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Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action

Nigel Irritable said:
No reason why being working class should get you a free pass on the rules of a voluntary organisation either. The SWP are no more likely to expel their working class recruits than they are their middle class ones. They gave Workers Power their marching orders just as happily as they gave them to the proto-Red Action.
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Wrong again. The SWP had a credible record in expelling/sidelining any working class activist that didn't show due deference to their betters. Dockers leader Micky Fenn, Brian Higgins a leading figure in UCATT, engineering workers in the Midlands, Cricklewood and Clapton, uniquely working class branches all bounced for trivial or no reasons. If the SWP ever had any intention of being a proper working class party they would have been cherished instead. Indeed Fenn and Higgins should have been on the CC if as I say they really wanted a party representative of the class. Instead it was then as it is now packed out with fifth (probably being kind there?) rate academics.
Finally it wasn't because fought that they were expelled - it was as ever, the thinking behind the militancy that caused the bother. Why else would the likes of Anna Sullivan, and a host of other female activists have been demonised as well?
 
Nigel Irritable said:
More don't bore me with the predictable drivel from Red Action's past it pub bores. You can script in advance what they'll say about every other left group. And that they will have nothing to say about the failure of their own political project. How are those "pilot schemes' getting along, by the way? Aren't they an inherently more interesting subject than what tactical line Militant took in an East London ward years ago?
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The line Militant took on the Isle of Digs years ago was instrumental in helping the IWCA come about. Not up for it physically, not up for it politically either was the conclusion.
 
Joe Reilly said:
Wrong again. The SWP had a credible record in expelling/sidelining any working class activist that didn't show due deference to their betters.
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The SWP "had a credible record in expelling/sidelining" any activist who didn't show due deference to the leadership. Bar an occasional licensed semi-rebel in the Molyneux mould. If you do what your told, you won't get expelled, whether you are a horny handed son of toil or a granddaughter of a Baron.
 
Nigel Irritable said:
But in theory, there's absolutely no reason why being willing and able to swing a fist when necessary should get you special privileges if you flout the rules.
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Nigel you're a bloodless bureaucrat-in-waiting and it's no surprise you don't get this aspect of politics.
 
Nigel Irritable said:
And anyway, experience at fighting is more skewed by gender than by class. The world has no shortage of beefy rugby playing ex-public school boys who know how to fight. In fact it could do with a few less!
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It is obviously the case that there is no shortage of people who are unafraid of physical confrontation in the wider British middle class – the majority of British army officers still come from this class – indeed from the Public School upper classes.

However, how many of this sort of middle class person is common on the Left ? I was involved in the physical side of anti fascist work across the North West from 1971 to 1987, and I can categorically state that of the literally hundreds of people I worked with in various capacities at the physical end of the activity spectrum, from simple meeting stewarding, to heavier activities, only a handful were drawn from the middle classes.

I strongly suspect this will have been RA's experience too.

For some sociological reason the vast majority of middle class Lefties were always hopeless "on the pavement" to use a Micky Fennism, and made bloody sure they stayed well away from it.

Why is Nigel Irritating on this thread ? Is it a spoof ? No-one could genuinely be so sneeringly pompous surely ? Nah, it's completely over the top.. Come on, it's really you Gary , winding us all up. Good one mate.
 
ayatollah said:
It is obviously the case that there is no shortage of people who are unafraid of physical confrontation in the wider British middle class – the majority of British army officers still come from this class – indeed from the Public School upper classes.

However, how many of this sort of middle class person is common on the Left ? I was involved in the physical side of anti fascist work across the North West from 1971 to 1987, and I can categorically state that of the literally hundreds of people I worked with in various capacities at the physical end of the activity spectrum, from simple meeting stewarding, to heavier activities, only a handful were drawn from the middle classes.

I strongly suspect this will have been RA's experience too.

For some sociological reason the vast majority of middle class Lefties were always hopeless "on the pavement" to use a Micky Fennism, and made bloody sure they stayed well away from it.
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It was ever thus. In 'Beating the Fascists?' by Eve Rosenhaft, she examines in forensic detail the anti-fascist forces involved in the fight against the Brownshirts in the Weimar Republic. In a chapter headed 'Who were the anti-fascists?' she explores through the use of court records and so forth the social background of the activists at the coal-face. Overwhelmingly, she concluded not only was the class character of the anti-fascist movement working class, it was actual manual workers who invariably provided the cutting edge. All round it is an excellent study, BTF writ large if you like, and gives the lie to the persistent smear by Nigel and his ilk, that the rank and file KPD either collaborated or dragged their feet in the struggle against the paramiliary right. In truth they were the only ones really up for it. The real culprits in this regard being the SDP who tellingly always find apologists among Trots.
 
You may have thought of this already (I discussed this with Demu yesterday), but the Amazon Kindle apparently now accounts for more Amazon booksales than traditional printed books. Given the difficulties with BTF distribution in recent months have you thought of getting it set up as an Amazon Kindle E book download ? (You still charge for it - online) I admit I aint got a Kindle myself yet - but it is obvious that within a few years we'll all have them. Just a thought.
 
I just bought this book today, going to Malaga next week for a ten day holiday, looking forward to reading it start to finish.
 
Just read Gang War about Manchester gangs which credits 'Dessie'Noonan as single handedly closing down Manchester BNP. I dont doubt his reputation but it chimes somewhat differently from other accounts and the involvement of other people.
 
Citizen66 said:
Just read Gang War about Manchester gangs which credits 'Dessie'Noonan as single handedly closing down Manchester BNP. I dont doubt his reputation but it chimes somewhat differently from other accounts and the involvement of other people.
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Its a shite book mainly composed of clippings from the Manchester Evening News and journo stories.
 
Citizen66 said:
Just read Gang War about Manchester gangs which credits 'Dessie'Noonan as single handedly closing down Manchester BNP. I dont doubt his reputation but it chimes somewhat differently from other accounts and the involvement of other people.
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The authentic version of what happened to the Manchester BNP branch, founded by 'Kenny Rogers' can be found in BTF.

This does differ somewhat from the claims made in both Gang Wars and No Retreat.

For the record Dessie Noonan was an active anti fascist for a good 20 years to my knowledge.
 
ayatollah said:
IS there much evidence of the EDL/English Nationalists engaging in direct attacks on the Left ? Since direct action anti fascism is a tactical response to fascist violence, rather than some "correct at any time and place" principal, the reappearance of direct action violent street fascism will in itself produce a reappearance of what is now generally called "Squadism".

Ayatollah, there is an increasing record of ENA/EDL attacking meetings etc. just off the top of me head oldham and manc SWP turned over a while back, Liverpool News From Nowhere shop intimidated, brighton antifascist meeting attacked, leeds antifa gig attacked and no doubt plenty of others. the EDL are now under heavy manners from plod and are organising more secretively having also realised that flash demos are difficult for both plod and antifascists to 'apprehend.' what is good is that they are fragmenting and their leadership is under pressure: robinson has half a dozen charges against him not all EDL related, guramit singh has left, roberta moore expelled, joel titus jailed, richard price nicked on drug and kiddy porn charges, snowy excluded and now ranting about the protocols of zion. so the token sikh, jewish rep and 'mixed race' members are now gone and the EDL are looking like increasingly 'white' mob rather than their 'multicultural racist' appearance that they had before. the question is do antifascists do anything or do we simply watch them fall apart?
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love detective said:
All the reviews are on the beating the fascists site now - will put the journal one up when it's available and any others when they arrive (copsey etc..)

also will be putting up some old footage, photos and back issues of RA/FT there along with some other marketing/publicity stuff for the book
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LD, there is a serious lack of scans of original fighting talks and red action stuff as well as photos of action - apart from the well known few that are already duplicated many times (i did see a copy of fighting talk on amazon going for 7 quid). if anyone can upload this stuff to the site it would be invaluable for researchers to use or draw on. the clandestine nature of militant antifascism has its down side!
 
there's a file going around with a large number of issues of fighting talk (in fact Manchester 'anti fascist alliance' are actually selling it which is a bit cheeky) - however this isn't a complete set of all issues

the intention is for the complete set of FT and RA to eventually go up
 
love detective said:
I posted that one up a good few page back

The journalist who did this interview was the journalist who set off the whole hari scandal the other day (he didn't find the original negri plaigraism, but did the digging on the other stuff and made it go viral on twitter/the media etc..
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Apparently he's been getting astronomical numbers of hits on his personal web page through Hari related links from the Telegraph and Tory bloggers of the Guido Fawkes variety. His review of Beating the Fascists is probably getting a rather surprised and surprising new audience.
 
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