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Amanda Knox Is Innocent

Wilf said:
Hold on a minute, you've joined in a discussion, you are trying to make a case - then when you get somebody disagreeing, you want them to do the legwork to prove themselves wrong?
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I'm not trying to make a case. I originally asked why some people here still believed in the guilty verdict.
And I really, really have no interest in rehashing all of this. And I do have a job, which I have to leave for in half an hour.
 
Miss Caphat said:
I'm not trying to make a case. I originally asked why some people here still believed in the guilty verdict.
And I really, really have no interest in rehashing all of this. And I do have a job, which I have to leave for in half an hour.
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That's fine, we're all allowed our brief moments away from urban! It's just it did sound a bit 'flouncy'
 
Belushi said:
I'm still of this opinion tbh. When I read around the case a lot of the things the armchair columbo's claim prove the pairs guilt are much less cut and dried.
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I'm not really qualified to judge on things like DNA on bra clasps but the fact that Amanda Knox, in her first statement to the police, tried to put the blame on a totally innocent man, speaks volumes to me.
 
Whether it be the dna, the wider forensics, the 'break in', the timelines, all of it, there seems to be so much indicating they were 'involved'. 'Involved' doesn't necessarily mean they 'murdered' and the Italian police/prosecution have done a great job of providing them with reasonable doubt. There might even be enough reasonable doubt to rightly find them not guilty, but I can't see much in this that allows anyone to see them as genuinely innocent, as in uninvolved, non-participants. From my entirely passive, media reading take on all this, best I can given them is a 'not proven'.
 
Miss Caphat said:
I don't really think it is. I think they had a theory that there were multiple attackers from the start, which they tried to prove might have been the case, but that there was no real evidence for it (I think besides the bra strap, which later got thrown out as evidence, there wasn't really anything else to point to anyone else being there during the crime). Of course, there's no real evidence against it. Just because you don't find anyone else's dna or footprints or clothing fibers, etc, doesn't mean there wasn't anyone else there. But that's where it gets into farce territory, imo. Theoretically, there could be any number of people at any murder.
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Historically in miscarriage of justice cases like this a number of factors always exist. First there is public outrage and thus pressure on police. Police quickly happen on a suspect. A seemingly plausible theory of what happened develops. A motive imagined. The hunt is then on for the appropriate evidence. Evidence that conflicts with the theory will be ignored or discarded. They may be a confession later retracted. 'Independent' witnesses such as fellow inmates will come forward with some tasty nugget or other. But if anomalies subsequently appear in the prosecution case the harder they dig in, because ultimately once a conviction is secured it is not only the 'guilty' who are on trial.
 
Awesome Wells said:
I have no idea whether or not she's innocent. Admittedly I haven't been following this whole bizzare and tragic affair, but I have no idea how it's obvious?
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The evidence would suggest they are guilty of something? Mind having Fox news and vice president of Macy's onside helps her case? No real mention of the other person involved? Is that because he is of the other gender and as such not news worthy?
 
Pickman's model said:
weak opinions all round then
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Not so much weak as non-existent. Having an opinion on something I don't know the facts about is a luxury a lot of people allow themselves, but which I don't think I care for.

My main feeling about this case is sadness. Apart from the obvious (someone got killed), my sadness is that, from where I'm sitting, the Italian criminal justice system seemed to undermine the prospect of finding out the facts, rather than going all-out for convictions, from the very start. I think there is little hope of our (or more importantly Meredith Kercher's family) ever knowing truly what happened, and it seems to me that a lot of the reason for that was the gung-ho and rather heavy-handed approach the investigating authorities took.
 
Joe Reilly said:
You think it beyond them?
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I do not believe that the Italian police planted Rafael Sollecito's DNA on Meredith Kercher's bra clasp. Nor do I believe they planted Knox's DNA on the murder weapon recovered from Sollecito's kitchen drawer. Nor do I believe they planted Knox's blood mixed with Meredith Kercher's in the bathroom they shared.

You believe all these things?
 
Miss Caphat said:
because she was found not guilty in the first trial, and we have laws against trying someone more than once for the same crime. so, it would be similar to extraditing someone to another country, so that they could receive the death penalty for adultery committed in that country, or something. It's against our moral/legal code, and it's not going to happen.
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She's being tried under Italian not US law.
 
Joe Reilly said:
Historically in miscarriage of justice cases like this a number of factors always exist. First there is public outrage and thus pressure on police. Police quickly happen on a suspect. A seemingly plausible theory of what happened develops. A motive imagined. The hunt is then on for the appropriate evidence. Evidence that conflicts with the theory will be ignored or discarded. They may be a confession later retracted. 'Independent' witnesses such as fellow inmates will come forward with some tasty nugget or other. But if anomalies subsequently appear in the prosecution case the harder they dig in, because ultimately once a conviction is secured it is not only the 'guilty' who are on trial.
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Yet another reason why the police should never publically identify suspects halfway through an investigation.
 
In Bloomfield v. Gengler it was found that even though the proceedings that resulted in the conviction would have been barred in the United States because of double jeopardy, this was irrelevant to the certification of the extradition request. These procedural rights only apply to criminal prosecutions and extradition is not considered a criminal prosecution.

I think avoiding extradition based on legal arguments about double jeopardy will be very difficult for Knox. Probably her best hope is to apply political pressure or other extra-legal pressure of some sort.
 
littlebabyjesus said:
American citizens are still protected by the US constitution with extradition requests. US law is relevant here if she is to be extradited.
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You think they're likely to refuse to extradite someone convicted of murder?
 
Citizen66 said:
You think they're likely to refuse to extradite someone convicted of murder?
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I don't know. Quite possibly. It does appear that this double jeopardy argument has been tried in court and failed (although that's not a guarantee that it will fail again), but then it will come down to a political judgement by the government.
 
I have no love for Alan Dershowitz, but his opinion carries weight:

Harvard Law Professor Alan Dershowitz said that if the supreme court in Italy turns down her appeal, the United States will have little choice but to extradite her.
'The United States seeks extradition of more people than any country in the world. We’re trying to get NSA leaker Edward Snowden back and we’re not going to extradite someone convicted of murder?' he told NBC News.
Professor Dershowitz doubted that even double jeopardy will protect Knox because she was initially found guilty and her acquittal was heard at an intermediate appeals level.
'If that happened in the U.S., it wouldn't be double jeopardy,' he said.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2549284/Sister-murdered-British-student-Meredith-Kercher-admits-family-never-know-happened-night-Knox-Sollecito-guilty-verdicts-reinstated.html#ixzz2rzTpz6lF
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
 
A political judgement, then. I don't have a strong opinion really on this case, but that thing 'justice' appears to have disappeared down the drain a while ago.
 
The Pale King said:
I do not believe that the Italian police planted Rafael Sollecito's DNA on Meredith Kercher's bra clasp. Nor do I believe they planted Knox's DNA on the murder weapon recovered from Sollecito's kitchen drawer. Nor do I believe they planted Knox's blood mixed with Meredith Kercher's in the bathroom they shared.

You believe all these things?
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'An appalling vista...'
 
Last edited:
marshall said:
That's pretty damning, but why?
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I think this is why:

"Amanda Knox has admitted on her personal blog for the first time that she had previously been involved in a ‘staged robbery’ during her time at the University of Washington. She admitted that the hazing prank, played on her flat-mates at the University of Washington, involved messing up the flat and hiding things to make it appear as if items had been stolen. Knox used "mutual friends" of her other housemates to help fake the burglary in her own premises. She acknowledges that it caused "distress" to her housemates and she and her accomplices had to apologise for the act. She does not disclose, however, what exactly happened or the full role of the "mutual friends"."

...I think she went for a repeat performance in Perugia, and it went too far this time. And Meredith Kercher's screams had to be silenced.
 
Pale King, spotted in Perugia earlier today...

images
 
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