And next, Syria?

[Casually Red]

Simple question, if a bomb..or a number of bombs as is claimed..was dropped on a crowded market in the middle of the day and killed over 100 people ..would you expect there to be quite a few people blown to pieces ? Yes or no ?

I would also expect the victims of such an atrocity to comprise a much higher ratio of female victims . Despite looking at lines of corpses of the supposed victims I don't see any whatsoever . They seem overwhelmingly to be males of military age . Who came under attack in a terrorist stronghold .

If a great many people were indeed blown to pieces would you expect the photographic and video footage to reflect such scenes ? Yes or no ? Bombs generally do that to their victims, they leave them in bits . There are no bits .

Does it ? Yes or no ?

His opinion appears to me to be formed by actual evidence, which he points to . It would be very easy to upend his opinion by pointing to evidence which alludes to the contrary . Which I for one simply do not see . And seemingly you can't either . Therefore logic dictates that his opinions, supported by facts, are much more reliable than the op ions of those with their own agendas which aren't supported by any evidence that I'm currently aware of .

 

[teqniq]

I am not an expert on military ordnance you'll have to ask one of the military or ex-military types on here for a nuanced opinion on a bomb or missile strike. But one thing I will surmise, if the market was hit directly there may well be little or nothing left in the way of human remains so I'll go with the doctors ta. You know the ones that said hospitals are being deliberately targeted that you seem to be having some trouble offering an opinion on. Incidentally this is not the first time this has happened, the same thing has happened in Aleppo and the source is the same, Doctors without borders.

and this from 2014 from The Lancet

...Medical staff here are so afraid of reprisal by the government that they use fake names and only communicate with each other via radio. Hospitals have been renamed and moved to different locations. And sandbags have replaced windows as hospitals prepare for the next air assault.

And doctors' concerns are warranted. According to a recent report by Physicians for Human Rights, there were 150 attacks on 124 different medical facilities between March, 2011, and March 31, 2014. Syrian Government forces were responsible for 90% of the attacks on facilities in the country—and most were targeted. The report also found that as of the end of April this year, 468 medial personnel had been killed since the beginning of the conflict, including 157 doctors and 94 nurses. But those figures are sadly outdated, with the death of several more doctors amid the relentless barrel bombing campaign....

 

[Casually Red]

I am not an expert on military ordnance you'll have to ask one of the military or ex-military types on here for a nuanced opinion on a bomb or missile strike. But one thing I will surmise, if the market was hit directly there may well be little or nothing left in the way of human remains

So they just disappeared then...almost as idiotic as a smiley . you plainly haven't a fucking clue what you're talking about and weren't even reading the Reuters reports inthe links that talks of over 100 being buried , or looking at any pictures of the casualties . were the remains are stacked up in rows . All intact . It would require a mini atomic device to completely vaporise a market full of people .

 

[teqniq]

So no opinion on the doctors claims then?

 

[Casually Red]

You know the ones that said hospitals are being deliberately targeted that you seem to be having some trouble offering an opinion on. Incidentally this is not the first time this has happened, the same thing has happened in Aleppo and the source is the same, Doctors without borders.

and this from 2014 from The Lancet

Well the reason I'm taking my time to form an opinion on your links is that I've learned by now it's quite sensible to have a healthy distrust of the links you post . You seem to be saying one minute the Syrian army are deliberately targeting hospitals...but doing it with supposedly highly inaccurate barrel bombs . But nevermind .
That lancet article strikes me as quite disingenuous throughout . Not least because despite there being very heavy fighting in Alleppo and the place being overrun by islamic nutters armed with allsorts it gives the distinct impression everyone injured there is a victim of the army . Which I find utterly ludicrous .
It's main source also happens to be this outfit , physicians for human rights . Who are active supporters of western regime change and backed by neo cons like John McCain .
some info on them here

https://syria360.wordpress.com/2012...ights-join-the-ranks-of-pro-imperialist-ngos/

So that article is blaming the Syrian government for being unable to supply services and equipment to a terrorist held district . And who's main source just happens to be an outfit campaigning for an Iraq type sanctions regime ....a move that resulted in genocide and a half a million dead kids ...which would reduce the Syrian governments ability to provide doctors and medicine even further .

And tbh I find the emotive language and disingenuous style throughout the article as highly dubious . It strikes me as tailored for consumption.

So no , I'm not impressed merely by an article being in the lancet any more than impressed at one being on the BBC or Guardian .

 

[teqniq]

Enjoy your cognitive dissonance

 

[Casually Red]

Big words now

 

[teqniq]

I am at the pub now hence the short reply. However you seem to be unwilling or incapable of coming to terms with the fact that atrocities have been committed by all sides.

 

[Casually Red]

Utter nonsense . Itd be the first time in the history of war that ever happened .I'm disagreeing with your links because they're ropey and one sided as fuck.

 

[teqniq]

The Lancet? Lol

 

[Casually Red]

The Lancet? Lol

Yes, the lancet article was one sided, disingenuous and ropey as fuck . It was a propaganda piece throughout .
It's primary source was the PHR , who demand along with John MCCain and Joe Lieberman that Syria comes under an enhanced sanctions regime until it gets rid of its ballistic missiles...perfectly legal conventional weapons any state is entitled to possess ...and ceases support for Palestinian and Lebanese resistance against Zionist occupation . While not calling for any sanctions to be applied against the zionists . What the fuck business is it of Doctors in Washington DC if Syria supports Palestine and Lebanon ? What is that shit about ?
These type of sanctions killed half a million children in Iraq . And these are fucking doctors calling for it in Syria in the full knowledge of what it will bring ? Something the hallowed Lancet doesn't bother pointing out to its readership in this case .

So yeah, the Lancet . LO fucking L

 

[frogwoman]

http://www.thenation.com/article/th...-isis-is-huge-why-isnt-the-press-covering-it/

The civilian toll from the US war against ISIS is huge. Why isnt the press covering it?

Fairly depressing article here

 

[teqniq]

Yes, the lancet article was one sided, disingenuous and ropey as fuck . It was a propaganda piece throughout .
It's primary source was the PHR , who demand along with John MCCain and Joe Lieberman that Syria comes under an enhanced sanctions regime until it gets rid of its ballistic missiles...perfectly legal conventional weapons any state is entitled to possess ...and ceases support for Palestinian and Lebanese resistance against Zionist occupation . While not calling for any sanctions to be applied against the zionists . What the fuck business is it of Doctors in Washington DC if Syria supports Palestine and Lebanon ? What is that shit about ?
These type of sanctions killed half a million children in Iraq . And these are fucking doctors calling for it in Syria in the full knowledge of what it will bring ? Something the hallowed Lancet doesn't bother pointing out to its readership in this case .

So yeah, the Lancet . LO fucking L

You are a complete fool and as I've said before, not to be taken seriously.

 

[Casually Red]

Dear me you really don't like to be contradicted .

You'll squeam and squeam if I'm not careful

 

[frogwoman]

Regime airstrikes kills 20 civilians across E#Ghouta today in #Douma, Hamouriah & Saqba +80 wounded Syria v @FSATruth

 

[Casually Red]

According to the FSA

FSATruth..no less .

And I get shit for linking to RT

 

[agricola]

http://www.thenation.com/article/th...-isis-is-huge-why-isnt-the-press-covering-it/

The civilian toll from the US war against ISIS is huge. Why isnt the press covering it?

Fairly depressing article here

Them beheading any Western hacks that they get their hands on is probably a part of it.

 

[frogwoman]

Them beheading any Western hacks that they get their hands on is probably a part of it.

Well yeah, exactly. And very little news is coming out apart from what IS states in its propaganda as they forbid ordinary civilians from using the internet. There has been no electricity in Raqqa for 9 days according to Raqqa SL while the daeshbags carry on using electricity and the internet, they're also living in areas of town which aren't being targeted by airstrikes to the same extent.

 

[rekil]

Regime airstrikes kills 20 civilians across E#Ghouta today in #Douma, Hamouriah & Saqba +80 wounded Syria v @FSATruth

Man and child survivors being dug out of rubble.

Spoiler

 

[westcoast1]

Syria is a living hell.

 

[teqniq]

Retired general: Egypt
arming Syria regime

Syrian refugee crisis strains Jordan's water supply

 

[frogwoman]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mouaffaq-nyrabia/isis-no-fly-zone_b_8015784.html

BRUSSELS -- U.S.-led anti-ISIS airstrikes aren't working. When they began one year ago, many Syrians, including myself, thought they would be a step towards ending the horrors in Syria. We thought they would root out ISIS. We thought they would bring an end to Syrian President Bashar Assad's brutality. But today, ISIS continues to win new ground across Syria while Assad's forces continue to brutally murder civilians. If the U.S. and its allies don't correct course soon, there is a risk that only a costly and deadly full-scale military intervention will defeat ISIS.

The U.S.-led coalition is too narrowly focused on an ISIS-only strategy. Assad's brutality against his own people is used as a recruiting tool for ISIS, which some see as an alternative to or protection from Assad.

While the rest of the world is focused on ISIS, the reality is that Assad is killingmany more civilians. According to the Violations Documentation Center, the leading killer of Syrian civilians this year has been barrel bombs and chlorine gas dropped from Assad's helicopters. And the regime is continually intensifying their use, as seen in the recent brutal bombing of a marketplace in Douma that killed more than 100 civilians.

 

[Casually Red]

Reports that use the SOHR as a source routinely omit the quite pertinent detail that they routinely classify armed insurgents who die in battle as civilians , for reasons best known to themselves . And have done since the start of the conflict .

Furthermore the other source in that report , the Syrian Violations Documentation centre is basically a creation of the US state department and the British foreign office, ie the British intelligence services .

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...om-an-innocuous-office-block-in-Istanbul.html

They had imported all manner of communication equipment in large quantities and been joined in networks before the protests even began . A classic example of a rent a revolution mob, supported by the western powers . They're paid mouthpieces of western intelligence services and nothing less . Add as much salt to their propaganda as you like .

 

[TomUS]

Apparently the Assads & the Kims are quite close. Not many heroes in this conflict.

Government inaugurates park in Damascus to honour North Korea's founding father Kim Il-sung.
Syria's embattled government has inaugurated a park in Damascus, which was named after North Korea's founding father Kim Il-sung.

The street adjacent to the park is also named for Kim and stretches for one kilometre.

Syrian state news agency reported on Monday that the ceremony was held to mark the 70th anniversary of forming the Workers' Party of Korea (WPK).

The opening ceremony......was attended by deputy Foreign Minister Faisal Mikdad.

He called Kim "a historic ruler and leader, famous for his struggle to liberate and build his country".

"For this reason, he deserves to be honoured in Syria," Mikdad said.

North Korea's ambassador to Syria Jang Myong said the park was "an expression of the respect and love that Syria, as a party, a government, and a people have for the great leader Kim Il-sung".

Syria names park in capital after N Korea founder

 

[frogwoman]

Petraeus: Use Al Qaeda Fighters to Beat ISIS

Oh great! This will end well

Members of al Qaeda’s branch in Syria have a surprising advocate in the corridors of American power: retired Army general and former CIA Director David Petraeus.

The former commander of U.S. forces in Iraq and Afghanistan has been quietly urging U.S. officials to consider using so-called moderate members of al Qaeda’s Nusra Front to fight ISIS in Syria, four sources familiar with the conversations, including one person who spoke to Petraeus directly, told The Daily Beast.

FFS

they have learnt nothing. Nothing

How precisely the U.S. would separate moderate fighters from core members and leaders of al Nusra is unclear, and Petraeus has yet to fully detail any recommendations he might have.

Lol.

 

[Pickman's model]

Petraeus: Use Al Qaeda Fighters to Beat ISIS

Oh great! This will end well



FFS

they have learnt nothing. Nothing



Lol.

i hope this was just something said late one night when he was 'tired and emotional'

 

[frogwoman]

Theres also the fact that if the USA is seen to be publically helping al nus won't a lot of them go to isis anyway?

Its like voting NF to keep out the BNP

 

[teqniq]

 

[elbows]

FFS

they have learnt nothing. Nothing

Well we have to wait and see whether they go down that route in order to judge.

Regardless of what they actually do, I think one of many reasons why people rolled their eyeballs when the 'war on terror' was framed as such is that we knew things would go in cycles and there would be moments where the label and enemy scene would be turned on its head. It was especially hard to miss since perceived 'blowback' from Afghan 'freedom fighters' and funding from 'allies' in the region were a part of Afghanistan, al Qaeda, bin Laden back-story.

I'm not sure they can do it overtly yet though. If they can't project power via boots on the ground because of domestic political pressures, then I'm not convinced domestic politics will allow them to overtly gang up with Sunni Islamist fighters either. Especially when election cycles are in effect. Just take for example the ammunition Republicans still think they've got over the likes of Clinton because of the Benghazi US ambassador death.

They could still try it if they manage to get both sides of the political elite to agree behind closed doors. But then they have to rely on their careful labelling tactics to sneak past the wider public (al Qaeda & IS the strong bogeyman brands where all the hate is supposed to be directed) and hope they can get people to buy into the idea of moderate islamist fighters.

And now a musical interlude.

 

[rekil]

Pics from Douma. V.graphic etc. (Or fake if you're the official board loon)

Bassam Khabieh (@BassamKhabieh) on Twitter
Abd Doumany (@AbdDoumany) on Twitter