Avoiding meat and dairy is ‘single biggest way’ to reduce your impact on Earth

[editor]

Do angry vegans turn you against going vegan?

OK, I'll get it out in the open. I'm vegan, pleased to meet you. I'm vegan because I believe we should treat animals much better in this world, and the environment, and our own health. There's an argument between vegans that seems to be gathering pace. Some vegans claim that you can be...

www.urban75.net

And your point is?

 

[Flavour]

Netherlands proposes radical plans to cut livestock numbers by almost a third

Dutch farmers could be forced to sell land and reduce the amount of animals they keep to help lower ammonia pollution

www.theguardian.com

Good news

 

[Funky_monks]

Re: the claims made in the OP:
"Four widely applicable high-impact (i.e. low emissions) actions with the potential to contribute to systemic change and substantially reduce annual personal emissions: having one fewer child (an average for developed countries of (tCO2e) emission reductions per 58.6 tonnes CO2-equivalent per year), living car-free (2.4 tCO2e saved per year), avoiding airplane travel (1.6 tCO2e saved per roundtrip transatlantic flight) and eating a plant-based diet (0.8 tCO2e saved per year)."

The climate mitigation gap: education and government recommendations miss the most effective individual actions - IOPscience

Can we finally admit that the claim made in the OP is bollocks?

 

[editor]

Re: the claims made in the OP:
"Four widely applicable high-impact (i.e. low emissions) actions with the potential to contribute to systemic change and substantially reduce annual personal emissions: having one fewer child (an average for developed countries of (tCO2e) emission reductions per 58.6 tonnes CO2-equivalent per year), living car-free (2.4 tCO2e saved per year), avoiding airplane travel (1.6 tCO2e saved per roundtrip transatlantic flight) and eating a plant-based diet (0.8 tCO2e saved per year)."

The climate mitigation gap: education and government recommendations miss the most effective individual actions - IOPscience

Can we finally admit that the claim made in the OP is bollocks?

For people who don't drive, don't have children or fly on transatlantic trips, the title remains absolutely accurate.

That report is over four years old, btw.

 

[lazythursday]

Re: the claims made in the OP:
"Four widely applicable high-impact (i.e. low emissions) actions with the potential to contribute to systemic change and substantially reduce annual personal emissions: having one fewer child (an average for developed countries of (tCO2e) emission reductions per 58.6 tonnes CO2-equivalent per year), living car-free (2.4 tCO2e saved per year), avoiding airplane travel (1.6 tCO2e saved per roundtrip transatlantic flight) and eating a plant-based diet (0.8 tCO2e saved per year)."

The climate mitigation gap: education and government recommendations miss the most effective individual actions - IOPscience

Can we finally admit that the claim made in the OP is bollocks?

Well no we can't. Different research will often come up with different answers. It might be bollocks, but might not. And the big difference between this research and that in the OP, is that the original research looked at a wider environmental impact than simply CO2.

 

[editor]

Meanwhile:

Twenty livestock companies are responsible for more greenhouse gas emissions than either Germany, Britain or France – and are receiving billions of dollars in financial backing to do so, according to a new report by environmental campaigners.

Raising livestock contributes significantly to carbon emissions, with animal agriculture accounting for 14.5% of the world’s greenhouse gas emissions. Scientific reports have found that rich countries need huge reductions in meat and dairy consumption to tackle the climate emergency.

The bottom line, said Becheva, is that “we need to begin reducing the number of food animals on the planet and incentivise different consumption models.”

More meat industry regulation is needed too, she said, “to make sure companies are paying for the harms they have created throughout the supply chain and to minimise further damage”.

20 meat and dairy firms emit more greenhouse gas than Germany, Britain or France

Livestock companies with large emissions receive billions of dollars in funding, campaigners say

www.theguardian.com

 

[editor]

The science says - again - reduce your meat and dairy intake:

Transitioning away from meat and dairy is ultimately unavoidable, if the world is to meet climate targets, according to Dr Mike Clark, from Oxford University’s Nuffield Department of Population Health, an expert on environmental, economic, and health impacts of food systems.

He said: “At a global scale, there is an abundance of evidence that suggests that consumption and production of meat and dairy need to reduce in order to promote health and meet environmental targets. This is particularly true in high-income economies like the UK, USA, Australia, EU with histories of high meat and dairy consumption.”

In 2019, scientists writing in the Lancet Planetary Health journal called for governments to implement a vast restoration of natural vegetation on land currently used for meat production. This, they said, was the “best option” for removing CO2 from the Earth’s atmosphere.

Can going vegan save the world?

As concern about environmental catastrophe deepens, Harry Cockburn tries to digest exactly how our diets may be making things worse and what action must be taken

www.independent.co.uk

 

[ddraig]

No convincing the industry shill, not ever, no siree

 

[Saul Goodman]

Meanwhile:

20 meat and dairy firms emit more greenhouse gas than Germany, Britain or France

Livestock companies with large emissions receive billions of dollars in funding, campaigners say

www.theguardian.com

The OP is a Guardian article, and that turned out to be complete bollocks.
Do you have any non-clickbait links from not-the-guardian? Maybe from credible sources? .

 

[lazythursday]

No convincing the industry shill, not ever, no siree

It's not even as if a significant reduction in animal agriculture necessarily has to be bad news for farmers as a whole. There are going to be other ways of generating income from land - payments for environment public goods, tree planting, bioenergy crops, potentially the new biodiversity net gain payments - and although vegans might want it, we're hardly likely to see the animal agriculture sector disappear altogether.

 

[editor]

At least the Netherlands aren't indulging in this weird denial and are looking to do something positive:

Dutch politicians are considering plans to force hundreds of farmers to sell up and cut livestock numbers, to reduce damaging ammonia pollution.

After the highest Dutch administrative court found in 2019 that the government was breaking EU law by not doing enough to reduce excess nitrogen in vulnerable natural areas, the country has been battling what it is calling a “nitrogen crisis”.



Daytime speed limits have been reduced to 100kmph (62mph) on motorways to limit nitrogen oxide emissions, gas-guzzling construction projects were halted and a new law pledges that by 2030 half of protected nature areas must have healthy nitrogen levels.

Now civil servants at the finance and agriculture ministry have drawn up proposals which include slashing livestock numbers [pdf] by 30%, one of the most radical plans of its kind in Europe. Two proposed scenarios include forcing some farmers to sell emissions rights and even their land to the state, if necessary.

Livestock produce manure which, when mixed with urine, releases ammonia, a nitrogen compound. If it gets into lakes and streams via farm runoff, excessive nitrogen can damage sensitive natural habitats by, for example, encouraging algae blooms that deplete oxygen in surface water

Netherlands proposes radical plans to cut livestock numbers by almost a third

Dutch farmers could be forced to sell land and reduce the amount of animals they keep to help lower ammonia pollution

www.theguardian.com

 

[Saul Goodman]

Oh look, more Guardian clickbait

 

[Dandred]

 

[Funky_monks]

The irony of refuting scientific journal sources, whilst using lay press click bait as "the science".....

 

[lazythursday]

The irony of refuting scientific journal sources, whilst using lay press click bait as "the science".....

Best to focus on work that is based on far more than a single journal article (or click baity headlines) such as the Committee on Climate Change Land Use report, which is very clear that there needs to be a reduction in meat and dairy.

 

[Funky_monks]

Best to focus on work that is based on far more than a single journal article (or click baity headlines) such as the Committee on Climate Change Land Use report, which is very clear that there needs to be a reduction in meat and dairy.

I've posted numerous journal articles in the thread. Policy follows science (often some time later), and is dependent on what policymakers think will make them popular, so recent science is more relevant.
I find it very interesting that in lots of instances on these boards, the press is torn to shreds because of its bias, and the opinions of quangos are widely critiqued, but apparently not on this thread, where they fit nicely into some of the posters (who have no expertise in this area) conformation bias.

 

[editor]

I've posted numerous journal articles in the thread. Policy follows science (often some time later), and is dependent on what policymakers think will make them popular, so recent science is more relevant.
I find it very interesting that in lots of instances on these boards, the press is torn to shreds because of its bias, and the opinions of quangos are widely critiqued, but apparently not on this thread, where they fit nicely into some of the posters (who have no expertise in this area) conformation bias.

Thank fuck young people have got some sense:

A new survey has revealed that half of 16 to 24 year olds in the UK have committed to a vegetarian way of eating with sustainability in mind.

Half of people in one age group have already ditched meat for the environment

The survey also revealed the regions of the UK with the most vegetarians.

uk.style.yahoo.com

 

[Funky_monks]

Thank fuck young people have got some sense:

Half of people in one age group have already ditched meat for the environment

The survey also revealed the regions of the UK with the most vegetarians.

uk.style.yahoo.com

Vegetarians eat dairy, the dairy industry is the beef industry.
Also, the vast majority of the plants they eat will have been fertilised at least on part with manure.
Its almost like all these systems are linked.....
"Young people respond to advertising targeted at young people"

 

[editor]

Vegetarians eat dairy, the dairy industry is the beef industry.
Also, the vast majority of the plants they eat will have been fertilised at least on part with manure.
Its almost like all these systems are linked.....

But they're REDUCING THEIR INTAKE which is the whole fucking point.

"Young people respond to advertising targeted at young people"

So the meat industry don't target young people at all, then? Love the way you're so patronising to young people. Classy.

 

[Pickman's model]

Also, the vast majority of the plants they eat will have been fertilised at least on part with manure.

You're talking shit

 

[Spymaster]

Vegetarians eat dairy, the dairy industry is the beef industry.
Also, the vast majority of the plants they eat will have been fertilised at least on part with manure.
Its almost like all these systems are linked.....
"Young people respond to advertising targeted at young people"

Aye, this thread's getting weirder. One argument gets blown to smithereens and up pops a complete non-sequitur gleaned from some Yahoo page. Bizarre.

 

[Spymaster]

You're talking shit

That started from post #1

 

[Cid]

Thank fuck young people have got some sense:

Half of people in one age group have already ditched meat for the environment

The survey also revealed the regions of the UK with the most vegetarians.

uk.style.yahoo.com

If you dig into that at all, it’s rapidly apparent it’s bollocks. It’s a survey of 2,000 people commissioned by a meal company. Assuming that’s all fine and dandy, which is a stretch, it also just says that 49.9% of people in that age group identified as meat eaters. The rest includes everything from pescatarians (a baffling position, unless for dietary reasons) to ‘don’t know’.

Survey reveals half of Brits wasting fresh food | Public Sector Catering

Half of the people surveyed said that sustainability has become more important to them over the last year but one in two Brits waste food as they can’t use fresh produce fast enough with 80% of the waste being fruit and vegetables. The research, which questioned 2,000 people across the UK...

www.publicsectorcatering.co.uk

 

[Funky_monks]

You're talking shit

About it, maybe.

There are these quite popular things called "muck for straw deals" that arable farmers enter into - guess what they involve?
I'm in Herefordshire and chicken muck is the preferred fert for the broccoli, spud and top fruit growers.

 

[Cid]

The vegetarian society is more pessimistic, and has links to a lot of studies.

Facts and Figures | The Vegetarian Society

As a charity we rely on the work of other organisations, like the Office for National Statistics and Mintel, for our statistical information.

vegsoc.org

 

[Spymaster]

If you dig into that at all, it’s rapidly apparent it’s bollocks. It’s a survey of 2,000 people commissioned by a meal company. Assuming that’s all fine and dandy, which is a stretch, it also just says that 49.9% of people in that age group identified as meat eaters. The rest includes everything from pescatarians (a baffling position, unless for dietary reasons) to ‘don’t know’.

Survey reveals half of Brits wasting fresh food | Public Sector Catering

Half of the people surveyed said that sustainability has become more important to them over the last year but one in two Brits waste food as they can’t use fresh produce fast enough with 80% of the waste being fruit and vegetables. The research, which questioned 2,000 people across the UK...

www.publicsectorcatering.co.uk

Awww, come on. That piece was written by Lauren Clark, who chills out by drinking oat lattes and wrapping herself in hyularonic acid infused sheets.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

Best to focus on work that is based on far more than a single journal article (or click baity headlines) such as the Committee on Climate Change Land Use report, which is very clear that there needs to be a reduction in meat and dairy.

And, as I posted a few pages back, also the IPCC’s last report. Funny how the cow fisters and the losers who still haven’t weened themselves off breastfeeding ignored that lol.

 

[WouldBe]

The vegetarian society is more pessimistic, and has links to a lot of studies.

Facts and Figures | The Vegetarian Society

As a charity we rely on the work of other organisations, like the Office for National Statistics and Mintel, for our statistical information.

vegsoc.org

Vegetarianism less popular than the libdems.

 

[Johnny Vodka]

‘This is a place of death’: the fight for a meat-free world – video

Humans' relationship with animals is under greater focus than ever, as part of a drive to lessen our impact on the planet. In the UK, animal rights activists, buoyed by the rise in veganism and a developing understanding of animal sentience, have spotted an opportunity to grow what has...

www.theguardian.com

 

[Pickman's model]

That's also covered in the documentary. It covers 9 tipping points that (he says) will see the end of us. I think the only one we've breached is chemical fertilisers.

might also be at the massive fart in the arctic tipping point too Arctic ground ‘literally collapsing’ amid abrupt thaw