Coronavirus - worldwide breaking news, discussion, stats, updates and more

[Saul Goodman]

Jesus. Would it make you feel better if that was true in some way?

Not even remotely.

 

[elbows]

Obviously there are major differences between countries in terms of both their testing policies and their reporting, but Germany is developing into an interesting outlier potentially. If figures are correct (and the initial figures are being revised, I've noticed), they've now reported a massive number of recoveries such that the massive rise in current cases may be levelling out, perhaps, while the reported deaths remain relatively tiny.

The stats are puzzling at the moment. Germany may not be hurtling towards Italy-style disaster, but S Korea-style containment.

Am I right in saying that Germany and S Korea have done far more tests than other places? It appears the Germans may have learned the lessons quicker than others, and that the message should be test test test.

I'm not reading that into the numbers from Germany at this time. I can see why they are of interest, but its still just too soon for me. Clearly some of the differences in numbers are down to a different testing regime, but I'm still expecting to see number of deaths increasingly heading in the wrong direction there. Still, their total numbers could end up quite different eventually, especially if they got closer to keeping things within the limits of their hospital/temporary hospital capacity, and yet more effect if they do a great job of limiting spread within institutions. But its not even possible for me to make claims about Germany in those areas yet, they might just be a bit further behind in their epidemic.

 

[little_legs]

Breakdown by country

 

[little_legs]

Breakdown by cities/regions

 

[elbows]

They need to be very careful. Following Trump ‘s lie about chloroquine being approved by the FDA a few days ago people have become terribly ill. It’s very easy to overdose on chloroquine.

Nigeria Has Chloroquine Poisonings After Trump Praised Drug

Nigeria reported two cases of chloroquine poisoning after U.S. President Donald Trump praised the anti-malaria drug as a treatment for the novel coronavirus.

www.bloomberg.com

Nigerians poisoned after taking doses of drug praised by Trump

Its safety and effectiveness is unproven for use against the coronavirus

www.theglobeandmail.com

Especially if you use a version intended for treating fish.

Coronavirus: Man dies taking fish tank cleaner as virus drug

Health officials are warning people not to self-medicate with the common malaria drug.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Yossarian]

It does seem very tinfoil hatty but those numbers from China just don't add up. One of the most densely populated places on the planet, and the virus suddenly decided to stop... I think not. Far more likely that the Chinese Government decided that that's the official stance.

China does seem to have done a very good job at containing the outbreak, and it had the state apparatus to do so - at one point, there were reportedly 18,000 people working on contact tracing in Wuhan alone.

But telling the truth and protecting the lives of those it considers undesirable aren't exactly the regime's strong points so it's right to be skeptical of any official figures from China - I wouldn't be surprised if it eventually emerged that the outbreak had killed more people in the labour camps of Xinjiang than in the rest of China put together.

 

[maomao]

I dunno about the science stuff but while china has a massive population it's also a massive place, it's population density is well below UK

Masses of uninhabitable or sparsely inhabited desert though. Hubei is higher density than UK (305 to 274 people per square km) and it's only the twelfth most densely poplated province/municipality in China. Tibet is huge and has less then two and a half people per square km.

 

[cupid_stunt]

try building temporary hospitals here without planning permission first and no health and safety regulations. the chinese bussed in workers from all over china who worked through the night. never gonna happen in the west.

There's different ways of doing things, they are converting the Excel Centre in London into the Nightingale Hospital, and will have 500 beds available 'within days', and plans to extend to 4,000 beds if required.

And, of course, they are taking over private hospital, that's an 8,000 extra beds nationwide.

 

[xes]

It does seem very tinfoil hatty but those numbers from China just don't add up. One of the most densely populated places on the planet, and the virus suddenly decided to stop... I think not. Far more likely that the Chinese Government decided that that's the official stance.

It does seem very tin hatty, but you can look at the numbers on the mobile networks for yourself. Could be anyone who took pictures or videos pretty sure they were getting arrested and having their phones taken of them. Muslims that are being rounded up and taken into camps, the deaths or a combination. But look at the mobile networks' data, there has never been such a drastic drop in users. Over the 3 main networks.

Do I think there's millions dead? Maybe 1, 2 maybe not. Definitely more than a few hundred thousand.

 

[bimble]

The situation in India right now is so frightening, not the virus the measures to stop it. After decree of 3 week lockdown last night, huge crowds jostling to buy what food they could before midnight yesterday. Mind just can’t take in the consequences of it. Vague assurances from the gov that there will somehow be rations to feed everyone who can’t work.

 

[weltweit]

Breakdown by country

Hmm, Italy have had more than double the deaths than China have had in total.

 

[weltweit]

I think the numbers from China are iffy at best. Just from the amount of time the cremation furnaces were running. The videos from January and the response, do not match the numbers.

The WHO sent a team to China to investigate this and other issues and they declared that they trusted Chinese numbers.

 

[weltweit]

try building temporary hospitals here without planning permission first and no health and safety regulations. the chinese bussed in workers from all over china who worked through the night. never gonna happen in the west.

We have relaxed delivery regulations at supermarkets and relaxed driver hours to enable more deliveries.
I expect we have done the same to enable more PPE distribution to hospitals.
We have involved the army to establish a field hospital at a London exhibition centre.
We have established stay at home rules and given the police new powers to break up gatherings of more than 2 people.
Probably we are looking at converting the NEC into a field hospital for the Birmingham area.

What I think we have abandoned is contact tracing, testing and isolation - probably because we simply don't have the manpower to continue at this stage. My understanding is that there were tens of thousands of people in China involved in this.

 

[weltweit]

I believe the numbers from China like I believe... something else I don't believe. They just don't add up (in my mind).

What do you think of the WHO monitoring team that visited China and approved of their CV-19 regime?

 

[xes]

The WHO sent a team to China to investigate this and other issues and they declared that they trusted Chinese numbers.

I'm sure they did. That doesn't mean a thing. The WHO might have been mislead or even gasp lied to. Those cremation furnaces were running 24/7 when they only usually run 4 hours a night. 4 hours on a busy night = approx 300 people cremated. They were going 24/7 and screaming out for help for a good month or so. You can believe what ever you like. But, I don't trust the CCP, and I fear that the death toll for this is going to be utterly catastrophic. Why is the Italy death toll so much higher in a much shorter time frame? The infection rate didn't match any of the models, but everyone elses kind of does. Other than Iran, but we've all seen the mass graves from the satellite pictures, and the videos of lots of them being dug/filled.

You don' have to be bat shit crazy to think that this is much worse than China let on. (I don't know if places like Japan have covered up the extent of the outbreak either, but it's plausible.)

 

[existentialist]

What do you think of the WHO monitoring team that visited China and approved of their CV-19 regime?

I've no skin in this game, but it wouldn't be the first time an international body had the wool pulled over their eyes by a national government.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Coronavirus: Spanish army finds care home residents 'dead and abandoned'

An inquiry is launched after soldiers discover elderly coronavirus victims "dead in their beds".

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Yossarian]

What do you think of the WHO monitoring team that visited China and approved of their CV-19 regime?

I'm sure they got the most accurate picture they could determine from visiting five cities and meeting government officials. But if the Chinese government wanted to conceal anything from them, it doesn't sound like it would have been difficult.

 

[bimble]

China did expel a bunch of american journalists last week didn't they. Not great timing if your priority is to show how open you are with your information.

 

[redsquirrel]

Besides any active concealment there's also the simple fact that different governments will report information in slightly different ways. How is a death due to COVID-19 being defined?

 

[weltweit]

..
Those cremation furnaces were running 24/7 when they only usually run 4 hours a night. 4 hours on a busy night = approx 300 people cremated. They were going 24/7 and screaming out for help for a good month or so.
..

What is your source for this?

 

[mauvais]

Obviously there are major differences between countries in terms of both their testing policies and their reporting, but Germany is developing into an interesting outlier potentially. If figures are correct (and the initial figures are being revised, I've noticed), they've now reported a massive number of recoveries such that the massive rise in current cases may be levelling out, perhaps, while the reported deaths remain relatively tiny.

The stats are puzzling at the moment. Germany may not be hurtling towards Italy-style disaster, but S Korea-style containment.

It seems to me that German deaths are still accelerating just like everywhere else, only slower.

I wonder if the apparently economically distributed nature of Germany is a factor.

 

[little_legs]

Hmm, Italy have had more than double the deaths than China have had in total.

The numbers from China and Iran are not entirely credible. Same applies to Russia, zero dead in Russia if you believe its government's reporting.

 

[Shechemite]

Not sure this will work if I’m honest China sued for $20 trillion for the coronavirus outbreak

 

[Shechemite]

Pretty heartbreaking this 'As if we were the disease': coronavirus brings prejudice for Italy's Chinese workers

 

[gentlegreen]

I had this on my mind when I happened upon a Chinese supermarket in town on Saturday and went in for seaweed and shitake mushrooms - grim times ...

 

[littlebabyjesus]

It seems to me that German deaths are still accelerating just like everywhere else, only slower.

I wonder if the apparently economically distributed nature of Germany is a factor.

Way slower. We can't know the comparative actual infection rates, of course - the UK's real infection rate is probably higher than Germany's, for instance, so the official figures don't mean much. But S Korea and China have got on top of this without mass deaths (let's take China's figure at face value for now, and Korea has got on top of it with hardly any deaths), so we know that is something that can be done, even in places with megacities.

 

[SheilaNaGig]

Its not just New York either.



On a national level, they are currently fucking around with social distancing measures for a ludicrous 15 days, and Trump has already started making stupid noises about what decision he would prefer to make at the end of that period.

Trump suggests he may scale back closures soon despite worsening coronavirus outbreak

President Donald Trump said on Monday he is considering how to reopen the U.S. economy when a 15-day shutdown ends next week, even as the highly contagious coronavirus is spreading rapidly and hospitals are bracing for a wave of virus-related deaths.

www.reuters.com

I don’t have any idea of how indicative this is but everyone I know over there went into voluntary lockdown about 7-10 days ago.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I don’t have any idea of how indicative this is but everyone I know over there went into voluntary lockdown about 7-10 days ago.

One of the effects of Trump's presidency has been the assertion by many states of their own autonomy. We've seen it over climate change, and we're seeing it again here, thank fuck.

 

[mauvais]

Way slower. We can't know the comparative actual infection rates, of course - the UK's real infection rate is probably higher than Germany's, for instance, so the official figures don't mean much. But S Korea and China have got on top of this without mass deaths (let's take China's figure at face value for now, and Korea has got on top of it with hardly any deaths), so we know that is something that can be done, even in places with megacities.

In terms of deaths, I'm not even sure it is way slower. The UK had its first deaths (two) on 5th March, then none/ones/twos for a bit, until the 14th March where it began to snowball. Germany had its first (two) on 10th March, then unpredictable numbers until recently. However its death rate yesterday (36) is roughly where the UK was five days ago (40). I think you should probably expect it to ultimately follow the same pattern, which is the guidance given by German authorities too.