pakistan 2010 series (minus the shenanigans hopefully) of seam up, swing and low scores.. De Villiers coming in at 7 equals nightmare
