And next, Syria?

[camouflage]

This might sound a rather obvious question, but how does "jubilant crowds" in one part of Aleppo negate the impact of maimed bodies in the streets, injured children trapped under rubble in another part of the city, etc.?

You can ask that about any war, that's why in my opinion war is a bad idea. I'm not a pacifist though, a society has a right to defend itself from being collapsed by agenda-laden armed foreigners. What you call "Assad", I call "Syria".

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

This might sound a rather obvious question, but how does "jubilant crowds" in one part of Aleppo negate the impact of maimed bodies in the streets, injured children trapped under rubble in another part of the city, etc.?

No, the toddler was weeping because he didn't happen to be pro Assad

 

[camouflage]

No, the toddler was weeping because he didn't happen to be pro Assad

No, the toddler was weeping because the parents were killed in an explosion I think.

 

[rekil]

The Morning Star's 'clarification' makes them look even worse.

How credible do we think the reports of atrocities in "liberated" Aleppo are?

I've already seen stuff saying that Assad has given amnesties in the past, meaning that maybe these new atrocity reports aren't credible, but for fuck's sake, come on, this is fucking Assad here.

In addition to what's been said, there'll probably be an increase in the traditional practice of scooping people up to be held for ransom, and the regime has let jihadis out previously to fuck around in Iraq and to sectarianise the rebellion so they might be banked again until they can be useful.

 

[teqniq]

Well RT's job is basically to bombard an easily gulled RT audience with misinformation so nothing inconsistent there. Easily detectable bollocks is on mission. Like Fox News a fundamental idea is undermine other sources. While our free media is busily on message regurgitating government information operations with a few folks on the ground trying to fit in with the "story".

Yeah I kinda get that.

 

[Geri]

Don't suppose anyone would like to have a go at identifying those pictured here with conspiraloon Vanessa Beeley and the regime guy?

View attachment 97068

Back right with the beard is the mad vicar, Andrew Ashdown. He blocked me on Facebook today for telling him he would burn in Hell.

He's doing a PhD at Cambridge.

 

[teqniq]

I like your style.

 

[camouflage]

Well RT's job is basically to bombard an easily gulled RT audience with misinformation so nothing inconsistent there. Easily detectable bollocks is on mission. Like Fox News a fundamental idea is undermine other sources. While our free media is busily on message regurgitating government information operations with a few folks on the ground trying to fit in with the "story".

Kinda checks out... The List

 

[CRI]

Newsbud Exclusive- The World’s Biggest Hostage Crisis Comes to an End

So, you liberate people by killing them. Gotcha.

 

[GrowbagUK]

The western backed rebels have lost in Aleppo so of course it will now be portrayed as a humanitarian crisis. The governments and media were all too happy to bang the war drum when it suited them. Time for them to take some responsibility for their part. Hundreds of thousands of innocent civilian's blood is already on their hands. The Central Bank of Syria remains state-owned and controlled.

 

[Humberto]

Isn't Assad's forces shooting families in liberated areas?

sorry eta 'liberated' I meant

 

[CRI]

Both the left and the right are creaming their pants over what's happening in Aleppo. Jesus wept, like really.

 

[Humberto]

Both the left and the right are creaming their pants over what's happening in Aleppo. Jesus wept, like really.

Is that at me who just posted and other left wing posters?

 

[Humberto]

Not that I care it was a meaningless post.

 

[CrabbedOne]

The Assad clan has owned the place for decades but that's changing as Bashar has essentially sold out his brutal father's legacy in order to survive. With the fall of East Aleppo the Baathist state now aspires to be much like the Jewish state next door ruling the restive mostly Sunni Pals with solid core support but no money, a pretty crappy army and a great deal more brutality. The regime has fragmented under pressure of war and the state faces many loyalist substate actors that are not so loyal. They are printing their own licenses to rob Syrians. Damascus is skint and unable to purchase friends as it once did. The Russians are trying to pimp the Syrian war as a path back being a peer with the US without much care for Damascus. They'd ditch the Assad's in a trice but there is no one else and they are stuck with him. More dangerously the subtle Iranians have now moved in permanently right next to Israel. Bashar may fear the IDF but needs the IRGC's fast spreading Khomeinist militias. That's a train crash waiting to happen. The fall of East Aleppo may be more like the fall of Baathist Baghdad than Bashar would like.

 

[CRI]

Is that at me who just posted and other left wing posters?

No, not a response to your post. It's comments I've seen elsewhere today as well as here, rejoicing at the "liberation."

 

[Casually Red]

The Assad clan has owned the place for decades but that's changing as Bashar has essentially sold out his brutal father's legacy in order to survive. With the fall of East Aleppo the Baathist state now aspires to be much like the Jewish state next door ruling the restive mostly Sunni Pals with solid core support but no money, a pretty crappy army and a great deal more brutality. The regime has fragmented under pressure of war and the state faces many loyalist substate actors that are not so loyal. They are printing their own licenses to rob Syrians. Damascus is skint and unable to purchase friends as it once did. The Russians are trying to pimp the Syrian war as a path back being a peer with the US without much care for Damascus. They'd ditch the Assad's in a trice but there is no one else and they are stuck with him. More dangerously the subtle Iranians have now moved in permanently right next to Israel. Bashar may fear the IDF but needs the IRGC's fast spreading Khomeinist militias. That's a train crash waiting to happen. The fall of East Aleppo may be more like the fall of Baathist Baghdad than Bashar would like.

Fuck me you could teach Alaistar Campbell a thing or 2 when it comes to desperately spinning a massive victory as really a massive defeat. But absolutely nothing about being gracious in that defeat .

 

[Casually Red]

You can ask that about any war, that's why in my opinion war is a bad idea. I'm not a pacifist though, a society has a right to defend itself from being collapsed by agenda-laden armed foreigners. What you call "Assad", I call "Syria".

Just a few months ago commentators were saying this thing in east Alleppo would take years . It was done and dusted before Christmas . Usually the shit talkers tell us it'll be over by Christmas but it goes on for years , other way round this time . Have to say even I'm quite stunned by the sheer scale and speed of this victory . It's absolutely massive . Erdogans face must be quite like Hillary Clintons on election night . Actually Clintons having a bad month of it come to think of it .

Read somewhere the cops in Damascus had been instructed to prevent the Syrian civilians from celebrating the liberation of Allepo by firing celebratory volleys into the air . When news of the victory came through everyone went mental and the cops even joined in with their own guns . I expect a certain someone will spin that as an example of Bashar losing his grip, sure sign his days are numbered etc .

Put me in the mood for some hip hop




Oh yeah, they caught that moderate animal who moderately chopped that Palestinian kids head off . Didn't end well for him .

 

[Casually Red]

How credible do we think the reports of atrocities in "liberated" Aleppo are?

I've already seen stuff saying that Assad has given amnesties in the past, meaning that maybe these new atrocity reports aren't credible, but for fuck's sake, come on, this is fucking Assad here.

From what I can see from the BBC website these reports are emanating from " activists " and the likes of the Mi5 sponsored white helmets and poor wee Bana..who's been blown up by the Russians a few times by this stage ,threatened to die repeatedly if the west didn't start world war 3 to save her..she actually said that...then died, got miraculously resurrected when her "death" didnt spark WW 3 and she figured out she couldn't tweet posthumously...and who's still merrily tweeting away from inside her blown up , wi fi intact house that's supposed to be a pile of rubble...and now threatening to die again any second . A realm of credibility somewhere well, well below Alex Jones at this point .

And..there's also 100,000 Allepans apparently trying to squeeze into a district the size of a shoebox that the government is shelling . Heading directly towards it, 100,000 fucking lemmings . That's according to yet another " activist " .

It's a holy terror .

 

[teqniq]

Using misleading images seems to be all the rage.

 

[CrabbedOne]

On SWJ The United States and Russia Are Already at War

...
Russia’s unconscionable weaponization of the Syrian refugee crisis represents this paradigm in action. For instance, Moscow’s initiative may yet undermine the Hungarian liberal establishment and push the country towards a more permanently xenophobic political footing. If that happens, it will be like one of the twenty-eight screws holding NATO together unwinding just enough to weaken neighboring screws. The ongoing uptick in nationalism in Europe—aided by Russia-backed far-right European political parties—suggests that this is not an idle fear. Left untended, this unwinding could shatter the Alliance’s unified front.

Moscow’s use of the Syrian refugee crisis to destabilize Europe underscores Russian strategists’ view that the U.S.-Russia security competition is not a binary affair. It shows as well Moscow’s related understanding that the U.S.-Russia competition is not even itself just one conflict. It’s the summation of multiple ongoing and interacting conflicts. As Robert Kaplan writes, Russian policymakers see their “near abroad” as a single operational theater—a single “conflict system,” as Kaplan has described it—with ongoing operations in one area directly affecting campaigns elsewhere. This allows them to use efforts in Syria, for instance, to affect NATO politics in Brussels and the corresponding correlation of resolve in the Baltics. This can be seen as a collision of systems wherein Moscow uses events in its own conflict system to help scuttle European liberalism.
...

Well that's rather like what folk used to call the Great Game. Imperial competition by any means available.

Of course if perhaps a majority of Europeans were not gibbering in fear of Syrian refugees "liberalism" would be in rather less danger. The opportunist Russians just play on obvious political weaknesses when they back the rising populist hard-right. Funny, that used to be a main plank of Langley's business model in Western Europe back in the day.

 

[CrabbedOne]

On ISW ISIS Recaptures Palmyra in Major Blow to Pro-Regime Forces

...
The success enjoyed by ISIS in Palmyra also highlights the fragility of pro-regime forces despite their recent gains in Western Syria, foreshadowing the difficulty that the regime and its allies will face in securing the country over the long-term. Syrian President Bashar al-Assad remains reliant upon a small cadre of elite military units and foreign fighters – including Russian Spetznaz, Lebanese Hezbollah, and Iraqi Shia Militias – in order to secure gains against his opponents on the ground. The regime reportedly redeployed the majority of these assets to enable its successful operations to clear opposition forces from Eastern Aleppo City over the past several months, generating vulnerabilities on other battlefronts including Central Syria. Pro-regime forces remain unlikely to deploy in large numbers to Eastern Homs Province in the near-term. Russia will likely use this renewed threat in order to press the U.S. for increased cooperation against ISIS in Syria. Nonetheless, the regime remains incapable of reestablishing security across the country without sustained foreign support – and thus remains incapable of meeting the long-term strategic objectives of the U.S. in Syria.

Of course the same is even more true of the "moderate" Syrian rebels. Really not much use against IS without a stiffening force of TSK behind them and mostly in the wrong bits of geography.

 

[CrabbedOne]

On LWJ Jihadis celebrate capture of Russian base in Palmyra, Syria

Lots of loot for IS on display.

 

[mikey mikey]

On LWJ Jihadis celebrate capture of Russian base in Palmyra, Syria

Lots of loot for IS on display.

That report on LWJ. Just scroll down to the bottom.

Thomas Joscelyn is a Senior Fellow at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies and the Senior Editor for The Long War Journal.

Who are the Foundation for Defense of Democracies?

Well...(my bold)

“I think he doesn’t represent a change in policy whatsoever,” says Jonathan Schanzer, of the neoconservative Foundation for Defense of Democracies think tank. “He’s going to be the messenger like Hillary Clinton was: I don’t see him changing policy or leading America in a new direction.”

Obama's new head boy

 

[Doctor Carrot]

So, you liberate people by killing them. Gotcha.

That's par the course for the resident sycophants on this thread. To them when America claims to liberate the likes of Fallujah by bombing its inhabitants to shit they're the first to scream 'war crime' and yeah it is. When Assad bombs his own country's inhabitants to shit, propped up by Russian airpower and grubby militias on the ground who are basically jihadists from another sect it's all cheers, rejoicing and wanking over what great strong leaders Assad and Putin are.

 

[CrabbedOne]

Relative luxury though not compared to a US base. It doesn't even have a Pizza chain in residence.

 

[mikey mikey]

The Morning Star has today come under massive criticism for hailing the near total recapture of Aleppo by pro-Government forces as a “liberation.” I would agree that the situation calls for more nuance. However a feeling of relief that the fighting that has ravaged Aleppo for four years is coming to a close, must form part of any sane reaction. If we are not allowed to feel relief at that, presumably it means that we must have wanted al-Nusra and various other jihadist militias to win the hot war. What do we think Syria would look like after that?

I am no fan of the Assad regime. It is not a genuine democracy and it has a very poor human rights record. If Assad had been toppled by his own people in the Arab spring and replaced by something more akin to a liberal democracy, which kept the Assad regime’s religious toleration, protection of minorities and comparatively good record on women’s rights, and added to it political freedom, a functioning justice system and end to human rights abuse, nobody would have been happier than I. Indeed I strongly suspect I have in the past done much more to campaign against human rights abuse in Syria than the mainstream media stenographers who all decry the fall of rebel Aleppo now.

But sadly liberal democracy, human rights and women’s rights are not in any sense what the jihadist militias the West is backing are fighting for.

Of course it is essential that human rights are now respected in Aleppo by the government, that civilians are looked after, and that rebel fighters once identified are incarcerated in decent conditions. I add my voice to those calls. It should be noted that the threat to life and limb, and the violations and war crimes, have been on all sides, and the oppression of the government is most unlikely to be worse than the oppression of the rebels. The jhadists impounded relief supplies from the civilian population, shot those attempting to flee, and raped on a grand scale. That is not in any way to minimise the potential for mirror abuse from government supporting troops. But it is nonetheless true and must be stated.

Craig Murry

Clearly cheering Assad and all that. Cos if you're not with the Big Foreign Policy you must be a PutinAssad worshipper.

Thanks for the false dichotomy. I can always use the Straw Man to scare away the blacklegs.

 

[Akkadian]

Russia interest in the Middle East goes back to the times Tsars, particularly Syria and its Mediterranean coast. Putin is simply restating his aims, Imperial Russia by control of oil. You only have too look at the Sykes and Picot accord 1916, a third name was dropped Sazonov, due the Russians armed forces routing and having a little sickle and hammer revolution. We are literally witnessing reboot of history. Western influence is far from moral , and Osbourne has some bare face cheek whatever he was wittering on about. The sooner we move away from fossil fuel the better.


https://www.chathamhouse.org/system/files/publications/twt/Russia has returned to a region it never really left.pdf

How vital is Syria's Tartus port to Russia? - BBC News

War, first casualty is the truth, the second victim is innocence.

 

[Idris2002]

Russia interest in the Middle East goes back to the times Tsars, particularly Syria and its Mediterranean coast. Putin is simply restating his aims, Imperial Russia by control of oil. You only have too look at the Sykes and Picot accord 1916, a third name was dropped Sazonov, due the Russians armed forces routing and having a little sickle and hammer revolution. We are literally witnessing reboot of history. Western influence is far moral , and Osbourne has some bare face cheek whatever he was wittering on about. The sooner we move away from fossil fuel the better.


https://www.chathamhouse.org/system/files/publications/twt/Russia has returned to a region it never really left.pdf

How vital is Syria's Tartus port to Russia? - BBC News

War, first casualty is the truth, the second victim is innocence.

 

[GrowbagUK]

Isn't Assad's forces shooting families in liberated areas?

sorry eta 'liberated' I meant

According to the fake MSM news. If you still believe their propaganda you should perhaps look further afield for your information.