Frankie Jack
Not a bloke..
The vote went to the Gov as usual. Ayes..251 Nos.. 294 with a Tory/LimpDumb pile in. Still these debates show them for the absolute bastards they are and a lot of people were watching today.
campaign against welfare cuts and poverty
- Thread starter Blagsta
- Start date
My thinking also.
I hope come 2015 a lot of people, particularly Libdem supporters, remember this. One of the most appalling demonstrations in the house of entitlement and privilege I have ever seen. IDS scurrying away because he simply can't be bothered and conservatives whooping and hollering like dogs...
aaaaa video was taken from dailymail, the motive was to spread sharia law on dumb society who is no obeying any laws only consuming and consuming and drinking and drinking, so basically this guys are trying to help you by impose on your fat ass 40 lashes because you are drinker and smoker. It is important because Christmas is coming so it is very important. I think it would be cool to see how 40 lashes are falling on your fat, drunk, smoky ass, but in my modest opinion you should get 80 lashes
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FridgeMagnet
Administrator
oh go away
#foodbankdebate is trending tonight kids!
stuff_it
Too skool for cool
Even by their own statistics the rise in self employment mirrors the drop in unemployment.
http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/lmac/.../february-2013/rpt-self-employed-workers.html
Puddy_Tat
happy mew year
Hmm.
There is one local thing that's very church based, all the others round here seem to be Trussell.
I feel deeply uncomfortable with the idea of donating to food banks.
The whole damn thing stinks.
The religious angle makes me
The cronyism between several of the high profile bosses and the tories makes me
The cosiness with the big supermarkets who encourage people to spend money in their shitty shops to buy things to give to foodbanks, so those foodbanks can give stuff to people among whom may well be people on workfare at those sodding supermarkets, makes me want to throw bricks.
And while I don't want to see people starving in the street, I want there to be a proper social security system and for foodbanks not to have to exist.
Blargh.
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
I try to listen to everything on the news about benefits and employment, but I had to turn Eton Boy's gloating off, as there was a real danger I was going to crash the car.
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
I have a question for you:what is it that you hope to achieve by refusing to engage civilly with anyone, and just spamming a YouTube link around the boards?
This will come back to haunt the government (or the next) when these people get asked to repay their working tax credits from not having made enough money.
The DWP has always encouraged self emplouyment, regardless of whether it's suitable or not.
stuff_it
Too skool for cool
I'm sorry, have you got a link for that? Since when was it likely you would have to pay back your tax credits? It's always been benefits by the back door afaik.
I'm well aware of their track record with encouraging self employment, but in all honesty they've now had so many years to load the system that it's genuinely a better option than the dole for many people. I spent a large part of the year before last dreaming of being employed long enough for a tax credits claim to be processed. I'd have been richer than Croesus compared to my situation at the time.
For many tax credits are a lesser evil, and as I said I know several people who are successfully self employed doing fairly low level work - if someone is genuinely likely to end up in a less appalling situation by employing themselves then I'm still in favour of it. You can't actually escape the system unless you want to go live in a muddy bender up a mountain and eat nothing but nettles, cliff-fall mutton and worms.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Have you noticed how often they now elide actual "job creation" stats when releasing the "jobless" figures nowadays?
Like you say, wouldn't do for people to add 2 and 2 together and realise that the lower figures are down to sanctioning and training regimes, not to the vibrancy of the job market in a growth economy (ha fucking ha!).
Puddy_Tat
happy mew year
There have certainly been reported stories of people being told "we've paid you too much in tax credits, you now owe us a large sum of money, can we have it back now, plzkthx" or words to that effect.
This BBC story suggests that people who aren't really self employed could be asked to repay 'overpaid' tax credits.
I have no link. But I remember a CAB spokesman discussing this on the radio: if you declare yourself as self employed and claim tax credits to top your income up, you can be asked to repay what you've declared if your business doesn't earn enough. The point was that JC's were selling people the idea of self employment without explaining the risks or pitfalls and that people can't just expect to be 'self employed' and claim tax credits to live on.
stuff_it
Too skool for cool
Yes but that's often people who haven't kept the tax credits people up to date with changing situations or who have spent money they weren't strictly meant to get. I'd be massively surprised if the same didn't apply to other benefits under similar circumstances.
I'd never suggest that anyone should "pretend" to be self employed to get tax credits, but afaik so long as someone is genuinely doing their best to start a business they aren't about to get done for fraud and end up having to pay money back. With the current trends in JSA enforcement surely fewer and fewer people are "unsuitable" for self employment, at least when the alternatives are 37.5 hours a week of job search, daily signing and workfare.
Under those circumstances surely it's worthwhile for just about anyone to have a punt on working for themselves instead. At least it gives a non-zero chance of benefiting from their own labour.
Having recently become self employed I've spent a fair bit of time looking in to this. Very few businesses break even in the first year, and they (supposedly) compare like for like when deciding if you might be blagging. Of course it's not ideal, but in comparison to the balls out abuse that people get on other benefits tis nothing much at all.
I've no love for people who really can't manage self employment for whatever reason being pushed into it but a large portion of people are literate and numerate enough to keep basic records, and many parts of the country still have zero employment available.
My understanding is that TCs are worked out by previous tax year for self employed people, so having been out of work for most of the tax year I can earn a fair bit per month until April before I'm likely to get stung (chance would be a fine thing).
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Puddy_Tat
happy mew year
I'm not expert enough to know exactly what happens with tax credits and self employed status, as I've not tried it.
Ultimately, telling lies about these things usually gets found out, and lands you in the shit, so I'd not advocate it.
Another strand is that this may all change under universal credit if and when it goes fully live - the suggestion being that anyone getting 'in work' benefits will have to 'actively seek' more / better paid work. I don't know if that particular idea has been buried yet...
Ultimately, telling lies about these things usually gets found out, and lands you in the shit, so I'd not advocate it.
Another strand is that this may all change under universal credit if and when it goes fully live - the suggestion being that anyone getting 'in work' benefits will have to 'actively seek' more / better paid work. I don't know if that particular idea has been buried yet...
Jackobi
swallows anything
It is one of the major reforms of UC and still applies. Generally, anyone claiming benefits who is not earning the equivalent of 35 hours a week at minimum wage will be subject to UC conditionality, i.e. attending work focused interviews and providing proof of job seeking activity, under threat of sanction. There is also a presumption that self-employed claimants are earning the equivalent of 35 hours at minimum wage, benefit entitlement will be based on those earnings whether realistic or not.
stuff_it
Too skool for cool
Again I spent a lot of time looking in to this recently for obvious reasons. Cunts as they are there will still be a 12 month period where they class you as a "new" business and the min wage rule won't apply. I seem to remember something about people only being allowed a "start up period" every five years though.
Not great but again nothing like as harsh as JSA and ESA claimants are likely to face under UC. My main worry with UC is that by including HB there won't be much scope for people to just sign off and scrape by on HB and sub-min-wage-but-more-than-dole amounts of money.
They're already struggling with sorting out UC for JSA claimants though, these two links give the impression that it will be several years before TCs are affected by UC even in areas that already have it.
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/taxcredits/universal-credit.htm#2
https://www.gov.uk/government/polic...supporting-pages/introducing-universal-credit
The Guardian (I think) said jobless figures are now nearing the point where the bank of England will start to allow a rise in interest rates. Someone more clued up on economics than me might be able to see a reason why the ConDems would like a rise in interest rates, while many other people will struggle. Or am I just seeing conspiracy where only cock-up exists?
BigTom
Well-Known Member
afaik the issue with tax credits would be if HMRC decide that you aren't earning enough to ahve been working 30hours/week (or whatever it is if you ahve kids), and that you were claiming wrongly/fraudulently so you have to pay it back.
At the start fo the year you give them an estimation of how much you are going to earn and your tax credit levels are based on that, if you end up earning more than that then you have to pay back, if you earn less you might get more money (assuming you weren't already getting paid the maximum).
I think that if someone has no idea for a business or anything to try then moving across to WTC isn't a good move, lower levels of payments and risk of getting caught and having to pay back, but if you have somethnig you want to try or something that might give you a day or two per week it's worth doing as you'll earn the difference between WTC and JSA without the hassle of the JCP - the rest of the hours you need to make some attempt to show that you are using them around the business - admin is easy, sales stuff too - finding/contacting potential clients etc. I used to spend a few hours each week making stock video footage so if HMRC ever came knocking I could point to those and claim I spent 15-30 hrs/wk making footage for that just it rarely sold so I didn't make much money off it, knowing they wouldn't have a clue how long it took me to make each clip.
At the start fo the year you give them an estimation of how much you are going to earn and your tax credit levels are based on that, if you end up earning more than that then you have to pay back, if you earn less you might get more money (assuming you weren't already getting paid the maximum).
I think that if someone has no idea for a business or anything to try then moving across to WTC isn't a good move, lower levels of payments and risk of getting caught and having to pay back, but if you have somethnig you want to try or something that might give you a day or two per week it's worth doing as you'll earn the difference between WTC and JSA without the hassle of the JCP - the rest of the hours you need to make some attempt to show that you are using them around the business - admin is easy, sales stuff too - finding/contacting potential clients etc. I used to spend a few hours each week making stock video footage so if HMRC ever came knocking I could point to those and claim I spent 15-30 hrs/wk making footage for that just it rarely sold so I didn't make much money off it, knowing they wouldn't have a clue how long it took me to make each clip.
Puddy_Tat
happy mew year
Current low interest rates mean that people with savings and no mortgage are, in effect, seeing their savings diminish in real terms. High representation of pensioners in that category, pensioners statistically more likely to vote than the general population.
Having said that, can't help thinking an increase in interest rates may burst the housing bubble as the mortgages of the "hard working families / squeezed middle" (many floating voters) will go up. And the "help to buy" scheme makes it fairly clear that they don't want the bubble to burst before 2015 at least...
Not sufficiently clued up to know whether higher interest rates would be good / bad for the very rich.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
A (slight) rise in interest rates might put a curb on some imports, but apart from that I can't see how it'd be of much benefit to the economy - a rise in the base rate, followed by rises in the lending rates, would bring Osborne's property bubble some pretty rapid burstage.
BigTom
Well-Known Member
(I don't agree/am not convinced by this line of argument)
Higher interest rates mean more incentive to lend money. Apparently there's an issue of nobody being willing to lend money so increasing interest rates will help this, meaning people who want to borrow to invest can, leading to increased investment, then growth and jobs.
Higher interest rates mean more incentive to lend money. Apparently there's an issue of nobody being willing to lend money so increasing interest rates will help this, meaning people who want to borrow to invest can, leading to increased investment, then growth and jobs.
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
Iain Duncan Smith paid a visit to the county a week or two ago: here's a picture of the chinless fuck mugging it up for the cameras alongside some equally chinless fucks:
LOOK AT THAT CUNT! The one to his left is Stephen Crabb, Tory cunt for north of the county. The rest are just assorted cunts who run a work programme scheme out of the local college. (report here: http://www.westerntelegraph.co.uk/n...ts_Pembrokeshire__39_s_Work_Programme/?ref=mr)
Anyway, the mother of the chap who runs our choir is a bit of a diehard Tory, and I happened to hear that IDS had gone and spoken at their Conservative association. I lightly suggested that it was a shame she hadn't told me he was coming, as I could have asked her to spit in his eye for me. I shouldn't have been surprised, but perhaps I spend too much time around caring leftie types, because she started going on about how nice he was, and what a lot of sense he talked, etc., blah, and I could feel my ire rising. In the end, after lots of "but he's got to do what he's doing to sort out the country" nonsense, I thought of audiotech and said to her "some of my friends have killed themselves, Mary, because of what that man is doing". That brought her up a little shorter than I'd have liked, but it was a palpable hit.
Now, I feel like a tool for even broaching the subject with her - it should have been obvious to me that it would have been pointless. But maybe I've made her think, no matter how briefly, about the human cost of her party's ideology.
But it's made me think. I am not really particularly political. I've never supported - and don't support - a political party.
But I have realised that I hate the Tories, I hate this government, and I hate Iain Duncan Smith more than I have ever hated anything in my life. It's the kind of all-consuming mouth-twisting stroke-inducing hate that destroys lives and fills people with acid. I can honestly say that, if I saw Iain Duncan Smith (or, quite possibly, any of his Cabinet) about to meet an excruciating and sticky end, I cannot say in all conscience that I would do anything to stop that happening. And I struggle not to hate anyone who is prepared to excuse what they are doing to so many people. It makes me hate my country, too, for being fuckwitted enough to elect such a rapacious bunch of cunts into office. And maybe I also hate myself a bit for not actually DOING ANYTHING to stop it happening, although I do what I can with clients, friends, etc., to mitigate some of the harm that is done. But most of all, I hate Tories.
So I got something out of it, anyway.
LOOK AT THAT CUNT! The one to his left is Stephen Crabb, Tory cunt for north of the county. The rest are just assorted cunts who run a work programme scheme out of the local college. (report here: http://www.westerntelegraph.co.uk/n...ts_Pembrokeshire__39_s_Work_Programme/?ref=mr)
Anyway, the mother of the chap who runs our choir is a bit of a diehard Tory, and I happened to hear that IDS had gone and spoken at their Conservative association. I lightly suggested that it was a shame she hadn't told me he was coming, as I could have asked her to spit in his eye for me. I shouldn't have been surprised, but perhaps I spend too much time around caring leftie types, because she started going on about how nice he was, and what a lot of sense he talked, etc., blah, and I could feel my ire rising. In the end, after lots of "but he's got to do what he's doing to sort out the country" nonsense, I thought of audiotech and said to her "some of my friends have killed themselves, Mary, because of what that man is doing". That brought her up a little shorter than I'd have liked, but it was a palpable hit.
Now, I feel like a tool for even broaching the subject with her - it should have been obvious to me that it would have been pointless. But maybe I've made her think, no matter how briefly, about the human cost of her party's ideology.
But it's made me think. I am not really particularly political. I've never supported - and don't support - a political party.
But I have realised that I hate the Tories, I hate this government, and I hate Iain Duncan Smith more than I have ever hated anything in my life. It's the kind of all-consuming mouth-twisting stroke-inducing hate that destroys lives and fills people with acid. I can honestly say that, if I saw Iain Duncan Smith (or, quite possibly, any of his Cabinet) about to meet an excruciating and sticky end, I cannot say in all conscience that I would do anything to stop that happening. And I struggle not to hate anyone who is prepared to excuse what they are doing to so many people. It makes me hate my country, too, for being fuckwitted enough to elect such a rapacious bunch of cunts into office. And maybe I also hate myself a bit for not actually DOING ANYTHING to stop it happening, although I do what I can with clients, friends, etc., to mitigate some of the harm that is done. But most of all, I hate Tories.
So I got something out of it, anyway.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Iain Duncan Smith paid a visit to the county a week or two ago: here's a picture of the chinless fuck mugging it up for the cameras alongside some equally chinless fucks:
LOOK AT THAT CUNT! The one to his left is Stephen Crabb, Tory cunt for north of the county. The rest are just assorted cunts who run a work programme scheme out of the local college. (report here: http://www.westerntelegraph.co.uk/n...ts_Pembrokeshire__39_s_Work_Programme/?ref=mr)
Anyway, the mother of the chap who runs our choir is a bit of a diehard Tory, and I happened to hear that IDS had gone and spoken at their Conservative association. I lightly suggested that it was a shame she hadn't told me he was coming, as I could have asked her to spit in his eye for me. I shouldn't have been surprised, but perhaps I spend too much time around caring leftie types, because she started going on about how nice he was, and what a lot of sense he talked, etc., blah, and I could feel my ire rising. In the end, after lots of "but he's got to do what he's doing to sort out the country" nonsense, I thought of audiotech and said to her "some of my friends have killed themselves, Mary, because of what that man is doing". That brought her up a little shorter than I'd have liked, but it was a palpable hit.
Now, I feel like a tool for even broaching the subject with her - it should have been obvious to me that it would have been pointless. But maybe I've made her think, no matter how briefly, about the human cost of her party's ideology.
In which case it made good sense to mention it. If she looked behind the curtain for even a minute, then it was worth doing. It makes it harder for people like that to kid themselves if we actually rub their faces in reality.
As I've said for a long old time, what's the point of supporting a political party when the modus operandi is "same shit, different arseholes"? Sure, "Red Ed" would do a few things differently, and wouldn't put the boot in so baldly, but at the end of the day the shit that would rain down on most peoples' heads would still smell exactly the same.
And I'd say that you are political. What you're not is "party political", and as far as I'm concerned, the fewer who are, the better!
"secretary of state visits pembrokeshire's work programme"
is a strange quote compared to provision where i live, which is a small area, and what i suspect the provision is there. Here there are two providers: JHP and Rehab Jobfit (assuming they have't changed). these are the prime providers and claimants get no say in who they are sent to. I was assigned to Jobfit who have subcontracted to Salvation Army Employment Plus who operate out of a small town centre church hall and have simultaneously bullied me and moaned they get no resources (more fool them I say).
So there are likely to be multiple providers in Pembrokeshire. equally to say, of the group mentioned, thy are the area's 'leading' provider is pure bias. There shouldn't be a leading provider unless the DWP are favouring one provider over the other and that isn't meant to happen. FWIW.
is a strange quote compared to provision where i live, which is a small area, and what i suspect the provision is there. Here there are two providers: JHP and Rehab Jobfit (assuming they have't changed). these are the prime providers and claimants get no say in who they are sent to. I was assigned to Jobfit who have subcontracted to Salvation Army Employment Plus who operate out of a small town centre church hall and have simultaneously bullied me and moaned they get no resources (more fool them I say).
So there are likely to be multiple providers in Pembrokeshire. equally to say, of the group mentioned, thy are the area's 'leading' provider is pure bias. There shouldn't be a leading provider unless the DWP are favouring one provider over the other and that isn't meant to happen. FWIW.
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