Donald Trump's 2nd term

[planetgeli]

Rebecca Solnick in ‘The Guardian’ pretty much nails it:

”We didn’t need this debate. Because 2024 is not like previous election years, and the reasons it’s not are both that each candidate has had plenty of time to show us who they are and because one of them is a criminal seeking to destroy democracy and human rights along with the climate, the economy and international alliances. If you are too young to remember 2017-2021, this would not help you figure that out.”

David Smith summed things up better.

The first US presidential debate in Atlanta on Thursday was the night that Democrats went from “Don’t panic!” to “OK, time to panic!” After months of preparation and expectation, they got to the altar and suddenly realised they were marrying the wrong man.

In 90 miserable minutes, Joe Biden achieved two things that had seemed impossible. He lived down to expectations that were already rock bottom. And he managed to make Donald Trump sound almost coherent. Trump did not win the debate but Biden certainly lost it.

Democrats had been lulled into a false sense of security by Biden’s high energy performance at the State of the Union address. They expected Superman again. Instead they got Clark Kent in his dotage.

 

[Spymaster]

I'd call Buttigieg (sp?) but the USA is unlikely to elect a gay man.

At the moment Americans have a choice between a racist sex-case and a genuinely senile old fart. If it stays like this the sex-case is going to win.

Buttigieg can't make things any worse for the Dems.

 

[Rimbaud]

certainly not a gay man with 'butt' in his name.

it's over for Biden. they need someone else but presumably far too late and would be easy for Reps to attack a new person. oh well, Trump it is.

I don't know what the rules are exactly but there is still basically 6 months. That is ample time.

Surely it is possible to change candidate?

 

[planetgeli]

I don't know what the rules are exactly but there is still basically 6 months. That is ample time.

Surely it is possible to change candidate?

It is not easy, there are rules. And the last time it was done was 1972 (Thomas Eagleton, VP candidate) and it took the publication of confidential papers on his mental health treatment.

 

[Rimbaud]

It is not easy, there are rules. And the last time it was done was 1972 (Thomas Eagleton, VP candidate) and it took the publication of confidential papers on his mental health treatment.

What if Biden chooses to resign? He can't be forced to stand against his will surely?

 

[Silas Loom]

Oh, if Biden accepts that his time is up, everything is fine.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

It is not easy, there are rules. And the last time it was done was 1972 (Thomas Eagleton, VP candidate) and it took the publication of confidential papers on his mental health treatment.

On the radio, they were reporting that senior Democrats are right now flicking through the rulebook, which basically nobody has ever read. Realistically, they're not going to publicly contest Biden as the candidate. It's a case of persuading him to stand down. Sounds like this is now very likely to happen.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

What if Biden chooses to resign? He can't be forced to stand against his will surely?

He doesn't have to resign. He can just step aside as the candidate and retire after the election. Nobody is forced to stand for the election.

I guess the big question for the Dems is 'who replaces him?'

 

[The39thStep]

Rebecca Solnick in ‘The Guardian’ pretty much nails it:

”We didn’t need this debate. Because 2024 is not like previous election years, and the reasons it’s not are both that each candidate has had plenty of time to show us who they are and because one of them is a criminal seeking to destroy democracy and human rights along with the climate, the economy and international alliances. If you are too young to remember 2017-2021, this would not help you figure that out.”

Certainly nails the Guardian's wishful thinking whilst it fumbles about for its post Biden position

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Listening to this, it highlights the US's political culture of deference towards its leaders. It appears people are scared of telling Biden to go. Compare and contrast with the queue of loyal ministers lining up to tell Thatcher to do one.

 

[The39thStep]

It is not easy, there are rules. And the last time it was done was 1972 (Thomas Eagleton, VP candidate) and it took the publication of confidential papers on his mental health treatment.

Rules are flexible as are doctors opinions. Stick or twist , either way its damage limitation or they take the Guardian's advice and scrap any future Presidential debates. The VP is a liability as well.

 

[PursuedByBears]

"Boot-edge-edge"

That's just as silly

 

[phildwyer]

It's been obvious for years that Biden is senile. The man is incapable of coherent speech much less running the USA. For me the interesting question is why they haven't replaced him already. I reckon they'll have to before the election, this is just ridiculous.

 

[Spymaster]

I guess the big question for the Dems is 'who replaces him?'

I'd have thought they'd be queuing-up to stand against Trump. It's a fast track to the presidency. All they have to do is show up and not be a complete cunt.

 

[phildwyer]

I guess the big question for the Dems is 'who replaces him?'

Yep. Problem is, it obviously can't be Kamala because she is crap. But not picking Kamala will look like an insult against racial minorities and women, who are the only people likely to vote for the Democrats. So I think they are totally screwed.

 

[Spymaster]

It's been obvious for years that Biden is senile. The man is incapable of coherent speech much less running the USA. For me the interesting question is why they haven't replaced him already. I reckon they'll have to before the election, this is just ridiculous.

Phil old chap! Good to see you back.

No internet in jail?

 

[phildwyer]

I'd have thought they'd be queuing-up to stand against Trump. It's a fast track to the presidency. All they have to do is show up and not be a complete cunt.

Nah, people like Trump. They like him not for any redeeming qualities he has, but because the people persecuting him are such wankers. It will take a lot to beat him now, quite possibly a fraud.

 

[phildwyer]

Phil old chap! Good to see you back.

No internet in jail?

Hiya mate. I've been to Venice, I have. Reality there was much too nice to bother with the internet.

 

[chandlerp]

Nah, people like Trump. They like him not for any redeeming qualities he has, but because the people persecuting him are such wankers. It will take a lot to beat him now, quite possibly a fraud.

Wow.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

It's been obvious for years that Biden is senile. The man is incapable of coherent speech much less running the USA. For me the interesting question is why they haven't replaced him already. I reckon they'll have to before the election, this is just ridiculous.

If they were going to go for Harris, imo a wise thing to do would have been to have her step up maybe a year out, allowing Biden a dignified excuse to step aside and giving her some time (but not too much) to demonstrate presidentiality.

I can't stand her. A careerist who is prepared to send people to jail for long stretches just to further her interests. But she can't be that bad, surely. Female, black and relatively young. I think Trump would have trouble dealing with that combination in anyone half-competent.

 

[phildwyer]

Biden’s high energy performance at the State of the Union address.

"High energy" my ass. They practically had to carry him onto the stage. He was pretty much dead then, last night was just rigor mortis setting in.

 

[phildwyer]

If they were going to go for Harris, imo a wise thing to do would have been to have her step up maybe a year out, allowing Biden a dignified excuse to step aside and giving her some time (but not too much) to demonstrate presidentiality.

I can't stand her. A careerist who is prepared to send people to jail for long stretches just to further her interests. But she can't be that bad, surely. Female, black and relatively young. I think Trump would have trouble dealing with that combination in anyone half-competent.

I haven't met a single American who considers Kamala anything but an over-promoted, repellent horror. We're not stupid, after all. I reckon the only plausible replacement is the dreaded 3G: Governor Gavin Gruesome.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I haven't met a single American who considers Kamala anything but an over-promoted, repellent horror. We're not stupid, after all. I reckon the only plausible replacement is the dreaded 3G: Governor Gavin Gruesome.

Why, specifically? It can't be because she is a grasping careerist. They all are.

 

[phildwyer]

Or, Biden is rebooted for the next debate.

If you mean "pumped full of amphetamine" they already tried that.

 

[Yossarian]

One problem for Harris is that she already ran for president and polled very badly, she was in sixth place by the time she dropped out in late 2019, though none of the top three ended up winning the nomination

 

[phildwyer]

Why, specifically? It can't be because she is a grasping careerist. They all are.

I think people find her personally repellent, to a degree that exceeds even the pitiable standards of American politicians. No doubt racism and sexism play their role, but she really IS personally repellent, so it's hard to argue.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

One problem for Harris is that she already ran for president and polled very badly, she was in sixth place by the time she dropped out in late 2019, though none of the top three ended up winning the nomination

View attachment 431004

But that reflects the fact that she was a relative unknown at the time as much as anything. Looking at that list, I don't recognise the other two in the bottom three at all - or number 3, for that matter.

She doesn't have that problem now.

 

[Rob Ray]

Buttigieg would seem the most likely, they can't realistically replace him with another person in their 70s (Warren) 80s (Sanders, also won't get the centrist vote) and the rest aren't even close. Harris is deeply unpopular.

A lot of US lefties who've been warning Biden won't cut it must be very annoyed rn.

 

[Yossarian]

But that reflects the fact that she was a relative unknown at the time as much as anything. Looking at that list, I don't recognise the other two in the bottom three at all - or number 3, for that matter.

She doesn't have that problem now.

She'd been campaigning for almost a year at that point and had taken part in five debates - as a US senator from the country's most populous state, I think she had a higher profile than candidates including Buttigieg, who was mayor of South Bend, Indiana at the time

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Don't necessarily see the problem with replacing him with another older person. It's not his age that's the problem per se. It's the fact that, to put it politely, he's not as sharp as he used to be.