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Why the Green Party is shit

Gross but unsurprising. Loads of m/c liberals in Labour wanted their party to do the same.
 
and every time its that mantra 'We must stop the tories!'

you hear it from lib dems and labourites as well. As if thats the be all and end all to politics and you forget our records in power and look at the bad man over there.
 
Not just standing aside but actually working to get the LibDems elected
The Greens’ sole MP, Caroline Lucas, joined the Liberal Democrats on the campaign trail in Richmond on Saturday, where she revealed she would vote against the triggering of article 50, saying she cannot “throw the country into the potential nightmare of a hard Brexit within two years”.

She said: “A regressive alliance of the Tories and Ukip are working together to reinstall a pro-Brexit MP. We have stepped up at this unique moment and are backing Sarah Olney as the best hope of denting the government’s plans for a painful Brexit from the European Union.”
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Nevermind the bedroom tax, the huge increase on tuition fees, the VAT increase and shifting of the tax burden onto the poor, the privatisation of the Royal Mail, what really matters is the EU.
 
Green party membership card is plastic and looks a looks a lot harder to recycle than the cardboard tory ones - though equally surprisingly probably better for chopping up coke.



(I own neither)
 
killer b said:
I shouldn't worry, no-one's listening. They've been polling under 10% with no significant movement for two years now.
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They made some pretty big inroads at the Witney by-election though, and they must be hedging their bets on winning over Labour votes should Labour totally lose the plot under Corbyn/be torn asunder by bitter infighting (but then, such erstwhile Labour voters are just as likely to go to UKIP).
 
They'll always be able to get enough suckers in by-elections in seats where Labour Can't Win Here! to get a respecatble number in, but it's just the corpse twitching. That's all they've got now.
 
This Richmond thing and the whole progressive alliance concept is causing some internal Green Party ructions.

My take on it is that while I can see the logic to it if there were a proper alliance going on between Labour, Lib Dem and Green's to ensure the Tories lost every byelection this term, this is nothing of the sort at the moment, it's just the Greens unilaterally standing aside apparently to allow the Lib Dems a free run at Goldsmith, but while Labour are still standing and the Lib Dems AFAIK haven't passed any motions or done anything that would prevent their leadership from deciding to prop up the tories again anyway even if we did get them down to a minority government situation.

Frankly, the E&W Green Party is a tattered mess at the moment, with no concept of how to go about winning any parliamentary seats, no money and no motivation, and a good proportion of the party in open revolt about this alliance thing.

I've given up doing owt for the time being as it seems to be a complete waste of time unless they find a clue somewhere soon.
 
killer b said:
They'll always be able to get enough suckers in by-elections in seats where Labour Can't Win Here! to get a respecatble number in, but it's just the corpse twitching. That's all they've got now.
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I'm not so sure. I think there is a role for them as the nice Tories or the anti Tories in wealthy seats at certain times, as they once were. Having been in government with them is not only not a negative, it's positive for these people. And that will carry over into a general election if that element of the electorate decide they're bored of the Tories.
 
free spirit said:
This Richmond thing and the whole progressive alliance concept is causing some internal Green Party ructions.

My take on it is that while I can see the logic to it if there were a proper alliance going on between Labour, Lib Dem and Green's to ensure the Tories lost every byelection this term, this is nothing of the sort at the moment, it's just the Greens unilaterally standing aside apparently to allow the Lib Dems a free run at Goldsmith, but while Labour are still standing and the Lib Dems AFAIK haven't passed any motions or done anything that would prevent their leadership from deciding to prop up the tories again anyway even if we did get them down to a minority government situation.

Frankly, the E&W Green Party is a tattered mess at the moment, with no concept of how to go about winning any parliamentary seats, no money and no motivation, and a good proportion of the party in open revolt about this alliance thing.

I've given up doing owt for the time being as it seems to be a complete waste of time unless they find a clue somewhere soon.
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Yeah my Green Party mate is very unhappy with the Greens at the moment, theres a lot of idiocy going about and tales of this progressive alliance are just fucking annoying. If nothing else the only people who benefit are the big parties.

But fwiw I think standing aside in Richmond was the right thing to do, Zac needed to fucking go and its not like the Greens could have put in a decent showing there anyway.
 
Dom Traynor said:
I'm not so sure. I think there is a role for them as the nice Tories or the anti Tories in wealthy seats at certain times, as they once were. Having been in government with them is not only not a negative, it's positive for these people. And that will carry over into a general election if that element of the electorate decide they're bored of the Tories.
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Slightly more suckers then. We'll see I guess.
 
Artaxerxes said:
Yeah my Green Party mate is very unhappy with the Greens at the moment, theres a lot of idiocy going about and tales of this progressive alliance are just fucking annoying. If nothing else the only people who benefit are the big parties.

But fwiw I think standing aside in Richmond was the right thing to do, Zac needed to fucking go and its not like the Greens could have put in a decent showing there anyway.
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There is not much of a chance for a decent showing for the Greens in more than about 10 - 20 areas depending on your definition of decent. Should they stand aside for all of them? A party that cannot stand in most seats is not a party worth voting for even where they do stand. I wouldn't vote Green anyway so it doesn't matter to me, but if I was a Green supporter I'd be quite concerned by this approach.
 
Dom Traynor said:
There is not much of a chance for a decent showing for the Greens in more than about 10 - 20 areas depending on your definition of decent. Should they stand aside for all of them? A party that cannot stand in most seats is not a party worth voting for even where they do stand. I wouldn't vote Green anyway so it doesn't matter to me, but if I was a Green supporter I'd be quite concerned by this approach.
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As long as its not a habit the odd one is fine, the danger is that Ms Lucas makes it one and yes that is concerning.

The Greens are not exactly known for clear thinking sadly, I agree with many of the policies but there is a very dominant arty farty idiocy wing in it.
 
killer b said:
Slightly more suckers then. We'll see I guess.
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Why are they suckers? The Libdems offer what they want, Tory with a smiley Cameroonian face. These people will never vote Labour or support socialist revolution, if the Libdems didn't exist they would probably vote Tory with a heavy heart.
 
Dom Traynor said:
Why are they suckers? The Libdems offer what they want, Tory with a smiley Cameroonian face. These people will never vote Labour or support socialist revolution, if the Libdems didn't exist they would probably vote Tory with a heavy heart.
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Their whole strategy is to get over the line with labour voters who know labour can't win in that seat. Those are the suckers we're talking about aren't they?
 
killer b said:
Their whole strategy is to get over the line with labour voters who know labour can't win in that seat. Those are the suckers we're talking about aren't they?
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That might be one strategy however I don't believe they will win over Labour voters as such, maybe, and I'd be interested to see how many Labour voters even in Richmond voted Libdem as opposed to staying at home. That's not to say there are not a section of voters who swing between all three or five main parties, who probably did this time vote Libdem, maybe they're the suckers.

Edited to say - just looked at results back to 2005 and I think there are clearly a large number of people swapping between Libdems and Tories, the Labour vote is basically erratic and marginal.
 
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The Green Party was offered a £250,000 inducement not to stand a candidate against the LibDems in Richmond, according to the chairman of the local Greens. Ryan Coley, the Kingston Green Party chair, claims his members were pressured by party officials not to run a candidate because the party had been offered £250,000 conditional on standing aside for the LibDems.

Guido has obtained an internal report written by the local chairman and members Clare Keogh and Kieron Merrett. They complain “party staff added pressure” on them, “telling us that there was an offer of a large donation to the party which was conditional on the party demonstrating its desire for a progressive alliance”. They allege the offer amounted to £250,000 and the order to stand aside came “on the instruction of the Chief Executive“.

The report says the offer failed the party’s donation scrutiny procedures and the donation did not go through.


Green Party 'Offered £250,000 Bung Not to Stand in Richmond' - Guido Fawkes
 
hot air baboon said:
The Green Party was offered a £250,000 inducement not to stand a candidate against the LibDems in Richmond, according to the chairman of the local Greens. Ryan Coley, the Kingston Green Party chair, claims his members were pressured by party officials not to run a candidate because the party had been offered £250,000 conditional on standing aside for the LibDems.

Guido has obtained an internal report written by the local chairman and members Clare Keogh and Kieron Merrett. They complain “party staff added pressure” on them, “telling us that there was an offer of a large donation to the party which was conditional on the party demonstrating its desire for a progressive alliance”. They allege the offer amounted to £250,000 and the order to stand aside came “on the instruction of the Chief Executive“.

Green Party 'Offered £250,000 Bung Not to Stand in Richmond' - Guido Fawkes
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Has Oakeshott written all over it.
 
A party insider I know (and trust) says everyone's really pissed off because not only had they taken the decision to step aside before the donation was offered, it was also turned down by the oversight people. So the party ended up with a needless PR mess and didn't even get any money. The big problem atm is roughly what you'd expect, political drift and infighting in the face of getting outflanked to their left by Labour.
 
The Greens have always had their 'kooky' elements, but now the majority of people who were in the Greens went to Labour when Corbyn became leader, those kooky elements are now more concentrated, and the party now seems to be struggling to have any purpose now Labour are proposing all the things that initially won people over to the Greens, but with the added advantage of being the official opposition party to the government.
 
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