What Now for the BNP?

[malatesta32]

you cannot take away the fact that the SWP organised the squads who were a crucial development in militant antifascism and reversed fascist street presence. the subsequent activity by the SWP CC is more than adequately covered in BTF book. disgraceful. the SWP then and during miners strike contained some serious growlers several who ended up in red action. as someone pointed out SWP were the chuck a brick party [?] and their militancy was a great part of their attraction. however, the SWSS and UAF are hardly militant and personally, i am embarassed by the 'nartzi scum - off our streets!' chant.

 

[malatesta32]

Last time I looked espousing the idea that ignoring extreme, Islamic fundamentalists was tantamount to shooting oneself in the foot. It's more than likely the UAF was in mind when this was put. I'm pretty certain that Muslims don't need any condescending trite from a member/supporter of a recruiting front for the SWP.

the commonly held beilief by the EDL is that antifascists are there to 'protect' muslims rather than being there to respond to fascist provocation. i get the feeling that even they dont believe their own criticism of UAF etc as 'pedo supporters' at court demos (a PR blunder by the way). antifascism is activity against fascism not patronising and misguided social work. i dunno about you, but non local fascists marching thru my town is provocation.

 

[malatesta32]

Certainly not true of the SWP in the 70s around ANL Mark 1. And whilst I have very little time for the SWPs present politics who do you think is at the front at anti EDL/BNP demos these days ?

steps, the UAF are at the front of many demos as a counter presence but in my experience there are always plenty of antifascists outside the kettle and police lines. enough now, massive caffeine rush over.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Certainly not true of the SWP in the 70s around ANL Mark 1. And whilst I have very little time for the SWPs present politics who do you think is at the front at anti EDL/BNP demos these days ?

Whoever UAF find to crouch behind.

 

[The39thStep]

steps, the UAF are at the front of many demos as a counter presence but in my experience there are always plenty of antifascists outside the kettle and police lines. enough now, massive caffeine rush over.

I would accept that . No matter how much I might disagree with UAFs tactics my experience is that their supporters do turn up and are often at the front. For what purpose and to what avail is a debating point but I don't go along with VPs position .

 

[The39thStep]

you cannot take away the fact that the SWP organised the squads who were a crucial development in militant antifascism and reversed fascist street presence. the subsequent activity by the SWP CC is more than adequately covered in BTF book. disgraceful. the SWP then and during miners strike contained some serious growlers several who ended up in red action. as someone pointed out SWP were the chuck a brick party [?] and their militancy was a great part of their attraction. however, the SWSS and UAF are hardly militant and personally, i am embarassed by the 'nartzi scum - off our streets!' chant.

That someone was me when we met up.

 

[malatesta32]

That someone was me when we met up.

oops! http://www.koolbadges.co.uk/images/thumbnails/eejit-200x200.jpg

 

[audiotech]

i dunno about you, but non local fascists marching thru my town is provocation.

Absolutely, but organisations opposing need to look seriously at the required response to the provocation and what that provocation entails. Some provocation is calculated to get a reaction to benefit those doing the provocation. The NF and the BNP have a long history of organising "stunts" to which they hope to benefit from. It's one part of their development phase, as is lying through their teeth.

 

[malatesta32]

yes, im advocating an approrpiate and considered response - 'whatever it takes' - as there is propaganda, meetings, building in communities and with other orgs etc and do not see militancy as the only strategy or indeed for everyone (i dont expect my wee sis in SP to physically confront ANYONE!). the EDL stuff is mainly provocative as it is going into places with large asian presence to cause trouble. of course, it is also an afront to antifascists who oppose the EDL for other reasons as well. NF and BNP have been pretty much ignored by much media so have started up again on things like the charlene campaign, hijacking the 'grooming' issue and occupying rochdale town hall (tierney at the weekend). eejits!

 

[Joe Reilly]

UAF work with plod and willingly get penned in at times. although it is possible to argue against their tactics im glad theyre there. the fash just see everyone as against them and it demoralises them.

There is zero evidence to support the assertion that superior numbers alone demoralise fascists. Indeed if superior numbers are not properly deployed it just adds to the fascist sense of toxic importance - and for the young recruits in particular of being part of a defiant elite: 'the few'.

 

[The39thStep]

There is zero evidence to support the assertion that superior numbers alone demoralise fascists. Indeed if superior numbers are not properly deployed it just adds to the fascist sense of toxic importance - and for the young recruits in particular of being part of a defiant elite: 'the few'.

As the Martin Webster lone demo showed. I can remember big turn outs in Islington, Wood Green and elsewhere against the NF with no effect on them at all, it was only after Lewisham did the NF at my work place start looking after their backs and less like the master race.

 

[Joe Reilly]

NF and BNP have been pretty much ignored by much media so have started up again on things like the charlene campaign, hijacking the 'grooming' issue...

It was in fact the BNP who were one of the first, along with possibly Anne Cryer, to draw attention to the grooming issue, at a time when the entire liberal left, media included, turned a blind eye: ' We see no groomers...' 'It's just the tabloids' etc

So the idea that they are now 'hi-jacking' a campaign which was their initative to begin with, dosen't wash.

 

[audiotech]

'The television coverage of England's Euro exit last night has been used to define Marxism, by a team of top intellectuals and respected social commentators...'​

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https://p.twimg.com/AwL481ZCIAAYHcn.png​

 

[bignose1]

It was in fact the BNP who were one of the first, along with possibly Anne Cryer, to draw attention to the grooming issue, at a time when the entire liberal left, media included, turned a blind eye: ' We see no groomers...' 'It's just the tabloids' etc

So the idea that they are now 'hi-jacking' a campaign which was their initative to begin with, dosen't wash.

Just the tip Gary.....Ok Nick..

 

[malatesta32]

It was in fact the BNP who were one of the first, along with possibly Anne Cryer, to draw attention to the grooming issue, at a time when the entire liberal left, media included, turned a blind eye: ' We see no groomers...' 'It's just the tabloids' etc

So the idea that they are now 'hi-jacking' a campaign which was their initative to begin with, dosen't wash.

the bnp may have started it but the casuals had reinvigorated the charlene campaign in blackpool as 1 of their little crusades and it was only after a year or so and some press coverage that nick griffin turned up there to capitalise on it. the casuals are fuming about this as it is the only thing they have achieved.

 

[malatesta32]

There is zero evidence to support the assertion that superior numbers alone demoralise fascists. Indeed if superior numbers are not properly deployed it just adds to the fascist sense of toxic importance - and for the young recruits in particular of being part of a defiant elite: 'the few'.

i havent said its simply about numbers but that it's also about propaganda/media coverage and local community organisation. at the moment the EDL are the focus of antifascists and the EDL view things in terms of 'taking liberties' and 'numbers.' when the UAF and antifascists turn up in numbers the EDL go into denial mode and underplay it. when there isnt a large number of opposition they see it as a 'victory.' look at the liverpool court case and their crowing there. you only have to look at the screenshots from EDL newsxtra etc to see their soccer mentality and how they view things - 'we can have you lot anytime' 'let's meet up, you and me' etc. im talking about footsoldiers not party leaders here.

 

[malatesta32]

'The television coverage of England's Euro exit last night has been used to define Marxism, by a team of top intellectuals and respected social commentators...'​

​

https://p.twimg.com/AwL481ZCIAAYHcn.png​

right, that's that sorted! i can bin me eagleton and williams books now! phew! soccer saves the day!

 

[butchersapron]

ta badgers and butchers! thought i was losing me touch!

Changed his plea to guilty to a lesser charge. Now adjourned for sentencing till august. Not a massive story or anything, just happened to notice it.

 

[malatesta32]

yeah i clocked it before. its just another embarassment for the 'law and order' party, like the recent kiddie porn bnp members and the recent ... etc

 

[The39thStep]

Even the Church is in the act now http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jul/07/church-of-england-vote-bnp

 

[claphamboy]

Even the Church is in the act now http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jul/07/church-of-england-vote-bnp

That's an unfortunate URL address.

 

[The39thStep]

That's an unfortunate URL address.

If the BNP have got any sense they would use it

 

[audiotech]

By Election Result:Kingston Council, Grove Ward.​

Moll:Liberal Democrats 710​

Amer:Conservative Party 687​

South:Labour 440​

Coley:Green Party 123​

Watson:UKIP 56​

Child:BNP 23 (1.1%)​

Rudd:Christian Peoples Alliance 20​

http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/blog/article/2019/bnp-crash-in-kingston​

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

I'm more concerned about the Libdem result

 

[The39thStep]

I'm more concerned about the Libdem result

Kingston isn't BNP material anyway

 

[ItWillNeverWork]

By Election Result:Kingston Council, Grove Ward.​

Moll:Liberal Democrats 710​

Amer:Conservative Party 687​

Jesus Christ. What sort of dickheads live in Kingston?

 

[Joe Reilly]

Jesus Christ. What sort of dickheads live in Kingston?

Wealthy ones?

 

[audiotech]

Kingston isn't BNP material anyway

In that case a pointless exercise to stand a candidate there, chuck £500 in a lost deposit + cost of election material and in the process further alienate the dwindling number of BNP members.

 

[butchersapron]

In that case a pointless exercise to stand a candidate there, chuck £500 in a lost deposit + cost of election material and in the process further alienate the dwindling number of BNP members.

No deposits for local elections.

 

[audiotech]

Ah, Griffin trying to keep the BNP brand out there by any means necessary then.