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A thank you to Brexiteers.

I think it's perfectly acceptable to point out how grossly the tories have fucked Brexit up. That's what I think I've mainly been seeing.
It's not just acceptable. It's fucking necessary. Brexit wasn't some natural disaster. It's not Covid19. It's a choice. Doing it this way is a choice. They need to be held to account for every Brexit-related fuck-up and shit consequence.
 
The issue in Germany is that they have apparently (so far) seen seven incidences of cerebral venous sinus thrombosis in ~1.6 million vaccinees. This is several times the general population background rate, hence the precautionary suspension.

Again, zero sum thinking - how many Covid serious hospitalisations/deaths do they think haven't happened because of those 1.6m vaccinations?

If they had a) a surfeit of other vaccines lying around to replace the AZ shot, and b) hadn't spent the last 2 months stoking the anti-vax Crowd, then this wouldn't be particularly problematic, but heh, guess what...
 
Again, zero sum thinking - how many Covid serious hospitalisations/deaths do they think haven't happened because of those 1.6m vaccinations?

If they had a) a surfeit of other vaccines lying around to replace the AZ shot, and b) hadn't spent the last 2 months stoking the anti-vax Crowd, then this wouldn't be particularly problematic, but heh, guess what...
It's a question of people having an informed choice, though, no? If you're given a vaccine, you should be told that there is a small elevated risk of blood clots before you're given it, if there is one, not find out after. This reinforces fears that the vaccines have been rushed.

I generally agree, btw, that it's better to just keep jabbing with this level of evidence. I'm up for my jab soon and I'll take whichever one I'm offered. But I can also see the case for more caution.

tbh one of the reasons I'm ok with the UK's more cavalier attitude is because they've fucked everything else up so badly. We might not feel such urgency if we weren't just coming out of a massive second wave and prolonged lockdown. News from Italy the other day reinforced that feeling. They were announcing a new lockdown, closing schools, restaurants and museums. My first reaction was 'blimey, restaurants and museums were open in Italy'.
 
I've been thinking about this whole Brexit thing, and I've come to the conclusion that maybe it's time people stopped fucking moaning about it? It happened... deal with it. Whining isn't going to change anything, it's just going to make you look like a whining football fanatic, whose team lost an important game 10 years ago, and they're still fucking whining about it. Get over it, FFS, and if you can't live without the EU, move to somewhere that's still in the EU, but all this crying is embarrassing.

Exactly, if they don't like it, leave.

They should be grateful, having defeated the tyranny of the EU, but no, the miserable self loathers are still pining for the banana straightening bureaucrats.
 
Exactly, if they don't like it, leave.

They should be grateful, having defeated the tyranny of the EU, but no, the miserable self loathers are still pining for the banana straightening bureaucrats.
No, if they don't like it, do something about it. If they're not prepared to do anything about it, then feel free to leave.
But doing something about anything doesn't seem to be within the realms of most people. They'd rather whine about it on internet forums.
Edit: I was dead against Brexit, but I decided to leave the UK before this shit hit the fan.
 
No, if they don't like it, do something about it. If they're not prepared to do anything about it, then feel free to leave.
But doing something about anything doesn't seem to be within the realms of most people. They'd rather whine about it on internet forums.
Edit: I was dead against Brexit, but I decided to leave the UK before this shit hit the fan.

Mmm. Just dawned on me that it's probably a bit difficult to physically leave a lot of countries currently.

But yeah, in general, if people aren't happy with the country they live in, they should try and change it.

Apart from calling for the results to be overturned. That never goes down well.

No to another referendum.

Apart from Scotland because they need to leave the tyranny of the UK.

As do the 6 Counties.
 
Mmm. Just dawned on me that it's probably a bit difficult to physically leave a lot of countries currently.

But yeah, in general, if people aren't happy with the country they live in, they should try and change it.

Apart from calling for the results to be overturned. That never goes down well.

No to another referendum.

Apart from Scotland because they need to leave the tyranny of the UK.

As do the 6 Counties.
I don't necessarily agree with the outcome of the Brexit vote but it happened. If you're (not you, anybody) now living in a state you don't wish to be in, either change it or leave the state. I do realise that moving between places isn't easy right now but it soon will be, and anybody who doesn't wish to live in a state that isn't governed by EU rules should leave. It's a shite state of affairs but it's what it is.
 
I don't necessarily agree with the outcome of the Brexit vote but it happened. If you're (not you, anybody) now living in a state you don't wish to be in, either change it or leave the state. I do realise that moving between places isn't easy right now but it soon will be, and anybody who doesn't wish to live in a state that isn't governed by EU rules should leave. It's a shite state of affairs but it's what it is.

Indeed. Guess at the same time, might be different for some to change their circumstances (say in a job where they're being exploited) because they are not sure of their status in the country. Like, some people might not have a voice or be fearful of speaking out.
 
Indeed. Guess at the same time, might be different for some to change their circumstances (say in a job where they're being exploited) because they are not sure of their status in the country. Like, some people might not have a voice or be fearful of speaking out.
Absolutely, but whining about the effects of Brexit, so long after it's happened, is of no use to anybody. Shit or get off the pot. There's no point complaining that you missed the bus. Either get the next one or don't.
Brexit is something that happened. I'm still buying stuff from people in the UK who dealt with it. Those who aren't dealing with it are the people who are facing problems. Granted, I'm now paying more for some of the things I buy, but it's a consequence of Brexit, and one I have to deal with, as does everyone involved.
It really is a shite state of affairs but it has happened and we have to deal with it as adults, and all the whining in the world won't change what's happened.
 
Difficult to leave the UK now without a fair bit of money - would've been much easier before/without Brexit. Just as things are getting worse here.
You can leave the UK with whatever you have in your pocket after forking out for covid tests but you can only stay for the permitted period. After that you need a residency then you have to have some proof of income, some states pitch it at the level of unemployment benefit and others higher. Portugal, where I am has always had a requirement for residency after the initial period expires. Tbh covid has had as big or even bigger impact, jobs are scarce especially with the collapse of the tourist industry and the restrictions on hospitality, and with wages, it's going to be a race to the bottom.
 
You can leave the UK with whatever you have in your pocket after forking out for covid tests but you can only stay for the permitted period. After that you need a residency then you have to have some proof of income, some states pitch it at the level of unemployment benefit and others higher. Portugal, where I am has always had a requirement for residency after the initial period expires. Tbh covid has had as big or even bigger impact, jobs are scarce especially with the collapse of the tourist industry and the restrictions on hospitality, and with wages, it's going to be a race to the bottom.
Unfortunately, it's going to be a race to the bottom no matter where you reside. The simple fact is that this is a direct result of Covid. Unfortunately, some people would have you believe it's a result of Brexit.
 
I've been thinking about this whole Brexit thing, and I've come to the conclusion that maybe it's time people stopped fucking moaning about it? It happened... deal with it. Whining isn't going to change anything, it's just going to make you look like a whining football fanatic, whose team lost an important game 10 years ago, and they're still fucking whining about it. Get over it, FFS, and if you can't live without the EU, move to somewhere that's still in the EU, but all this crying is embarrassing.
So people who have been negatively effected by brexit (such as losing their jobs) should just quit whining? By the same 'logic' people suffering from the effects of austerity should just 'quit whining' too and 'get over it'.

I guess we all need to just 'man up' and thicken our skin and everything will sort itself out.

Nice take.
 
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So people who have been effected by brexit (such as losing their jobs) should just quit whining? By the same 'logic' people suffering from the effects of austerity should just 'quit whining' too and 'get over it'.

I guess we all need to just 'man up' and thicken our skin and everything will sort itself out.

Nice take.
Have you lost your job due to Brexit? If you have, you have my utmost sympathy, but that wasn't my point, as you're well aware, so please feel free to take your straw man elsewhere.
 
Have you lost your job due to Brexit? If you have, you have my utmost sympathy, but that wasn't my point, as you're well aware, so please feel free to take your straw man elsewhere.
I don't work due to health problems. Which means I'm dependent on benefits, and therefore am a sitting duck for the coming round of austerity caused by brexit and the pandemic.

I don't expect you to give a shit though. It doesn't matter if I haven't lost a job due to brexit because other people have and apparently we should all just man-up and get over it.

Even if I had a job my life would no doubt be shit, and brexit would only make that situation worse.
 
I don't work due to health problems. Which means I'm dependent on benefits, and therefore am a sitting duck for the coming round of austerity caused by brexit and the pandemic.

I don't expect you to give a shit though
I give lots of shits. What would you like me to do about the situation? Do you think that whining about it will change anything?
 
I don't work due to health problems. Which means I'm dependent on benefits, and therefore am a sitting duck for the coming round of austerity caused by brexit and the pandemic.

I don't expect you to give a shit though. It doesn't matter if I haven't lost a job due to brexit because other people have and apparently we should all just man-up and get over it.

Even if I had a job my life would no doubt be shit, and brexit would only make that situation worse.
Sorry, I'm struggling to keep up with your edits...
Have you or do you know of anyone who has lost their job as a direct result of Brexit?
 
No, if they don't like it, do something about it. If they're not prepared to do anything about it, then feel free to leave.
But doing something about anything doesn't seem to be within the realms of most people. They'd rather whine about it on internet forums.
Edit: I was dead against Brexit, but I decided to leave the UK before this shit hit the fan.
What sort of things should we do?
 
What sort of things should we do?

Stop making yourself look like political dog vommit. Accept that it's happened, that it's not going to be reversed anytime soon. accept that not everyone thinks the same way you do in terms of cost/benefit, and that therefore they aren't going to be persuaded however much analysis you do on that basis. Stop walking around with a face like a slapped arse.

Be honest about the aspects of the EU that you aren't so keen on, be honest about how likely they are to change.

Get rid of this 'is it worth it?' mindset. You may think that this or that customs fee, or whatever physical cost of brexit is a catastrophic event, but to someone who thinks of brexit in terms of their identity, you look like someone who completely missed the whole point of the thing.

Learn. Listen. Learn. Humble pie. Listen. Learn.
 
I've also lost my freedom of movement to go anywhere in the EU to work, which was an essential part of my finding opportunities for jobs.

My only hope to continue my lifestyle is to rescind my British citizenship and apply for Spanish, which is what I shall do next year when I am eligible.
But you’ve lost your job in Spain as a result of Brexit?
 
Stop making yourself look like political dog vommit. Accept that it's happened, that it's not going to be reversed anytime soon. accept that not everyone thinks the same way you do in terms of cost/benefit, and that therefore they aren't going to be persuaded however much analysis you do on that basis. Stop walking around with a face like a slapped arse.

Be honest about the aspects of the EU that you aren't so keen on, be honest about how likely they are to change.

Get rid of this 'is it worth it?' mindset. You may think that this or that customs fee, or whatever physical cost of brexit is a catastrophic event, but to someone who thinks of brexit in terms of their identity, you look like someone who completely missed the whole point of the thing.

Learn. Listen. Learn. Humble pie. Listen. Learn.

Choose your future. Choose life.
 
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