FridgeMagnet
Administrator
Oh and that's fucking hilarious, well done.
A Girl Called Jack... time for action?
- Thread starter LiamO
- Start date
This. the '...' were because 'delicious' is
a) a loaded, deeply subjective word - for example just look at the emotionally-laden reminiscences of childhood comfort foods above (mosyt of which would get a resounding yeeuch from kids of today.
b) a moveable feast - what was 'delicious' 30 years ago might be considered staid now
c) a superlative - I never said food shouldn't be tasty, did I?
d) by it's nature 'delicious' needs to be occasional... otherwise the word loses it's use as a superlative
Perhaps saying " Why should all food be 'delicious'?" might have been a wiser choice of words. But nobody asked for clarification, did they? They just leapt right on in calling me a 'joyless fucker', 'puritan', 'stalinist' etc etc.Frankly I could not be arsed 'defending' a position some people had chosen to ascribe to me, for reasons best known to themselves... when I had said no such thing. Eg the nonsense about underpants? WTF? That was just too ridiulous IMO
Nice one for explaining.
I can more see where you're at now.Talk of underpants is never nonsense though.
Fair play to you Bama.
I'll let someone else answer your post. But this is a brilliant example of how determined we can all be to keep such a firm grasp of our manacles. You're doing exactly what happened on the last thread (and every fucking thread on Urban)... just scouring things looking for something, anything, that we can magnify to angrily dismiss the messenger.
I say this as someone who has spent most of my life doing likewise. But I'm tired of it now.
It's mostly about perception AFAICS as I saiod in the Op ... which seems to have registered with very few.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
ok. I see no reason to doubt that she was in that position, with her benefits fucked and nowhere to turn. It does seem that this was her position and she is writing about what she did in that position. I don't know how long it lasted or what other options were available to her.
I can speak about my own position years ago when I was rather fucked. I had the option of going to my parents for help. They would have helped me - I could simply have turned up at their door and they would have taken me in, but for me at that time, taking that option would have meant failure. The fact that I had that option meant I hadn't in any sense hit rock-bottom, though, as there was an escape there for me if I wanted it, however much I didn't want to use it at the time. I don't know if her position was similar - one of pride stopping her from asking for help from those she knew that could give it.
But even if it was only pride stopping her from seeking help where that help existed, she still went through this. I have no problem with her writing about it, and I don't know to what extent she acknowledges that others don't have the options that she had to get herself out of that position.
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
And apparently had to sell off all her stuff to pay bills. (But was apparently part of the media elite even then, getting a story in the Essex Enquirer!)
I wasn't trying to be funny. Rock bottom (AFAIC) is having to sell yourself. No joke at all. Obviously you've never been there and you don't know anyone who has. Honest to god though, the last thing I was trying to do was take the piss. I was just saying, Jack clearly hasn't hit the rocky bottom. Or even come anywhere near.
bamalama
don't do that
She's called jack,has suspiciously expensive and tasteless,hipsteryish tattoo sleeves,she's well dictioned ,has nice big teeth,a nice kitchen with mirrored tiles,and i immediately thought networked media type soon as i saw her ...that's good enough for me
'Social isolation' and 'rock bottom' are themselves completely subjective experiences.
Victor Frankl used to say 'misery has it's own level'. He meant that someone struggling to survive one more day in Auschwitz and a posh teenager who thinks she is 'fat' cos she gained two pound can have an equal (and very real) sense of misery. And Frankl had tha history to be able to say these things with a little authority.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
It does get a bit silly. As long as what she writes is as honest an account as she can give of what she went through, that's good enough for me.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
I'm reminded of Primo Levi. Sorry to go all Godwin's, but those who saw the worst of Auschwitz never came back to tell their story. That doesn't invalidate Levi's story, though.
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
I think it's just all gone stupid tbh.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
and people can end up killing themselves because they think they're fat and starving themselves to death.
im a bit uncomfortable trying to "compare" the two things tho.
fuck seals
Well-Known Member
it's bizarre. none of us can comment with our privileged access to u75/ internet. and our mice. and our keyboards. and our teeth.
Thora
Differently Ethical
I don't think so either. She was in a position lots of people find themselves in (yes, some single mothers on benefits went to school! Some even went to university!), she wrote a blog, and now she has had some minor success - I don't begrudge her that.
bamalama
don't do that
I'm not dismissing the messenger liam i'm calling her a fraud,and a message from a fraud is going to be totally ignored by the target audience.Maybe i've got this wrong ,but you seem to be saying that this womans attitude offers us an example of the way forward.Well that's dead on if you're her,not if your wee pipers workmate or the millions of other people who don't have her contacts/education/social capital.But more importantly than all these ,access to money to give her the breathin space to ponce about preaching to people who want,need more,not the ability to live on less,it's not a fuckin game for some of us,it's a way of life
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Yep. Comparing Jack to Oliver is ridiculous.
Thora
Differently Ethical
In what way a fraud? Has she presented herself as something she is not?
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
She's not some poverty tourist from what I can gather. She experienced the nightmare that is housing benefit gone wrong, which is something I can relate to, and even with last resort options to go to, that's bloody horrible.
No. Or maybe yeah, thinking about it - Though I dunno where the toothless came from. But yeah, I would take someone's opinion of poverty who's lived on the streets & had to do things they'd rather not do just to get by a bit more seriously than some dickhead recipe blogger. All I was saying originally though, is that Jack hasn't come close to rock B. Which she hasn't. Is anyone going to seriously state the case that she has?
sleaterkinney
Well-Known Member
Check your internet privilege!
Really?
That is possibly the biggest load of shite you have ever posted - which is saying something. You can't really comment with autority on Auschwitz unless you were actually murdered there? Fuck me, The Life of Brian would not get a look in.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
I agree with you that she hasn't. But that doesn't mean that what she has to say about the place she did sink to is invalid or not worth saying.
My only proviso is to say 'as long as she acknowledges this', but from what I've read, she kind of does. She is trying to steer the debate away from Oliver's moralising.
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