England vs Italy (Group D) Saturday 14th June 2014

[Joe Reilly]

I do have a perhaps misplaced optimism that Rooney will come good at this World Cup, but if he doesn't - I can't see him making the team for Russia in 2016

If past qualifiers are anything to go by without him the team won't be going to Russia in 2016 either.

 

[Kaka Tim]

Rooney is a good - but not great - player as a central striker or in the hole. Hes not good in the wings. But right now Stirling and sturridge are clearly better than him in either of his best positions - ergo on the bench you go wayne.

I cant really see what the argument is.

plus his response when things aren't going well is to snarl and spit and shout at his team-mates whilst becoming less and less effective. NOT the mark of a world class player.

He was great for england in 2004. Hes been mediocre ever since - that is not going to change - and now england have better options. His record means you should have him the squad - but hes not first choice.

 

[Balbi]

If past qualifiers are anything to go by without him the team won't be going to Russia in 2016 either.

Just as well, it's being held in France.

 

[Joe Reilly]

How do you think he's playing right now, Joe? Not over his entire England career, but right now.

Well, let's see even allowing for the left defensive midfield slot he occupied for 45 mins - he played a key role in the goal. And when he finally moved up
front came within a whisker of getting the equaliser. MOM if it went in.

 

[Joe Reilly]

Rooney is a good - but not great - player as a central striker or in the hole. Hes not good in the wings. But right now Stirling and sturridge are clearly better than him in either of his best positions - ergo on the bench you go wayne

Sterling in 10 games for Liverpool in Europe and 5 games for England - goals - 0.

 

[Lo Siento.]

Well, let's see even allowing for the left defensive midfield slot he occupied for 45 mins - he played a key role in the goal. And when he finally moved up
front came within a whisker of getting the equaliser. MOM if it went in.

How do you think he played during the other 94 minutes and 30 seconds?

 

[Joe Reilly]

How do you think he played during the other 94 minutes and 30 seconds?

Compared to who? Rooney is not judged by a different standard to say Johnson, Baines, Cahill, Gerrard, Henderson,Welbeck, Llanna etc

 

[Lo Siento.]

Compared to who? Rooney is not judged by a different standard to say Johnson, Baines, Cahill, Gerrard, Henderson,Welbeck, Llanna etc

The two people we're suggesting he replace.

 

[Joe Reilly]

I agree.

I'm not as down on Rooney as everyone else, I think he's a talented player who can both do a job for the team as well as creating a moment of magic. He's not a superstar, but I think people's negative reactions to him are more down to the media overplaying his talent, while playing down his willingness to do a job for the team. I actually think he's a much better team player than most so called superstars, He'll genuinely play almost anywhere that he's asked, but it so happens that he's not as effective in some of those positions. That's not his fault, or even a reason to dislike him. Ronaldo and Messi are freaks. Van Persie's a different type of player, but you don't really see him playing effectively all over the pitch, do you?

Too true. As proof of his belief in the team ethic Rooney has scored more goals and assists in the PL in the last 5 years than anyone else.

 

[Joe Reilly]

The two people we're suggesting he replace.

Swap him with Sterling and sanity is restored.

 

[Lo Siento.]

Swap him with Sterling and sanity is restored.

Not convinced it'll be any better and hasn't been in any previous tournament, but I'm not too fussed either way.

 

[Mungy]

wazza is a good player, but not as good as he was a few seasons ago. he has, as i have said, lost his edge. i blame the hair and the crippling vanity. before he started obviously worrying about his hairline he was up there with the best, perhaps not on the front benches with the very best that have ever graced a football pitch, but definitely in the same room, close to the front. he currently seems content to sit at the back with his wastrel mates flicking spitballs at the david moyes poster that was once hung up as an example of brilliance but has now become a pariah.

the argument that he is a good team player and his willingness to play out of his comfort zone is a persuasive one, though. Something to think about.

 

[sleaterkinney]

It says Rooney is England's, in terms of goals and assists (16 I think) most effective striker by a country mile. Ronaldo, Messi, Suarez, RVP all play in the positions that suit them and all deliver in a similar fashion because of that. Only the opposition would want them to play where they only got into the penalty area twice in the whole game. I bet the Italians were delighted when the saw the line-up. They're too canny to say anything yet but it will emerge sooner or later. As for Sterling, he has attractive qualities sure. But no 10 position carries specific responsibilities: score or assist/score and assist. Rooney does both. Sterling, for all the lavish praise, is yet to do either.

Rooney has never scored at a world cup full stop.

 

[Pickman's model]

Too true. As proof of his belief in the team ethic Rooney has scored more goals and assists in the PL in the last 5 years than anyone else.

source please

 

[marty21]

If past qualifiers are anything to go by without him the team won't be going to Russia in 2016 either.

he can play in the qualifiers

 

[weltweit]

Rooney has no hunger, he already has more money than he needs and I doesn't think he feel he has anything to prove, so a lacklustre performance. I don't see that he should be in the team. But I am no expert.

 

[strung out]

But I am no expert.

Correct.

 

[Joe Reilly]

Ronaldo's played very effectively in every forward position, as has Messi. If you're classing Rooney with the likes of them, then I'm afraid there's not much hope for you...

Well, how many world cup goals do the best player on the planet and the best player of all time have?

Prior to game the other night Messi had the grand total of 1.

While Ronaldo is currently all conquering with a magnificent- 2.

And while we're at it - though Ronaldo has scored an impressive 49 goals, it is from 111 games (around 20 more than Rooney). While coming into the tournament Rooney had actually scored more than Messi.

 

[Badgers]

Thursday team debate thread
http://www.urban75.net/forums/threa...thursday-19th-june-2014.324791/#post-13209729

 

[Joe Reilly]

Rooney has no hunger, he already has more money than he needs and I doesn't think he feel he has anything to prove, so a lacklustre performance. I don't see that he should be in the team. But I am no expert.

According to FIFA stats Rooney ran farther than any other player on the pitch. 11,223 metres. Ran farther in possession of the ball than any of his team mates and had the second highest number of sprints next to Leighton Baines.

Work rate apart, under Roy Hodgson Rooney is both the main scorer as well as being the go-to-man creatively with the most assists.

 

[AverageJoe]

We wont need two holding midfielders in this game, so why not rest Henderson and play this for our midfield and attack?

Gerrard

Oxlade-Chamberlain Sterling Welbeck

Rooney Sturridge

4-1-3-2 with two strikers, Rooney in his best position, and three fast attacking players that can either overlap or defend as neccessary. Provides cover, width and depth.

Uruguay need to win by at least two because of their goal difference, so there will be gaps at the back to exploit.

 

[Joe Reilly]

According to FIFA stats Rooney ran farther than any other player on the pitch. 11,223 metres. Ran farther in possession of the ball than any of his team mates and had the second highest number of sprints next to Leighton Baines.

Under Roy Hodgson Rooney is both the main scorer as well as being the go to man creatively with the most assists.

We wont need two holding midfielders in this game, so why not rest Henderson and play this for our midfield and attack?

Gerrard

Oxlade-Chamberlain Sterling Welbeck

Rooney Sturridge

4-1-3-2 with two strikers, Rooney in his best position, and three fast attacking players that can either overlap or defend as neccessary. Provides cover, width and depth.

Uruguay need to win by at least two because of their goal difference, so there will be gaps at the back to exploit.

The defence as a whole is pretty weak; not just Baines and johnson. England need more not less cover for Cahill and Jagielka. Gerrard needs to be closer to them. With Henderson doing the running and shutting down. So it will stay the same. Only change will likely be in terms where the same personnel play. Welbeck probably moving left, Rooney centre, and Sterling on right. Personally I would prefer Sterling on left because from there Welbeck drifts inside and drags defenders into the space Rooney already occupies.