Amanda Knox Is Innocent

[The Pale King]

I don't really think it is. I think they had a theory that there were multiple attackers from the start, which they tried to prove might have been the case, but that there was no real evidence for it (I think besides the bra strap, which later got thrown out as evidence, there wasn't really anything else to point to anyone else being there during the crime). Of course, there's no real evidence against it. Just because you don't find anyone else's dna or footprints or clothing fibers, etc, doesn't mean there wasn't anyone else there. But that's where it gets into farce territory, imo. Theoretically, there could be any number of people at any murder.

No.

The bra clasp was never 'thrown out' as evidence afaik.

That there were multiple attackers is clear from the physical evidence. Judge Massei says:

"This disproportion is all the more serious and inexplicable if one considers Meredith's physical and personality characteristics recalled above. It seems inevitable that it must be considered that the criminal action was carried out by several people acting together against Meredith, who, strongly limited in her movements, could not defend herself in any way nor shield herself with her hands in order to avoid a vital part of her body (the neck) being repeatedly struck."

...in other words the wounds that killed Meredith Kercher could not have been inflicted by one person alone.

 

[Miss Caphat]

to clarify, under US law, you can appeal a guilty verdict. If you are then found not guilty, you can't be tried again.

 

[Belushi]

so, (many of) you guys actually still believe Knox had something to do with this? wow.

If you're surprised at that don't look at any Italian forums!

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

The UK does. A knee-jerk reaction to botched prosecutions brought in by the last govt and a thoroughly bad thing, imo.

Doreen Lawrence would disagree.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

to clarify, under US law, you can appeal a guilty verdict. If you are then found not guilty, you can't be tried again.

Does anyone get found not guilty in the US?

 

[littlebabyjesus]

to clarify, under US law, you can appeal a guilty verdict. If you are then found not guilty, you can't be tried again.

That was also the case in the UK up to a few years ago, but now is not. It clearly isn't the case in Italy. I'm guessing the US will not extradite.

 

[maya]

Does anyone get found not guilty in the US?

If they have lots of money for the right lawyers...

 

[Miss Caphat]

No.

The bra clasp was never 'thrown out' as evidence afaik.

That there were multiple attackers is clear from the physical evidence. Judge Massei says:

"This disproportion is all the more serious and inexplicable if one considers Meredith's physical and personality characteristics recalled above. It seems inevitable that it must be considered that the criminal action was carried out by several people acting together against Meredith, who, strongly limited in her movements, could not defend herself in any way nor shield herself with her hands in order to avoid a vital part of her body (the neck) being repeatedly struck."

...in other words the wounds that killed Meredith Kercher could not have been inflicted by one person alone.

oh dear god, I really have better things to do with my time than get into all this. go do some research on the dna evidence findings post 2009 etc, etc.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Doreen Lawrence would disagree.

I have enormous sympathy for Doreen Lawrence (and no sympathy whatever for the two men now in jail - they're guilty, fuck them). However, there is a reason why the parents of murder victims don't get to make the rules of prosecution. There are wider questions to do with the extent of state power over individuals.

 

[Belushi]

This, the more I read about this case the more I became convinced of the innocence of Sollecito and Knox.

I'm still of this opinion tbh. When I read around the case a lot of the things the armchair columbo's claim prove the pairs guilt are much less cut and dried.

 

[Pickman's model]

I have enormous sympathy for Doreen Lawrence. However, there is a reason why the parents of murder victims don't get to make the rules of prosecution.

they're not mps.

 

[The Pale King]

That was also the case in the UK up to a few years ago, but now is not. It clearly isn't the case in Italy. I'm guessing the US will not extradite.

I don't see why thy wouldn't.

 

[stupid dogbot]

Because her folks are rich as hell?

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

I have enormous sympathy for Doreen Lawrence. However, there is a reason why the parents of murder victims don't get to make the rules of prosecution.

So you're unhappy that two of Stephen Lawrence's murderers are in prison?

 

[Pickman's model]

So you're unhappy that two of Stephen Lawrence's murder's are in prison?

murderers.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I don't see why thy wouldn't.

Protection of the US constitution? That's a guess, but the US has a rule over double jeopardy, so I doubt they would extradite for a conviction that breaks that rule.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

murderers.

PHONE

 

[littlebabyjesus]

So you're unhappy that two of Stephen Lawrence's murder's are in prison?

No. But there are wider issues here.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

No. But there are wider issues here.

Such as?

 

[The Pale King]

Protection of the US constitution? That's a guess, but the US has a rule over double jeopardy, so I doubt they would extradite for a conviction that breaks that rule.

I don't think it does break this rule though. It's an appeal, part of the same process - not a retrial. If what you say is true then the U.S could not have an extradition treaty with Italy.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I don't think it does break this rule though. It's an appeal, part of the same process - not a retrial. If what you say is true then the U.S could not have an extradition treaty with Italy.

Yeah they could. They just wouldn't automatically hand someone over. AFAIK, the US constitution trumps extradition for a US citizen.

 

[Belushi]

Protection of the US constitution? That's a guess, but the US has a rule over double jeopardy, so I doubt they would extradite for a conviction that breaks that rule.

Doesn't the final decision sit with John Kerry? In which case there's no way I can see the Obama administration extraditing Knox to Italy and handing so much political ammunition to their opponents.

 

[The Pale King]

oh dear god, I really have better things to do with my time than get into all this. go do some research on the dna evidence findings post 2009 etc, etc.

How did Sollecito's DNA get on the bra clasp? You think the Italian police planted the evidence? There's no other explanation.

He was there, he is guilty.

 

[phildwyer]

Because her folks are rich as hell?

No they are not.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Doesn't the final decision sit with John Kerry? In which case there's no way I can see the Obama administration extraditing Knox to Italy and handing so much political ammunition to their opponents.

Yeah, hard to see it happening. I do know that US extradition laws have protections built in. One of the disgraceful aspects of the extradition treaty signed by Blair with the US is that it is unequal - we don't have any formal protection at all from UK law to prevent extradition (Garry McKinnon was only saved by the personal intervention of the Home Sec), while US citizens still have the protection of their constitutional rights.

 

[The Pale King]

Yeah they could. They just wouldn't automatically hand someone over. AFAIK, the US constitution trumps extradition for a US citizen.

Sure, but the provision against double jeopardy does not apply here, because the appeal was part of the same judicial process, not a new trial.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Sure, but the provision against double jeopardy does not apply here, because the appeal was part of the same judicial process, not a new trial.

I guess that would be a point to argue in court. I reckon you could exploit the grey areas that lie between the Italian system and the US.

 

[Wilf]

oh dear god, I really have better things to do with my time than get into all this. go do some research on the dna evidence findings post 2009 etc, etc.

Hold on a minute, you've joined in a discussion, you are trying to make a case - then when you get somebody disagreeing, you want them to do the legwork to prove themselves wrong?

 

[phildwyer]

Because that's what the court established.

You weren't so keen to accept the Mark Duggan verdict.

Is this a selective faith in the world's judicial systems or what?

 

[The Pale King]

You weren't so keen to accept the Mark Duggan verdict.

Is this a selective faith in the world's judicial systems or what?

I don't believe the two judicial processes can be meaningfully compared.